Posted on 04/05/2005 6:22:36 AM PDT by Dan from Michigan
21% of fatal dog bites are pitbulls according to one statistic. That's 60 pitbull attacks in 20 years, or 3 a year. Out of MILLIONS of dogs. Over 20 years, it's out of MILLIONS OF PITBULLS to be sure.
There are approximately 117 accidental gun deaths a year (last FBI figues I saw), out of millions of gunowners. I consider that a pretty potent figure. Why are people accidentally getting shot? Irresponsibility. It would take 10 years of fatal dog attack statistics to reach that number, and even longer for 117 attacks to be committed by pitbulls.
Same can be said of dog attacks. I see a perfect parallel. I can assure everyone that my gun will never be used in an accidental death...and neither will my dog ever be the cause of a fatal attack. 100% guarantee. But I'd have to offer only a 99.9% guarantee on everyone else, given the numbers.
The ignorance and witch hunting surrounding APBTs will probably never go away, it's obvious just from reading this thread. I just read one up there from somebody who would "take out" my dog if I moved into his neighborhood.
Did that, he didn't care. So who was the one being childish? And what am I supposed to say, "don't let this happen again, or..." what? If I take the dog out, I quite possibly go to jail. I try to be a law abiding citizen, and do not want to abandon my family for jail time.
That is the way the legal system in this country works.
I tried to contact the local authorities, but I had no course of action as long as the dog did no harm. So, I guess that I'm supposed to wait until it rips my daughter's throat out, huh? I guess the jerk had his rights.
Life is stressful - get over it.
Stress is not my problem, I deal with it all of the time. Idiot dog owners do not have the right to willingly cause my stress. So tell me, oh wise one, what was I to do in this situation?
Modify your fence to go into the ground. Then warn the neighbor that if his dog comes into your yard you will be forced to shoot it for the safety of your children. If the threat of it doesn't work at least you will be on the record for warning him, trying to be polite, and being the bigger person, not to mention already contacting authorities who were unwilling to help. The next step you take if he continues to allow his dog to dig into your yard is to take him to court for trespass, and possible intentional infliction of emotional distress (although you wouldn't win on IIOED). If he fails to show up in court, and still allows his dog to dig into your yard - one day let it come through - a place something poison that the dog will eat in your yard. If the dog eats it go to your neighbor's house and tell him "look, I had this - insert item here - in my yard and you once again let your dog dig his way over, and now he is likley going to die if you don't get him attention soon." This way you will look like the good guy once again in that you will save him from his own irresponsibility. Sometimes neighbors are a pain in the ass, and sometimes only extreme measures will work, but believe me if it isn't the dog this person will just do something else.
That said, I still agree with you..
It's not the dog, it's the owner and environment, the training, etc..
Dogs are gregarious animals.. they bond with their families and owners.. become part of the pack.. find their place in the social structure..
A well treated dog, properly trained, is a benefit, not a liability, or a threat..
If one wants to categorize dogs by their breed, then Irish wolfhounds and Afghans ( trained to hunt lions ) should be at the top of the dangerous list..
Where are the "hunting" dogs?? Where are the "war" dogs??
I haven't seen a mention of Dobermans in this entire thread, but it hasn't been that long ago the dobie was considered "the most dangerous dog in america".. vicious and bloodthirsty..
Many have found that dobermans are beautiful, loving animals when raised properly..
Ignore these people if you can..
It's not "PC" to hate people any more, they have just transferred their inadequacy to dogs..
And why should I have to go to these measures because of a freakin' dog? That is completely insane.
And, fwiw, I would completely agree with your statements in the case of annoyances, such as barking, etc. But the life of my family trumps all of the dog owner's rights in my book. The though of 5/8" of cedar boards seperating the 120 lb beast from a 3 year old girl is simply chilling. And I should have the right to let my daughter play in my yard without having the beast trying to break through the damn fence.
Anyway, luckily the lady who owned the house kicked him (the boyfriend) out before I had to do anything drastic.
Tha analogy hinges on responsible ownership
I don't think you understand. You aren't going to these measures for a dog. The dog in the situation is not your problem. Your neighbor is your problem. If all dogs on the face of the earth were banned this a**hole would just have something else that was dangerous or intrusive to your lifestyle. This is just like the 16 year old boys in neighborhoods who drive cars (that look like wannabe fast and furious cars) at 65 mph in residential neghborhoods. The problem isn't the car - it is the person driving it. The dog here doesn't know he is doing anything wrong. He is probably bored out of his mind because his master neglects him - so he keeps himself occupied by trying to escape. The dog in this situation likley isn't even dangerous. I say that will a qualifier in that if the dog fells threatened this all goes out the window, and likley the dog will become dangerous. Your neighbor is the problem - clearly demonstrated by the fact that he could care less his dog is digging into your yard, and you have small children. The person sounds like a complete idiot - sometimes extreme measures are needed to deal with idiots, or sometimes you have to move. I know this sucks, but sometimes life sucks.
