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To: kosta50
You and I can answer that because we believe that. A Hindu, a Muslim, a Buddhist will disagree. Faith in God is not a choice, but which faith in God is.

Excuse me?

How we choose which faith is ours is a mystery -- but I am sure the devil has a lot to do with it. As Thomas Merlton says, regarding what the devil teaches us, is that it is "important to be absolutely right and prove that everyone else is absolutely wrong." So, once we choose which faith in God is right, we go on proving everyone else wrong.

Now you sound like a cultist trying to convince people that there is no such thing as absolute truth.

You seem to have this conspiracy theory about the apocryphal books -- but you don't explain just who was feeding the poison? And why? Of course, nothing like that took place. The plain truth is: the Greek-speaking Christians (Jews and Gentiles) simply found support for their beliefs in these books because of what they already believed. They predate Christianity.

Whether they predate Christianity or not is worthless. Whether they were believed or not is worthless. Whether they stand up to scrutiny and have value is the issue. You can believe that the daylight sky is purple instead of blue if you want to. It would make you demonstrably a troubled fool; but, you can believe it. The issue isn't a matter of whether you believe something or not. The issue is whether what you believe is true or not. And you don't seem to have any inkling of the difference.

Havoc, the Church did not have a canon for more than three hundred years after Jesus died.

Bunk. They didn't have a collection of books with some group's stamp of approval on it. They knew what scripture was and duplicated all of it save for I believe 6 verses within the 1st century by quoting it. They had a 'canon'. They just hadn't formalized it.

There was no secret plot to "feed the congregations" any poison!

Uh, yes, there was actually. And the Apostles commented on it. You admit that much but have no apparent capacity for more than mouthing the words. What they mean escapes you. Christianity was being hijacked and false doctrine came in to lead people astray. Authority derived from scripture and from saying "Jesus said thus". If you could write something presuming to state "Jesus said thus" as a recorded matter, then the unknowing could be led off astray. The temple priests of many religions were losing money and needed to find some. And the Devil was happy to give them ideas to pervert the New covenant in much the same way he'd helped to pervert the old. But, of course, as long as you believe what the devil whispers, it must be true, right. If you can point to something really old and say 'people way back when' believed it, it must be true right. Think, Kosta.

Well, I'll be...finally on that we agree!

You say it; but, based on your approach, I can't say that you even know what that means.

770 posted on 03/12/2005 9:31:28 PM PST by Havoc (Reagan was right and so was McKinley. Down with free trade. Hang the traitors high)
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To: Havoc
Now you sound like a cultist trying to convince people that there is no such thing as absolute truth

Well, the cultist is the guy you see when you look in the mirror. There is absolute truth -- it doesn't mean that you or I know it.

The issue is whether what you believe is true or not. And you don't seem to have any inkling of the difference

Neither do you have any proof that what you believe is true. Wait, I know, it's true because you believe in it. Little narcissistic, don't you think?

They knew what scripture was and duplicated all of it save for I believe 6 verses within the 1st century by quoting it

Ignorance is bliss and you are basking in it! For three hundred years the Fathers debated what is inspired and what not. You obviously know nothing of the Church history. Yes, the Fathers knew scripture when they saw it, but there were numerous false "Gospels" and manuscripts floating around that had to be separated, and even those that some thought were genuine others thought not -- while others thought of false as acceptable. You really need to learn some facts for a change.

Christianity was being hijacked and false doctrine came in to lead people astray

There are 33,000 or more Protestant 'denominations' -- what makes you think we know what Christianity is today? We all believe with imperfect knowledge, including you. Believing does not make you right or righteous -- even the demons believe in God.

774 posted on 03/12/2005 11:14:14 PM PST by kosta50 (Eastern Orthodoxy is pure Christianity)
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