Schiavo's brother seeks to educate at campus rally

The Gainesville Sun ^ | February 22. 2005 | DIANE CHUN

[nickcarraway]

A group of about a dozen students and activists wearing "Save Terri Schiavo" T-shirts stood outside the Reitz Union on the University of Florida campus at noon Monday.

As students hustled past on their way to lunch, the demonstrators asked passersby to sign a petition calling on Circuit Court Judge George W. Greer to step down from the case that has been fought in the courts for nearly eight years.

Schiavo, now 41, suffered severe brain damage 15 years ago. She resides in a Pinellas Park hospice. Her husband, who has testified that his wife would not want to be kept alive artificially, has asked that her feeding tube be removed.

That order could come from the 2nd District Court of Appeal as early as 1 p.m. today.

Schiavo's brother, 40-year-old Bobby Schindler, was in Gainesville for the rally. Schindler argued that a dozen doctors who have voluntarily looked into his sister's case believe that she could be helped, that with intensive therapy, she could be taught to speak and eat on her own again.

"We are trying to educate people as to the facts of this case," Schindler said. "Nobody knows the facts, because they aren't being reported to the public."

Some doctors have ruled that Schiavo is in a persistent vegetative state with no hope for recovery. Others have said she still has some mental capabilities. She left no written directive for her family or her husband to follow.

Brother Paul O'Donnell of the Franciscan Brothers of Peace of the Archdiocese of St. Paul and Minneapolis was among the speakers at Monday's rally.

The black-robed Franciscan brother said the eyes of the nation are on Florida, and the decision in the Schiavo case which could come today.

If the court rules that Schiavo's feeding tube must be removed so that she can die, O'Donnell said it would launch "a tsunami of euthanasia."

Schiavo is not in a coma, and she is not brain dead, he insisted.

"She is a disabled, brain-injured woman who uses a plastic tube to eat instead of a knife and fork," O'Donnell said.

"If Florida kills Terri Schiavo, there are hundreds of thousands of residents in nursing homes in this state who need a nurse's aide to feed them, or are dependent upon feeding tubes, who could find themselves in the same position. It would be the start of a tsunami of euthanasia."

The Schiavo case has drawn international attention and rallied right-to-life and religious forces worldwide.

Matthew Irwin heads the student group Gators for Terri, which sponsored the rally. Irwin said he hoped to send a message to Judge Greer, who is a graduate of UF's Levin College of Law, that not everyone supports the position of the court.

"We believe that Terri has the right to live," Irwin said.

[cyn]

"May the Lord greatly bless his efforts and grant the desire of his heart ..." -- Amen.

Thanks for posting and pinging, nick.

[nosofar]

How can that husband of hers even show his face in public?

It's easy when you don't have a conscience.

[Ohioan from Florida]

Terri ping! If anyone would like to be added to or removed from my Terri ping list, please let me know by FReepmail!

[MarMema]

You go, Bobby!

[supercat]

as for the "right"-to-die idea, its not really a right. Its a liberty, which DOES NOT need to be enumerated in the bill of rights, or any other law for that matter, for it to exist. It is truly beyond me how people who claim to share conservative values can question this liberty. How can these "conservatives" say the government should not allow this? aren't we supposed to be opposed to these blatant violations of our freedoms?

The issue here isn't that Terri shouldn't be "allowed to die" if she in fact did wish to be fatally dehydrated (you'd probably find Terri supporters divided on that issue), but the fact is that Michael Schiavo has shown by his own undisputable words and actions that he is not an honest husband. It would have been extremely unusual for anyone in 1991 to express a desire to be starved and dehydrated if they were incapacitated. Michael has taken Terri's statements about not wanting to live on a ventilator to mean that, and Judge Greer is willing to declare that "clear and compelling evidence", but no reasonable person examining the facts of the case would reach that conclusion.

Further, it's unclear how a man who talks on national television about indelicate details of his wife's gynecological exams could be so concerned about "her privacy" as to ban cameras and tape recorders from her room on that basis.

On the other hand, if Terri is much more active and able than has been let on, that would seem a pretty clear reason for Michael to impose such a ban.

Why would you think he imposed the ban?

[eeevil conservative]

The shame is that the bar for showing evidence on why she should be starved to death or that she would WANT to starve to death is in the gutter and the bar for showing evidence that she deserves therapy to see if she CAN recover is to the roof!

Not to mention that when the family does have decent evidence that HARMS the hubby's case- The JUDGE- the one supposed to be ensuring that TRUTH is sought- SEALS that evidence!

THAT's the SHAME!

My 2 cents

[Regulator]

he told me once, when he was i believe 50 years old, that if he needed to have another surgery, he wouldn't do it. it woudn't be worth it. This obviously broke my heart, but i realized it was his decision. it was his life, his pain that he had to live with

And the fact that it was him making that decision and he who would communicate that to his doctor makes all the difference in the world.

