Were the Wisemen who visited Jesus in Bethleham Persians?

Farsinet ^ | 12/24/04 | Farsinet

[freedom44]

Magi (Majusian)

From old Persian language, a priest of Zarathustra (Zoroaster). The Bible gives us the direction, East and the legend states that the wise men were from Persia (Iran) - Balthasar, Melchior, Caspar - thus being priests of Zarathustra religion, the mages. Obviously the pilgrimage had some religious significance for these men, otherwise they would not have taken the trouble and risk of travelling so far. But what was it? An astrological phenomenon, the Star?

Matthew 2:1 - "After Jesus was born in Bethlehem in Judea, during the time of King Herod, Magi [*] from the east came to Jerusalem." (* Footnote: Traditionally Wise Men). Matthew 2:7 - Then Herod called the Magi secretly and found out from them the exact time the star had appeared. Matthew 2:16 - When Herod realized that he had been outwitted by the Magi, he was furious, and he gave orders to kill all the boys in Bethlehem and its vicinity who were two years old and under, in accordance with the time he had learned from the Magi.

Church of Nativity in Bethlehem, was erected in 329 by Queen Helena in the area it was believed to be where Jesus was born. In 614, The Church was saved from destruction by the Persian rampage because of the mosaic of the Magi dressed in Persian Garb on the floor of this church.

Magi, priestly caste in ancient Persia. They are thought to have been followers of Zoroaster, the Persian teacher and prophet, and they professed the doctrines of Zoroastrianism. By the 1st century AD, the magi were identified with wise men and soothsayers. Encarta Concise Encyclopedia - Religion & Philosophy.

[freedom44]

Herodotus Description of the Magi

Herodotus, who lived in the fifth-century before Christ, the celebrated ancient Greek father of "history-writing" (historiography), and the chronicler of the Greco-Persian wars, provides us with some very valuable historical information concerning that ancient class of people known as the Magi. Thus it is clear that by the time of the birth of Christ, Magi were an already well-established and ancient caste of people. He explains that Magi (Old Persian "Magu")*, originated from Medes (today's northern Iran), and were an elite class or caste of Medes within the Persian empire. After an unsuccessful attempt to gain political control of the empire, the Medes turned from politics to piety, becoming the teachers and illuminators of the Persians, specialising in the interpretation of dreams. Herodotus also informs us that Magi also assumed priestly functions with Persian society. This means that Magi would have been Zoroastrian priests (at that time Zoroastrianism was the dominant religion of Persia). Indeed without them no official sacrifice could be offered in Persia.

Merry Christmas!

[TexasTransplant]

No they were Black Africans bringing Quwanza gifts and ears of Corn. They had this funky three colored flag and were really down on the man!

(really... sarcasim... really, no flames on this one, unless you believe they really were Black Aficans, bringing KAwanza gifts)

[The Loan Arranger]

Ahura Mazda only knows.

[freedom44]

Persians are Indo-Europeans of the Arya tribe, hence white skinned with light features. There is no such thing as a black skinned Iranian.

I'm trying to grasp your point?!?

[Just Lori]

he gave orders to kill all the boys in Bethlehem and its vicinity who were two years old and under

Innocent babies murdered 2,000 years ago. Evil has been around for a long long time, and it is with us today. If we don't fight it, we will allow it to overtake us.

Happy Birthday, Jesus!

[TexasTransplant]

You are trying very hard not to get it.

Merry Kwanza to you and yours

[Khurkris]

I pretty much came to this conclusion quite a few years ago. No problem for me.

[RepublicanReptile]

The Magi were, as I recall, astrologers, so I am sure they
were on the lookout for something of great signifigance in that area, and they found it. Many people think that the Star of Bethelehem was the Hale Bop comet, which is why a lot of crazy people committed suicide and tried to " go to the comet" a few years back.

[Netizen]

wise men from the Greek
3097 magos mag'-os
1) a magus
a) the name given by the Babylonians (Chaldeans), Medes, Persians, and others, to the wise men, teachers, priests, physicians, astrologers, seers, interpreters of dreams, augers, soothsayers, sorcerers etc.
b) the oriental wise men (astrologers) who, having discovered by the rising of a remarkable star that the Messiah had just been born, came to Jerusalem to worship him
c) a false prophet and sorcerer

Magi ma-gi n.pl., sing. -gus [magus, magician] Douay Bible the wise men who came bearing gifts to the infant Jesus. (source: Webster's New World Dictionary)

Simon Magus, the Samaritan wizard.

Jeremiah 10
2 Thus saith the LORD, Learn not the way of the heathen, and be not dismayed at the signs of heaven; for the heathen are dismayed at them.
3 For the customs of the people are vain: for one cutteth a tree out of the forest, the work of the hands of the workman, with the axe.
4 They deck it with silver and with gold; they fasten it with nails and with hammers, that it move not.

We're not supposed to be concerned with 'signs' of heaven.

