Posted on 12/07/2004 9:02:29 AM PST by Tumbleweed_Connection
I wonder what the UCC response would be if someone put an "ad" on the 'net showing UCC bouncers high-fiving and backslapping pedophiles, passing a doobie, bowing to Fidel Castro and Kim Jung Il as they are passed thru, ..., while turning away people in military uniform, anyone wearing a Republican or "W in 04" button, a hunter/sportsman, ...?
UCC seems to be ignoring repeated Biblical directives to live in harmony with other believers. Rather than delivering a completely positive message, their ad uses negative imagery (e.g., white, crewcut bouncers) and creates disharmony, which seems very much at odds with the spirit of unity we are instructed to foster. Causing the Body of Christ to be at war with itself will not find favor in God's eyes.
You read too much into the ad .... they are 'simply' stating they are more open than others and using bouncers and velvet ropes to exagerate their points.
I agree. I think the ad should be run. It would be fun to watch a denominational ad war exaggerating the UCC position.
Another fun add would be to have homeless sleeping on the church pews in UCC churches and the congregation sitting down next to them in their Sunday best clothes - exaggerating their discomfort.
There are two levels of Christ never turning one away that need to be considered in scripture the first would be those who were with him personally or disciples of Jesus
Jesus did not appeal to everyone to be his disciple.
Matthew 8:21-22 And another of his disciples said unto him, Lord, suffer me first to go and bury my father. 22 But Jesus said unto him, Follow me; and let the dead bury their dead.
Luke 14 26 If any man come to me, and hate not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be my disciple.
Luke 14 33 So likewise, whosoever he be of you that forsaketh not all that he hath, he cannot be my disciple.
Mark 2 15 And it came to pass, that, as Jesus sat at meat in his house, many publicans and sinners sat also together with Jesus and his disciples: for there were many, and they followed him. 16 And when the scribes and Pharisees saw him eat with publicans and sinners, they said unto his disciples, How is it that he eateth and drinketh with publicans and sinners? 17 When Jesus heard it, he saith unto them, They that are whole have no need of the physician, but they that are sick: I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.
Matthew 23:13-35 13 But woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye shut up the kingdom of heaven against men: for ye neither go in yourselves, neither suffer ye them that are entering to go in. 14 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye devour widows' houses, and for a pretence make long prayer: therefore ye shall receive the greater damnation. 15 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye compass sea and land to make one proselyte, and when he is made, ye make him twofold more the child of hell than yourselves. 16 Woe unto you, ye blind guides, which say, Whosoever shall swear by the temple, it is nothing; but whosoever shall swear by the gold of the temple, he is a debtor! 17 Ye fools and blind: for whether is greater, the gold, or the temple that sanctifieth the gold? 18 And, Whosoever shall swear by the altar, it is nothing; but whosoever sweareth by the gift that is upon it, he is guilty. 19 Ye fools and blind: for whether is greater, the gift, or the altar that sanctifieth the gift? 20 Whoso therefore shall swear by the altar, sweareth by it, and by all things thereon. 21 And whoso shall swear by the temple, sweareth by it, and by him that dwelleth therein. 22 And he that shall swear by heaven, sweareth by the throne of God, and by him that sitteth thereon. 23 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone. 24 Ye blind guides, which strain at a gnat, and swallow a camel. 25 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye make clean the outside of the cup and of the platter, but within they are full of extortion and excess. 26 Thou blind Pharisee, cleanse first that which is within the cup and platter, that the outside of them may be clean also. 27 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye are like unto whited sepulchres, which indeed appear beautiful outward, but are within full of dead men's bones, and of all uncleanness. 28 Even so ye also outwardly appear righteous unto men, but within ye are full of hypocrisy and iniquity. 29 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! because ye build the tombs of the prophets, and garnish the sepulchres of the righteous, 30 And say, If we had been in the days of our fathers, we would not have been partakers with them in the blood of the prophets. 31 Wherefore ye be witnesses unto yourselves, that ye are the children of them which killed the prophets. 32 Fill ye up then the measure of your fathers. 33 Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of hell? 34 Wherefore, behold, I send unto you prophets, and wise men, and scribes: and some of them ye shall kill and crucify; and some of them shall ye scourge in your synagogues, and persecute them from city to city: 35 That upon you may come all the righteous blood shed upon the earth, from the blood of righteous Abel unto the blood of Zacharias son of Barachias, whom ye slew between the temple and the altar.
And even with far greater import Jesus said that not all, not most, those who shall desire to enter the kingdom of heaven and shall not.
Matthew 7:14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.