In Schiavo's case, we have the word of one man only, years after the fact to that effect. And this is not just a disinterested party: he stands to benefit in many ways if he gets his wishes. And his former wife's benefit? She gets to be starved to death.

If there was even a hint of a question as to what her true wishes were, wouldn't you think it the better part of valor to err on the side of her life being preserved?

[eeevil conservative]

well, I am in the process of straightening out FOX on the facts RIGHT NOW

They have actually been very interested...

They are showing a lot of courage in even looking into it...

[BykrBayb]

I find it very arrogant for anyone to take such an extreme view on this woman's right to die or right to live without knowing any of these people personally.

You are so right! There are people on both sides who don't know Terri personally. Flaglady47 is a perfect example of an extremist who doesn't know Terri, and doesn't care about her. The people who know her best, support her right to live.

There are many documents available online to support Terri's right to live. Since I signed up here, I've repeatedly put out requests for documents that would support killing her. I rarely get a response, and when I do, the best anyone can offer is their own opinion, or links to other people's opinions. Since Freepers typically know the difference between opinion and documented fact, I've concluded that there are no documents to support killing Terri. However, I'm still open to reviewing them objectively, if anyone can provide them.

If anyone knows of any documents that support killing Terri, please contact me.

[BykrBayb]

Jonlane, I came here believing in each person's right to decide for themselves how much or how little intervention and assistance they are willing to accept in the preservation of their own life. I still believe in those rights, even after the test those beliefs have been put to.

This is not about Terri's right to die a natural death without intervention or assistance. This is about her estranged husband's right, judges' rights, and unethical doctors' rights, to torture a disabled woman to death against her will.

[Drango]

>I thought the polls were around 75% in her favor.

I'm a conservative that believes Terri should be allowed to go to a better place. The poll below shows a majority of Americans and conservatives believe Terri's end of life should not be decided by the court, state or church.

And yes, I know the poll described her as in "persistent vegetative state".

http://www.foxnews.com/printer_friendly_story/0,3566,101826,00.html ....................................................

Majority Would Remove Schiavo's Feeding Tube

Friday, June 18, 2004

By Dana Blanton

Three times as many Americans think Terri Schiavo's feeding tube should be removed as think it should remain and — if in her place — most Americans say they would prefer the tube be removed.

When asked to consider what action they would take if they were Schiavo's guardian, a 61 percent majority says they would remove her feeding tube and 22 percent would keep the tube inserted, according to the latest FOX News national poll conducted by Opinion Dynamics Corporation.

Terri Schiavo (search ) is the Florida woman who has been in a "persistent vegetative state" since 1990. Schiavo's husband, who believes his wife would rather die than be kept alive artificially, is currently in a heated legal battle against her parents. Terri's parents believe she could still recover and want the feeding tube to remain. After Schiavo's feeding tube had been removed for several days, it was recently re-inserted by an order from Florida Gov. Jeb Bush.

"It seems clear that if the governor and the Florida Legislature passed the law and ordered the tube replaced for political motives, as some of their critics have charged, then they miscalculated the politics," comments Opinion Dynamics President John Gorman (search ). "On every important point of the dispute, the public agrees with Mr. Schiavo and the courts that have ruled on this matter."

Majorities of young Americans and seniors, men and women would remove the feeding tube in Schiavo's case and would want it removed if they were in a similar circumstance. Self-described conservatives are less likely than liberals to support removing Schiavo's feeding tube, but still a majority of conservatives supports removal (56 percent to 70 percent among liberals).

Half of Americans believe the spouse should be the decision maker in right-to-die cases, while just under a third say the parents or other family members should be the ones to decide. Hardly any think the decision should be left to the government (two percent) or to the patient's doctor (four percent).

Polling was conducted by telephone October 28-29, 2003 in the evenings. The sample is 900 registered voters nationwide with a margin of error of ±3 percentage points.  

1. If a patient has been in what doctors call a “persistent vegetative” or a coma-like state with no higher brain activity for a significant amount of time, who do you think should make the decision whether the patient should be kept alive or not?