Deuteronomy 18
9 When thou art come into the land which the LORD thy God giveth thee, thou shalt not learn to do after the abominations of those nations.
10 There shall not be found among you any one that maketh his son or his daughter to pass through the fire, or that useth divination, or an observer of times, or an enchanter, or a witch.
11 Or a charmer, or a consulter with familiar spirits, or a wizard, or a necromancer.
12 For all that do these things are an abomination unto the LORD: and because of these abominations the LORD thy God doth drive them out from before thee.

Isaiah 2
6 Therefore thou hast forsaken thy people the house of Jacob, because they be replenished from the east, and are soothsayers like the Philistines, and they please themselves in the children of strangers.

Yahweh forbid the interpretation of signs for this sort of predictive purpose. It would have been divination to interpret the appearance of stars as omens of extraordinary events, births of royalty, or even messiahs. Yet, we are to do that which Yahweh/G-d forbids???

[oprahstheantichrist]

To me, the most curious thing is, how did they know what the star signified? If the Hebrew Scriptures did not prophecy the appearance of a star with the arrival of The Messiah, where did their information come from ("We have seen His star in the east...")?

I've read speculation that perhaps the prophet Daniel had foretold the star to his Babylonian contemporaries in the days of the captivity, but I don't know that there's a shred of evidence to support that.

[freedom44]

In the Avesta holy book of Zoroastrians during the reign of the Persian Empire. Zoroaster says my spirit shall be reborn under a star and shall be reborn a virgin.

" Zoroaster taught that a great star would appear and that this star would be the sign of a great king"

http://www.student.org/believe.htm

That great King was Christ the Son which Zoroaster the prophet predicted hence the coming of the Zoroastrian Magi from the east.

[windchime]

Merry Christmas, freedom44!

 

[leadhead]

I've never been able to square the depiction of the Magi at the stable with Herod's order to kill all the under-two year olds.

Could they have seen the star and made it from Persia to Bethlehem while Christ was still in the stable?

If they told Herod they were looking for an infant, why did he knock off one & two year olds?

Puzzlement

[risk]

Merry Christmas, f44!

[RaceBannon]

There is nothng in the Bible as to the identity of these men.

But they could be Persian, I will accede that.

They could also be Assyrian, though, we just dont know.

They could even be Indian...or Mongol...

[LoudRepublicangirl]

I read on FR about a year ago that the Kurds could possibly be descendent's of the wise-men.

[RaceBannon]

All it says is they followed HIS STAR, not that they were astrologers.

(Mat 2:1 KJV) Now when Jesus was born in Bethlehem of Judaea in the days of Herod the king, behold, there came wise men from the east to Jerusalem,

(Mat 2:2 KJV) Saying, Where is he that is born King of the Jews? for we have seen his star in the east, and are come to worship him.

(Mat 2:3 KJV) When Herod the king had heard these things, he was troubled, and all Jerusalem with him.

(Mat 2:4 KJV) And when he had gathered all the chief priests and scribes of the people together, he demanded of them where Christ should be born.

(Mat 2:5 KJV) And they said unto him, In Bethlehem of Judaea: for thus it is written by the prophet,

(Mat 2:6 KJV) And thou Bethlehem, in the land of Juda, art not the least among the princes of Juda: for out of thee shall come a Governor, that shall rule my people Israel.

(Mat 2:7 KJV) Then Herod, when he had privily called the wise men, inquired of them diligently what time the star appeared.

(Mat 2:8 KJV) And he sent them to Bethlehem, and said, Go and search diligently for the young child; and when ye have found him, bring me word again, that I may come and worship him also.

(Mat 2:9 KJV) When they had heard the king, they departed; and, lo, the star, which they saw in the east, went before them, till it came and stood over where the young child was.

(Mat 2:10 KJV) When they saw the star, they rejoiced with exceeding great joy.

(Mat 2:11 KJV) And when they were come into the house, they saw the young child with Mary his mother, and fell down, and worshipped him: and when they had opened their treasures, they presented unto him gifts; gold, and frankincense, and myrrh.



So, How many men? Matthew doesn't tell us. Nor does it call them astrologers, only that they saw the Bethlehem Star.


It only calls the men WISE MEN, not astrologers.

However, the Bethlehem star was a Miracle star, for it lead them to the Manger. There is NO NATURAL star which could do such a thing, nor is there a NATURAL conjunction of planets which could do such a thing.

(Mat 2:9 KJV) When they had heard the king, they departed; and, lo, the star, which they saw in the east, went before them, till it came and stood over where the young child was.

[LS]

The "wise men" did not visit Bethlehem. They saw the "young child" (note, not the same word as "babe") in the "house" (note, not "inn" or "manger" or "stable"). The "kings" (which is the appropriate translation) saw Jesus in Nazareth, not Bethlehem, and, by the way, Jesus was only in Bethlehem for a night or two, because shortly thereafter He was in Jerusalem for the official Jewish ceremonies, THEN the Holy Family went to Nazareth THEN they fled to Egypt.

[LS]

Ever see SNL's take on this, where one of the "wise men" forgets his gift and stops at a 7/11 to get an air freshener, a bag of Doritos, and a cigarette lighter?