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"Fetal research only changes the abortion debate for people who think that life starts at some magical point,"

Although not properly elaborated upon here, this statement is the crux of the fallacious thinking on the part of many who support anti-abortion legislation. It involves their denial of the fact of space-time continuity.

The simple fact is that there is no point of meaningful transition from non-human-being to human being. The process of conception involves millions of individually similar and insignificant chemical events occuring serially and in parallel. On some time scale, the process appears quite smooth and gradual. Life can be said to exist at specific time points, but it does not start at any point.

So, if anyone askes "When does life start?", the answer is simply, "It doesn't."

In short, there is no poof.

1 posted on 01/11/2005 12:29:07 PM PST by beavus
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To: beavus

Deconstructionist clap trap. I fail to see the fallacy you are trying to manufacture. Are you trying to say that just because an event is not fully understood, or cannot be seen, that it does not occur? That's toddler logic. My son (age three) is still pretty well convinced that if he can't see me, I can't see him. Your argument makes similar assumptions.

Irreducible complexity does not negate causality. For a review of the causal factors surrounding conception, see biology 101.

Your argument about continua fails as well. Pursue time and space down to the smallest observable scales, and reality is essentially discontinuous.


82 posted on 01/11/2005 4:34:49 PM PST by Jack of all Trades (Connecticut - The Construction State)
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To: beavus
'Life' in general terms is a continuum, yes, but A life, the life of a discrete, individual organism, does have beginning and ending points.
89 posted on 01/11/2005 5:49:45 PM PST by Sloth (Al Franken is a racist.)
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To: beavus
This book should be required reading for every pregnant woman. Wouldn't hurt men to read it either.

.


93 posted on 01/11/2005 6:37:39 PM PST by sweetliberty (Just because we CAN do something, doesn't mean we should.)
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To: beavus

To many of us pro-lifers, this question is irrelevant until the abortion debate shows even a hint of sanity. Our ultimate goal is to have abortion completely illegalized, but we know that in a democratic society that is never going to happen (without extreme intervention from above). Therefore, we call for at least restrictions that can be passed with a majority of voters. For this to happen we have to make public such research as this.

All we want are sane restrictions at this point in time. When abortions are legal until the baby pops out, when minors can have abortions without their parents being informed yet cannot get their ears pierced, and when any question of viability is met with condemnation about trying to govern women's bodies, our priorities have been skewed.

No sanity exists in the abortion debate at this point - when sane restrictions have been made, then we can talk about narrowing things down to a consensus on when life starts. As it is right now, we are out of control.

tSG


101 posted on 01/12/2005 6:19:18 AM PST by alkaloid2 (Your favorite site is now www.theSuperGenius.com! You are commanded!)
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To: beavus

Any mother who pays attention knows all this. Each of my children had the same personality when I got to know them as they did in the womb.


145 posted on 01/12/2005 6:21:13 PM PST by HungarianGypsy
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To: beavus

How do people get to the point that can say abortion is okay? When I have mentioned it to my 10 year old he can't believe there are people who would not think a fetus is a real baby, let alone would want to kill the baby.


146 posted on 01/12/2005 6:26:11 PM PST by HungarianGypsy
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To: beavus
So, if anyone askes "When does life start?", the answer is simply, "It doesn't."

You're as bad as she is. Science is science except where unborn babies are concerned. Freaking garbage and part of the reason why us evil creatanoids can not stomach techno-bs artists.

163 posted on 01/13/2005 12:38:29 AM PST by jwalsh07
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To: beavus

Thanks for the post - excellent info!


209 posted on 01/24/2005 3:27:32 PM PST by Chili Girl
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Self-ping for later read


233 posted on 01/27/2005 2:50:34 PM PST by kevkrom (If people are free to do as they wish, they are almost certain not to do as Utopian planners wish)
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To: beavus
The scene never fails to give goose bumps: the baby, just seconds old and still dewy from the womb

That's not dew. I love babies, but I'm not gonna touch one until they wash off the blood, bodily fluids, and vaginal mucus.

245 posted on 01/27/2005 9:52:31 PM PST by xm177e2 (Stalinists, Maoists, Ba'athists, Pacifists: Why are they always on the same side?)
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To: beavus
Heidelise Als, a developmental psychologist at Harvard Medical School, is fascinated by the amount of tactile stimulation a fetus gives itself. "It touches a hand to the face, one hand to the other hand, clasps its feet, touches its foot to its leg, its hand to its umbilical cord," she reports.

That's not all he's touching. It's like permanent bathtime in there.

I say, when a fetus is old enough for masturbation, abortion should be off-limits.

Onanicide is Murder!

246 posted on 01/27/2005 10:06:36 PM PST by xm177e2 (Stalinists, Maoists, Ba'athists, Pacifists: Why are they always on the same side?)
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