1. The person’s parents or other family members	31%
2. The person’s spouse	50
3. The government	2
4. (The person’s doctor)	4
5. (Not sure)	13

2. Terri Schiavo has been in a so-called “persistent vegetative state” since 1990. Her eyes sometimes open, but doctors say she has no consciousness. Terri’s husband says his wife would rather die than be kept alive artificially and wants her feeding tube removed. Terri’s parents believe she could still recover and want the feeding tube to remain. If you were Terri’s guardian, what would you do?
SCALE: 1. Would you remove the feeding tube 2. Or would you keep the feeding tube inserted? 3. (Not sure)

	Remove	Keep	(NS)
TOTAL ANSWER	61%	22	17
Female	62%	20	18
Male	60%	25	15
Age 18-34	64%	25	11
35-50	57%	26	17
51-59	66%	17	17
60-70	67%	18	15
Over 70	60%	17	22
Democrat	68%	20	13
Republican	56%	26	17
Independent	58%	19	23
Liberal	70%	18	13
Moderate	61%	24	15
Conservative	56%	26	18

3. If you were in Terri Schiavo’s place, what would you want your guardian to do? Would you have your guardian:

1. Remove the feeding tube or	74%
2. Keep the feeding tube inserted?	16
3. (Not sure)	10

SEARCH

[jonlane]

"If there was even a hint of a question as to what her true wishes were, wouldn't you think it the better part of valor to err on the side of her life being preserved?"

Yes, i would agree with that. provided that she is NOT in a permanent vegetative state, and she could recover. It certainly seems POSSIBLE that there is a POSSIBILITY that she could recover somewhat. Not to criticize other people's activism on behalf of there beliefs, but for myself, i can't hold an opinion one way or another on the fate of a woman whom i have never met or seen in the hospital.

However, as a medical student and, of course, a believer in medical science, I am INCLINED to trust the doctors. but, yes, i could be wrong... it wouldn;t be the first time..

[windchime]

Thanks!

[MizSterious]

"A feeding tube is not extraordinary means of keeping a person alive."

If we start killing everyone who has a feeding tube, a good many people will die just as needlessly as Terri. One of my dear uncles lived with one for years, and continued to live an otherwise good life until a fall finally ended it.

It's utterly disgusting that some people seem to anxious to end a life simply because someone has a feeding tube. It would be no different than killing someone because they wear glasses. Both help or even fix a disability.

[MizSterious]

I would guess that a lot of people here know about as much as anyone would who's not one of the laywers. Maybe as much. The facts are pretty damning to Terri's husband.

[jonlane]

well, the feeding tube itself isn't really the issue. The question is whether she is in a permanent vegetative state, i.e. whether she has any chance for recovery.

[MizSterious]

"if there were someway (of course, there is not) to know for sure that terri would not want to continue to live in this state, would you still oppose the removal of her feeding tube?"

We do not yet know "there is not"--in fact, she has said things to some of her nurses, and with a little therapy, I suspect she could answer this question for herself. Of course, her husband won't allow the necessary therapy, and tries to prevent access to family members. As others have suggested, please read up. That way your comments will be more sensible.

[eeevil conservative]

I would say that THIS is pretty damning to hubby! Dr. William Hammesfahr stated in a January 7, 2004 Highway2Health interview with Ron Panzer that Terri did not have a cardiac arrest or heart attack: Dr. Hammesfahr revealed that not only has Terri never had a heart attack as widely reported in the major media, she also never even had a cardiac arrest (her heart never stopped)! [She had arrhythmias of the heart, but not a "stopped heart."] He explained that Terri's injuries were multiple and showed injury TO her. He stated that Terri had marked injury to her neck which still exists today, and that he has only seen a similar injury, with spinal cord involvement as well as brain injury, in one case where a patient had been strangled. He stated that Terri had an L-1 injury to her spine, which he stated is common among persons being thrown against a table, for example. Excerpt from the Hospice Patients Alliance Newsletter January 8, 2004 by Ron Panzer [bold emphasis added.] Terri Schindler Schiavo and the Cardiac Arrest/Heart Attack Lies

[jonlane]

look, don't get angry with me for respectfully offering a different opinion. I have read up. extensively. and, as i said, i can't tell whcih sources are reliable, therefore I personally do not feel comfortable holding a set position.

Since you so condescendingly told me to "read up" so my comments will be more sensible, let me rudely say to you: Try reading posts before responding to them. That way YOUR comments will be more sensible.

My question was, "If there were someway to know for sure (of course, there is not) that Terri would NOT want to continue to live in this state, would you still oppose the removal of her feeding tube?"

Do you see the difference? This was the negative form of the question, asking about a hypothetical situation where she would be able to clearly communicate that she did NOT want to continue living. In reality, this is a near impossible situation since IF she were conscious and self-aware enough to express a desire one way or the other, it would almost certainly be to continue living (an exception would be if she were suffering terrible pain, in which case i could see her expressing a desire to stop living).

Got it? If you would care to answer, politely, the question which I asked, I would be very interested in your response.

[misty4jc]

Isn't PVS, among other things, an inability to interact with others? That's NOT what Terri is! She's interacting with her family the best way she can right now, since she's not had any sort of rehab at all. To know that she swallows her own saliva, I don't think it's a stretch to assume with time and therapy she could swallow other liquids. She was eating Jello just after her "collapse" anyway.