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"Even if we pass a plan, we will be no closer to solving the problem of a continuins massive influx of uneducated immigrants across our southern border."

Not true. Once passed, either plan will allow us to register millions of currently anonymous illegal alien fugitives. Once registered, those millions will be crossing our border at *legal* checkpoints, not treking through the desert.

This will greatly reduce the numbers who are coming through our non-checkpoint border crossings. The smaller those numbers become, the more manageable and feasible it becomes for our border patrol to discover and apprehend those who do continue to cross over illegally.

Moreover, both Tancredo and Bush's immigration plans register the employers of illegals for compliance audits...greatly reducing the number of employers who are willing to continue to hire illegals...

...Especially since if even 1 illegal at a sweatshop ever applies for a future blue card, then that entire sweatshop is going to get audited.

So contrary to the *myth* of an uncontrollable immigration problem, both Tancredo and Bush are offering very clever, very viable solutions...real world solutions...to this problem.

This is *NOT* President Reagan's 1986 amnesty; it's far better than that. Far.

Please see my post 536.

And, regarding your claim that this is not Reagan's ammnesty - that is true enough. However, there will be a unique unintended consequences rider on Bush's plan, just as there was a similar rider on Reagan's plan. That is why this stuff needs to be debated in detail before it is passed.

Once registered, those millions will be crossing our border at *legal* checkpoints, not treking through the desert.

Do you really believe, I mean really, that the other 30 million residents of Mexico, not to mention the 80 million combined residents of Equador, Costa Rica, Panama, Columbia, etc., will not come zooming across the border as fast as their legs can move the minute they realize that simply getting their warm body across the US border will increase by, oh about 98-percent, their chance of obtaining American Citizenship (or residency).

I've read much of your posting before Southack, and I like your stuff.

But I am 100 percent convinced that we would experience a massive influx of immigrants across our border if we were to suddenly promise visas or residency to anyone who can get an employer in the US to sign a simple piece of paper saying they HAD NO CHOICE to hire an immigrant cause they couldn't find an American to do the job.

It will be like opening up the borders to anyone and everyone. Mark my words.

In 30-40 years, the Anglos will be fighting for their rights in a country that suddenly has more third world residents than it can handle.

Already our hospitals and schools are being overwhelmed. Take a drive through any mid-sized East Coast city and see if you can make an economic transaction WITHOUT speaking spanish.

"...Especially since if even 1 illegal at a sweatshop ever applies for a future blue card, then that entire sweatshop is going to get audited."

Yes, and I'll guarantee you I'll be turning in every employer in town that has even one suspected illegal!

..."This is *NOT* President Reagan's 1986 amnesty; it's far better than that. Far....."

Well as one who was around and close to this issue when the Farm Bureau bought off Congress in 1986 to get their amnesty, I can tell you the Simpson-Mazoli bill was a compromise, with a carrot of a limited amnesty and the stick of employer sanctions. Congress made a promise that it would be a one time amnesty. Then they failed to fund the enforcement part of the bill thus our present situation. The main loophole for illegals was for independent contractors who are not employees, and I see nothing in either current proposal addressing this issue. Fraudulent documents was another problem, which will once again be present. If an American can get a birth certificate for a dead person and start a whole new ID just think what one can do in Mexico or LA.

There was an overnight business of false documents to "verify" that illegals were eligible for the amnesty..fraud was rampant, and will be even worse this time around with new printers, computers(ala Rathergate)etc. How can INS vet 20 million people when they can't vet their own employees? Mexican Consulate cards are available in LA on the street for $25, you pick the name you want to use...Remember we are dealing with people coming from third world countries where corruption and bribery are part of the job description.

Look at the corruption here over a few drivers licenses, the price will go up for documents to get to be a guest worker...In Mexico to prove you have a clean record you go to the Chief of Police of the town nearest you and he writes a letter with a seal saying you are an angel, you pay him the going rate and you are on your way.

Biometrics work when the data input is good, bad data in bad data out...less than 10% of real agricultural workers have classifiable fingerprints..the ridges are worn off..Maybe we should use biometrics for voter registration?

http://www.ibia.org/newslett030711.htm

Sanctions work if funded and enforced, just like traffic tickets and radar..no one around to stop you speeding will be rampant, throw some hefty fines and drivers license suspensions out there and everyone will know about it.

Our present situation comes from Congress, the are responsible for abdicating and selling out their duty and promises, and for lying to the American people about enforcing sanctions.

If you think I will trust them to register and enforce laws again, you are WRONG. Fool me once shame on you fool me twice shame on me. Its a fools game unless enforcement is locked in solid.

As for registering aliens, every alien in the US is required to carry his alien registration with him at all times, if stopped and they don't have it it is a fine offense(up to $100 and up to 30 days in jail lol..). About 50% of illegals are overstays or out of status and do have immigration documents, the other 50 % that enter without inspection don't have anything but the $50 phony green card and id they got the second they hit downtown LA. Aliens were required to report their address every year..that was discontinued in 1981 for "efficiency" INS had hundreds of boxes of alien registration cards that were never filed or looked at other than in boxes.(actually changed because during the Iranian hostage crisis, INS tried to find Iranians in the US and found out they had no F'n idea how many were still here or where they lived so they eliminated the one law that helped them do their job instead of enforcing it) The half of the alien registation cards that were supposed to be turned in when aliens left the country were never compiled/computerized most were tossed in the trash or stashed in boxes,thus we have no idea who is here and who left..how are we going to do the same with 20 million more people?

Register 20 million people who already broke at least one law and many that also have forged documents..yeah that's the ticket...they will go home when their time is up..ROFLMAO...Look how well INS vetted the 135,000 Mariel boat lift criminals and psychos...look at how many criminal aliens we already know about who are on the loose.

I'm for a limited guest worker program, but it has to be a lot better thought out and secure than what I have seen.If the govt can't keep track of one million foreign students and their schools are required to do the work for them, how can the US keep track of 20 million "guest workers" It's a joke, another fraud upon the public....all show no go..

rs

Not true. Once passed, either plan will allow us to register millions of currently anonymous illegal alien fugitives. Once registered, those millions will be crossing our border at *legal* checkpoints, not treking through the desert.

Illegal alien fugitives? No criminal fugitive alien will register for a guest worker visa, it's suicide. The only ones that will register are the ones that have no criminal history, outside of illegal entry and they will be replaced by millions more sneaking into the country.

As for enforcement of employer sanctions, that has been promised twice and Congress has failed to properly fund it twice. This time will be no different.