Matthew 7:21-23 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
Matthew 21:28-45 But what think ye? A certain man had two sons; and he came to the first, and said, Son, go work to day in my vineyard. He answered and said, I will not: but afterward he repented, and went. And he came to the second, and said likewise. And he answered and said, I go, sir: and went not. Whether of them twain did the will of his father? They say unto him, The first. Jesus saith unto them, Verily I say unto you, That the publicans and the harlots go into the kingdom of God before you. For John came unto you in the way of righteousness, and ye believed him not: but the publicans and the harlots believed him: and ye, when ye had seen it, repented not afterward, that ye might believe him. Hear another parable: There was a certain householder, which planted a vineyard, and hedged it round about, and digged a winepress in it, and built a tower, and let it out to husbandmen, and went into a far country: And when the time of the fruit drew near, he sent his servants to the husbandmen, that they might receive the fruits of it. 35 And the husbandmen took his servants, and beat one, and killed another, and stoned another. Again, he sent other servants more than the first: and they did unto them likewise. But last of all he sent unto them his son, saying, They will reverence my son. But when the husbandmen saw the son, they said among themselves, This is the heir; come, let us kill him, and let us seize on his inheritance. 39 And they caught him, and cast him out of the vineyard, and slew him. When the lord therefore of the vineyard cometh, what will he do unto those husbandmen? 41 They say unto him, He will miserably destroy those wicked men, and will let out his vineyard unto other husbandmen, which shall render him the fruits in their seasons. Jesus saith unto them, Did ye never read in the scriptures, The stone which the builders rejected, the same is become the head of the corner: this is the Lord's doing, and it is marvellous in our eyes? Therefore say I unto you, The kingdom of God shall be taken from you, and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof. And whosoever shall fall on this stone shall be broken: but on whomsoever it shall fall, it will grind him to powder. And when the chief priests and Pharisees had heard his parables, they perceived that he spake of them.
There are many other scriptures in the gospels that point Christ and Heaven not being all inclussive as all the liberals would imply -- now the liberals are a religious folk in theirown manner. All these news commentators are also -- these are some of the modern pharisees they poke at christ they poke at God they poke at beleivers that are less than themselves and they use an unrightous meaurung stick of their traditions and the teachings that approve their personal standards. These poeple have stood aside watching millions of babies being aborted, they have allowed christians to be massacred around the world with no cry they have let people who were in freedom be taken over by muslim and communist governments and not lifted a single finger to save any one. They rejoice in sin they rejoice in iniquity they rejoice in the defeat of Christ and the church -- these people are by definition pharisees.
I've seen the ad. It reads to me like "We're the UCC, the non-racist church."
I've seen the ad. It reads to me like "We're the UCC, the non-racist church."
Which begs the question...where are all these 'racist' churches?
As for the UCC, I guess they've taken the white out to those passages in the Old AND New Testament condemning as sinful homosexual acts. Not condemning queers, but condemning queer acts.
So, where are the similar passages condemning use of a wheelchair or condemning being black or hispanic (he asks rhetorically)?
"You read too much into the ad .... "
I'm a little surprised at the amount of venom towards the ad that is present on this thread? I don't see anything wrong with the ad. My church isn't UCC but I am not aware of it ever turning anyone away. I assumed all churches were similar in that respect. Perhaps I was wrong?
To hear all the complainers on this thread, most of the churches they attend, do indeed turn people away.
"Gay people are incredibly annoying. Every last one of them"
I agree with you, but some women like them. Could you explain please?
To liberals, people of faith might as well live in another country. After the election, its amusing to watch ABC struggle to understand why people who embrace traditional values reject the Left's social permissiveness. As The Gipper used to be fond of remarking, "there they go again!" Peter Jennings and Co. don't get it and for the record, neither do the Unitarians.
If you want to see a truly diverse congregation, you usually have to go to an evangelical church.
And the networks won't run religious ads! Gee what country are these professors living in? I'd hazard a guess television network executives are more afraid of the ACLU and AUSH than they are of religious Christians.
I would concur. I am most definitely NOT a UCC'r either, and my church does NOT turn anyone away, but the ad is really harmless as a means for this church to recruit saying they are more open than others ...
It should/could contribute to some good dialogue as to what their openness really is, since I do object to their allowing/encouraging active homosexuals to leadership positions in thier church. THIS I object to. But I cannot turn that bible based objection to an objection to the ad itself.
Interesting ... the only churches that should be offended by such an ad, are those churches where perhaps 'the shoe fits". For churches to ask for this ad to be pulled is rediculous. If the ad pointed at Catholics, Methodists or some particular church group, then it would be bad. But it doesn't. It 'implies' that the UCC is 'more' open than everyone else by method of exageration.
Churches that are most offended should start to ask why.
exactly ....
"the power of the right in America to chill and deter free speech."
"It seems professors have become incredibly stupid over the years."
Dishonest too. This liar knows full well that the purpose of the ad, AND its pre-planned "refusal" by the networks was to publicize the "chilling" effect of the RedState Right now that the eeevil Bush has siezed power once again.
Like the dance ABC did around "Saving Private Ryan," this whole episode is a choreographed dramatic charade to slyly smear and slander the good Christian Americans who voted for GW Bush.
If I'm wrong, then the question is, how could an ad that didn't run, instantly turn into such a well-publicized, coordinated and carefully presented message?
The further evidence is that CBS apparently appended an editorial comment about the Constitutional Amendment in defense of marriage, implying that such an amendment even in the proposal stages, was a source of fear and censorship and the end of civilization as we know it.
I didn't believe this non sequitur even was committed, at first, but now understand it to have been a typical bit of CBS overkill, capitalizing on an artificially created opportunity.
The UCC ad is offensive because it reinforces the Christophobic propaganda of the mainstream media. Imagine McDonald's launching an ad campaign that said "Come to our place; our burgers don't have E Coli."
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