Seriously rat, should pit bull owners be required to show they have the ability to handle such a dog?
I'm not for more laws in most cases but is this the answer or is it business as ususal?
Have your lawyer advise them ALL that you will file suit and list the city as "correspondent" in any matter of damage or injury that ensues from that point on..
Get a restraining order..
Then load your gun, take it to the range, and practice, practice, practice..
You have the right to protect yourself and your family, and depending on the state, your property..
If the dog comes through the fence, KILL IT..
The Australian Shepherds are natural and versatile herding dogs - anything from ducks to cattle (and children). They are extremely intelligent [learned "roll over" in 10 minutes] and obedient and have a fantastic disposition. I and my wife considered every breed of dog available as a possible successor to our last aussie and finally decided nothing could top it, so we got another aussie.
Point taken.
And, you state The dog in this situation likley isn't even dangerous. I really think you may be a little dillusional.
As will both my Buster, and my Diamond.
You pretty much described what I as in the process of doing when he moved. You should have been privy to all of the plans that I had hatched to legally dispense of the dog. And yes, I use the term "legally" pretty loosely. I really don't care, because when it comes to choosing between my family and a dog, the dog will always end up dead. And true, the jerk would have most likely tried it again, but "accidents" can come in pairs...
The truth is, you'll have a difficult time finding stories of that ilk because they aren't "news worthy". Example: a "Pit Bull" attack reported in San Diego Ca. was actually an attack by a Black Lab. The "Pit Bull" attach in San Francisco was actually a Dogo Argintino. Several other stories like this happen on a regular basis. When the breed is unknown in a dog attack you can bet good money that it will be blamed on a Pit Bull.
I really don't know because I haven't saw the dog - so I guess I really can't speak on it. However, I have been around similar dogs that appear to be very mean (barking and griwling visciously), and reoeatedly try and escape, but then when they are out and dealt with properly they are fine. That is not to say that they do not have the capability pf being dangerous. I am also not saying to ignore anything. Problem dogs should be dealt with, but to be a problem dog you have to cause a problem. Here, the dog did cause a problem - and should have been dealt with. If the dog would have gotten out of the neighbors yard another good way to deal with it would be to catch it and then surrender it to the humane society or dog warden as a stray. It is likely that the owner didn't have a license to own the dog and would either not get it back or have to pay to get it back. This happening enough time will put the owner in his place. Banning dogs is not the answer is all that I am saying.
Division of Unintentional Injury Prevention, Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, Atlanta, GA 30341, USA.
OBJECTIVES. To update data on fatal dog bites and see if past trends have continued.
DESIGN. To merge data from vital records, the Humane Society of the United States, and searches of electronic news files.
SETTING: United States.
SUBJECTS. U.S. residents dying in the U.S. from 1989 through 1994 from dog bites.
RESULTS. We identified 109 dog bite-related fatalities, of which 57% were less than 10 years of age.
The death rate for neonates was two orders of magnitude higher than for adults and the rate for children one order of magnitude higher.
Of classifiable deaths, 22% involved an unrestrained dog off the owner's property, 18% involved a restrained dog on the owner's property, and 59% involved an unrestrained dog on the owner's property.
Eleven attacks involved a sleeping infant; 19 dogs involved in fatal attacks had a prior history of aggression; and 19 of 20 classifiable deaths involved an unneutered dog.
Pit bulls, the most commonly reported breed, were involved in 24 deaths; the next most commonly reported breeds were rottweilers (16) and German shepherds (10).
CONCLUSIONS. The dog bite problem should be reconceptualized as a largely preventable epidemic.
Breed-specific approaches to the control of dog bites do not address the issue that many breeds are involved in the problem and that most of the factors contributing to dog bites are related to the level of responsibility exercised by dog owners.
To prevent dog bite-related deaths and injuries, we recommend public education about responsible dog ownership and dog bite prevention, stronger animal control laws, better resources for enforcement of these laws, and better reporting of bites. Anticipatory guidance by pediatric health care providers should address dog bite prevention.
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