Judaism's Thriving Concern

I was referring to a much more literal definition of pre-Copernican: that the earth is the literal center of the universe, absolutely unmoving, and everything else revolves around it.

If I understand correctly, the Rebbe held that both the earth and sun, as well as all heavenly bodies, are moving around each other (as per Einstien) so there really is no room to say definitively that *we* are revolving around the sun. Rather it depends on your perspective, and the way we choose to base our perspective affects the outcome. I think the success of the Rebbe's movement can be attributed in large part to this approach: Each emissary moved to a new city with the firm belief that Judaism in that city revolved around him and the Rebbe's teachings, and so it became in reality. This might come across as offensive to some so I apologize for that in advance; in my last post I pointed out that viewing yourself as the center must be accompanied with all due humility, of knowing that G-d placed you in that position etc.

That may be well and good, but the Torah was given over 3300 years ago, long before modern science existed. Ancient Israel was the only ancient society that did not have observatories because they did not need them. The secrets of the universe had been entrusted to them at Sinai and their figures were more accurate than those their neighbors arrived at by scientific observation and calculation. In fact, I believe the Talmud refers to a dispute as to whether the sun goes around the earth or around the heavens in order to arrive back at its rising position.

It is true that "it is impossible for the unlearned man to be pious," but this has always meant learning in TORAH, not secular knowledge. In fact, the great Tzaddiq Rev Nachman of Breslov wrote things like "let no one called by the name of Jew so much as crack open a book of philosophy," and "the Jews are the people of pure faith with absolutely no sophistication whatsoever." It is only natural in today's world to appeal to the sophisticates whose influence has led so many to believe religion has been "disproved" (G-d forbid), but one need not be a sophisticate to be stong in the knowledge of Torah.

I realize that my own attitude might also be offensive, but I have been through quite a religious search to arrive where I have now, and I was not seeking the new or the novel or the trendy but rather what was ancient and true and sure. Modern science is a modern invention, and while it may be carried on in ways not inimical to Torah it is certainly not essential to it (other than qualified dayyanim having to understand the laws of physics and such like).

Albert Einstein may be the most famous Jew of the so-called "twentieth century," but he was not Orthodox at all. If people have the need to reconcile his influential theories with Torah so that moderns will not reject it out of hand, well and good, but Torah is absolute and Einstein's theories are not. Besides, again, Einstein's theories may be correct, but we can never know this, since they are not, so far as I know, subject to proof.

Let the sons of Yavan have their sophistication. Israel is G-d's pastoral tribe of pure faith to whom the secrets of the universe were given by the Mouth of G-d.

Fewer Jewish scientists, more Jewish shepherds!

I am surprised (or maybe I shouldn't be surprised) that none of the news media have mentioned that the Rebbe held a degree in engineering from the Sorbonne, and that he worked on top secret projects for the U.S. Navy during and after World War II before his late father-in-law, the previous Rebbe, passed away and named him as successor.

Thanks....I knew some Hassidic were that way...waiting for a messiah before Israel can begin again or something to that effect.

Which brings up the red calf again.....I knew some fellas in Mississippi that thought they had one ...I think we had a thread on that back a few years.