Posted on 09/12/2004 4:18:48 PM PDT by gregde
Why is New England so heavily democratic? Much of it is white middle class suburban/small town types who would would vote heavily republican in much of the rest of the country. In fact New England was relatively Republican in many states as recently as 15 or 20 years ago. I understand that it is a relatively liberal place, but liberals can't be such a large percentage of the population as to explain gore's 2 to 1 victory over bush in 2000.
Massachusetts Republicans may be a rare breed, but in a sense exceptional for not drinking the Kook-Aid, considering it's about the only drink in town.
Go Howie Carr!!
I would agree with your explanation, add toat (in VT)the locals seem to have bought into the welfare state that the flat landers have promised. I was back there last year and I couldn't believe how easily the locals had been conned.
As for NH and VT, it is all about the waves of liberals from MA. My sister-in-law just moved across the border to NH. She's one of the Anybody but Bush crowd. Actually the universities brought her here..........
You beat me to this one.I would hardly call New Hampshire a bastion of liberal thinkers.In recent years there has been an influx of Bay State residents setting up house across the border while continuing employment in Mass (note the expansion project on Rte3)
What also does the trick is the decaying mill towns and urban neighborhoods that are strongly inclined to vote Democratic. To be sure, voters there are generally less liberal than suburban professionals can be, but they do provide the Democrats with large majorities in many elections.
New England is where political parties go to die.
Actually I blame the media. The MSM up here engages in nothing short of mass brainwashing. Two of the three major stations in Boston completely ignored 9/11 ceremonies while they were going on. Fortunately FOX has a channel and is fighting back.
Someone asked about the unions in RI. Just heard this morning that retired firemen in Cranston(?) get paid holdidays. It came up because they are going to add 9/11 to the list of holidays. Now explain to me how a retired person ona pension earns holiday pay? Unreal.
The excesses of Cambridge and NYC have polluted the area.
I could see it in Vermont way back in the early 80s when I lived in Manhattan and did weekends in the Stockbridge-Woodstock area.
The indigs are good folk.
That sounds like typical spin. What evidence do you have for it? Couldn't their motivation be mixed, rather than all one thing or the all the other? Thousands of New Englanders fought for many reasons, and on the whole, very few of them risked their lives because they thought they were better than other people.
People who are so quick to object that the Civil War "wasn't all about slavery" for Southerners are often quick to put the most derogatory spin on Northern motivations, and to deny any idealism or nobility to those who fought for the Union. It's the same sort of slighting and demeaning charge that they object to when it's directed against themselves. And it's the kind of thing that can be applied any time there's a moral question in dispute or people try to change things.
For better and for worse, a lot of America comes out of the Puritans. Much of what we're criticized for or attacked for goes back to Puritan idealism, practicality, and energy. It's not all bad and it's certainly not all leftist.
We even have a bit of what you describe down here in Nashville....very wealthy preppie southern wasps who are libs....most belong to some sort of apostate prod church.
Wealthy southern jews tend to be libs too although at a slightly lower rate than in the NE...
Thankfully, most non minority types here are at least 65% conservative...in the Deep South it's even higher....maybe in the 80% range.
I think a lot has to do with perspectives and realities...on things like social issues and such hot buttons as abortion and racial programs and gun rights. The rubber meets the road on that stuff down here.
I lived in Vermont for a year, after moving from Southern California (which if you stay away from L.A., can be pretty conservative in some spots), and I thought I was gonna go nuts! There were so many crunchy types, (land of Phish, ex-hippies, etc) TONS of liberal elites (academics from UVM, spoiled college students, and lots of New York City transplants). After that experience, I realized I can never live in a heavily liberal area again...they really do ruin it....
Posted by SamAdams76:
"...Their kids love the area so much that they settle down here and multiply..."
Sam, this is what is confusing: We conservatives also settle down, get married, and multiply. The puzzle is WHY liberals seem to be greater in number?
One of my theories is that it could be due to irresponsible rate of childbirth and encouraging multiple generations of welfare recipients. Both they and their Democratic masters would rather have one hundred dollars be ladled to them by Big GovernmentTM than earn one thousand dollars with hard work.
Thankfully, we conservatives have a larger sphere of influence and have greater impact on policy.
~ Blue Jays ~
And why did she move to New Hampshire?
I think part of it is the collapse of a Christian witness in New England. The former bullwark of conservative thought and religious orthodoxy -- the United Church of Christ -- has become ultra secular. Its congregations have departed. Being the mainstream church of New England, its decline has had an affect across New England society. It's a shame, really.
Bush won Louisiana in 2000 52% to 44%. He lost Rhode Island, for example, 61 to 31. That's the kind of stat im talking about. I understand that in state and local politics Democrats (often conservative ones) still do well in much of the south. Im talking about Liberal dems, a la Kerry, not Zell Miller.
Btw, to people who say New England has always been liberal, that's absurd. Perhaps it has always had certain liberal/utopian tendencies. But if by liberals we mean non-religious, big government types, than in the first half of the 20th century New England most certainly wasn't liberal.
Also, I wouldn't be surprised if in the 1860s New England was on average more religious than the South. Even as recently as 100 years ago, New England was considered by many to be "puritanical" and morally conservative.
yeah, sounds like typical spin but it just makes sense. The attitudes and behavior of people around here are so horrible. I have lived here most of my life so I don't notice it as much anymore but there really is a strong bias against people from conservative areas. I'm originally from CA so I don't experience it (no accent) but the liberals really are savage. Remember this is Keneddy and Kerry land. In most states Dems gerrymander so that all of the republicans are in one district. In MA they gerrymandered the state so that we are split and they can have all 10 districts safe. I live much closer to Rhode Island than to Boston yet my district includes a slice of Boston.
I am not trying to claim that the Civil War had little to do with slavery. I have no sympathy for the slaveholders. I'm just saying that in MA there really has always been a leftist tilt, even when they voted Republican. They were the original RINOs.
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