Profs debate design theory

The Battalian ^ | 2/16/05 | Ji Ma and Steve McReynolds

[Michael_Michaelangelo]

As soon as I can find the transcript of the debate, I will post it on this thread. If someone else knows where it is, please let me know. Thanks.

[Michael_Michaelangelo]

Ping

[Messianic Jews Net]

Thanks, Michael! This is the debate we've been waiting for.

First licks: All evolutionists prove the mechanism of design by being scientists.

[Michael_Michaelangelo]

I thought these quotes were great:

Sophomore biochemistry major Ryan Baxter said that both sides of the controversial debate were presented well.

"For me it was interesting to leave all biases behind and go in with a free mind," he said.

Carlos Arredondo, a senior philosophy major, disagreed with Baxter, and said the professors were arguing about details.

"I think there are deeper issues," he said.

Matt Gamel, a graduate math student sided with Behe's theories, and was frustrated with Cassone's suggestion that religious people did not come to the debate to learn about science. (sound familiar?)

[mc6809e]

This page shows the mousetrap is not irreducibly complex:

http://udel.edu/~mcdonald/mousetrap.html

[Smartaleck]

"Profs debate design theory"

Match the sheets to the curtains. No debate.

[CriticalJ]

Marked for follow up.

[Joe Republc]

How do I know this thread didn't just appear by chance?

;)

-- Joe

[Michael_Michaelangelo]

This page shows the mousetrap is not irreducibly complex:

A Mousetrap Defended

[atlaw]

Thanks, Michael! This is the debate we've been waiting for.

Why?

[Tribune7]

That settles it for me. The mousetrap evolved entirely by random mutation and natural selection.

[WildTurkey]

Up to a point. all carbon 14 should deplete by 90,000 years.

Why not just send $69.99 to Mr. Behe?

[Michael_Michaelangelo]

Huh? Did you respond to the correct thread? Carbon 14?

[frgoff]

This page shows the mousetrap is not irreducibly complex:

Really? Oddly, I see all the elements of the mouse trap in the first diagram.

1. Base - the floor
2. trigger - the tensioned state of the wires
3. Hammer - the stressed wire

Now, let's actually remove one of the components. Let's remove the tension on the wire (this actually removes two components, the trigger and the hammer.)

Guess what? You no longer have a mouse trap. Removing a component causes catastrohpic failure of the system, just like IC predicts.

All this website does is illustrate a different mouse trap design. All the elements are still there.

This is simply another example of someone not getting irreducible complexity. They think the form of the design is the complexity, not realizing it's the functional elements of the design that is the complexity.

[xzins]

Despite the debates, all the arguments, etc., just about EVERYONE seems to accept that there is either the appearance of design or apparent design. Am I correct about that?

[olde north church]

Deism Redux.

The Hand of the All doesn't need to be proven, it is self-evident.

[UnbelievingScumOnTheOtherSide]

I thought 'mutation' had been discarded in favor of 'genetic drift'?

[Alamo-Girl]

Thanks for the ping!

[Alamo-Girl]

Despite the debates, all the arguments, etc., just about EVERYONE seems to accept that there is either the appearance of design or apparent design. Am I correct about that?

That would be true for those who are willing to look. And there are some who close their eyes, put their hands over their ears, whistle and dream of a reality of their own choosing.

Thank you for your post!