Streetwise: Most American men want a Harley

The Pittsburgh Post-Gazette ^ | Friday, April 23, 2004 | Lauren Rudd

[Willie Green]

What do men want more than anything else? No, not that ... well maybe that also; but that is not the topic of today's column. According to a survey of 1,000 men nationwide, besides wanting more money and keeping their wives happy, six out of 10 men dreamed of owning a Harley-Davidson motorcycle.

Steve Piehl, Harley-Davidson communication director, said, "When asked why they had not bought one, there were some interesting answers such as, 'My wife won't let me,' 'I don't have the time' and the one that really drives us crazy, 'Don't they cost at least $20,000?' "

The survey revealed that 75 percent of the respondents thought a Harley was too expensive. Not true, says Harley. "What we're finding out is that people know owning a Harley is cool, but they just do not have the facts. If they did, they'd have one in their garage right now," Piehl said.

[Conspiracy Guy]

I'll pass. Cool looking but that is the end of the appeal. I have read articles and seen videos of that thing for 10-15 years.

[archy]

Does the Egli Vincent come with an electric starter ? Something about kicking a 1,000 cc, high compression twin gives me pause...

Also true of the old Vincent Black Shadows and Black Lightnings, and the XLCH Sportsters with magneto ignition. It helped if you lived on a hill.

But yes, there's a cheater button on the Egli-Vincents.

Per specs:

New electric start, no kickstart. 12volt new Alton alternator, new Boyer ignition

[elbucko]

Used to be that you could pick up a Bonnie, Trophy, Tiger,

I had a little 500 Tiger when I was about 15 yrs. old. My parents didn't know about it. Great fun. It taught me how to ride (and handled well enough to save me from my mistakes). Sold it to buy a "B"-ville.

[Range Rover]

Egli -Jonesing, eh? can't say I blame you.

There is someone in California but I hear he's basically a resto guy (and Muy expensivo). This may be the link for the operation in AU that is remanufacturing Vinvent motors but something tells me that some other guy has a complete motor supply operation up and running.(I usually run into this guy at the shop on weekends...he knows, I'll ask) www.classicmotorbikes.com.au/

[archy]

Vincent would be a good tattoo. I still would choose the Velocette for my tattoo, I think. There are so many.

But...my question is: Why would anyone put a Rapide engine in an Indian frame? Makes no sense to me. Why not preserve the original Vincent?

To me, it would be like dropping a Velo Thruxton engine in an AJS frame. You could do it, but why on earth would you?

To gain the suspension and mass of the Indian [and improved Indian double seat of the period] for a road tourer, rather than an around-town or off-road bike. I've nothing at all against an original Rapide, and have about a third of a 1948 Rapide B-series collected and assembled, part by part. But I'd like to continue riding before that probable decade-long project is completed, and it wouldn't bother me a bit to have an extra Vincent motor available as a spare should something go wrong with the original. I don't believe I'd put a Thruxton into an AJay frame, but there are those who've done so with the 750cc Norton engines pulled from TriTon and NorVin conversions. But the velo desmos are very nicely at home in their own chassis, like the Vincent needing only better brakes to rollright into the XXIst Century, and possibly beyond.

[elbucko]

I know are posers for whom the bike is a fashion thing?

Oh, I agree, wholeheartedly. As one who has owned the same Harley, through thick and thin, for 36 years, I've noticed the nouveaux riche and their clothes and their rides. But they only ride Harley's for fashion, not the experience. The Rice Rockets and the open pipers bother me more than the stock brokers on a new FL.

[archy]

.....swwweeeeett.....

If you're lusting after the 150 CFM air compressor on the back, a deal can be arranged. Rotted airhoses included at no extra charge.

I've got a couple of Korean-era M211 GMC Deuce-and-a-halfs located too, with the GMC Hydramatic transmission burned out, as usual, and a couple of thoughts about what might be done about that.

[MineralMan]

"I don't believe I'd put a Thruxton into an AJay frame, but there are those who've done so with the 750cc Norton engines pulled from TriTon and NorVin conversions. But the velo desmos are very nicely at home in their own chassis, like the Vincent needing only better brakes to rollright into the XXIst Century, and possibly beyond."

I guess I'm sort of a purist when it comes to classic bikes. While some of the bitsas are OK as riders, and I have nothing against mixing bits on the more common bikes, there are too few of many of the rarer classics to justify doing things like putting a Vincent engine in some other frame, IMO.

Besides, comparing the value of a pristine Vincent against a Vincent/Indian bitsa, it's clear where the value is.

Sadly, I'm bikeless at the moment, but I hope to remedy that again soon. The only thing I'm sure of is that my next bike will be British, have one cylinder, and be no later than 1963. Beyond that, I'm pretty open, and will be looking for a bargain-priced obscure bike, I suspect.

Actually, an AJS sounds pretty good right now.

[-YYZ-]

You made the claim, you tell me which record. It certainly didn't hold the overall land speed record. If you can't supply a reference, how do you know you're right? Can you even tell me in what class?

[IamHD]

"even if I have an umnpleasant encounter with some moron is yapping on a cell while eating/putting on makeup/READING THE PAPER."

Gawd, I hear ya! When riding, one has to be on the lookout for ANYTHING and EVERYTHING! I don't know about you, but my eyes are scanning constantly, and consistently. I never assume anything, and I don't take any chances. I've known too many riders....experienced riders, that aren't around anymore because they weren't paying attention.

"Keep the rubber side down...always."

Same to you!

[madison10]

Harley-Smarley my guy wants a kayak. What a waste of yard space. Like he's gonna use it. Same with the motorcycle that he thinks he sorta wants. LOL

I think a year's membership at a golf course is much more useable and he might get alittle exercise. :)

[IamHD]

"the woman at home would have stabbed me in my sleep."

Yikes! lol

[archy]

I am very familiar with the Vincent. There was a BSA dealer in San Pedro, CA, that serviced them. I had the occasion to ride a few. They are excellent for the years they were built, but by the time the Sportster came along, the "Vinnie" was out of production. It is a comparison that cannot be fairly made and do equal justice to both examples.

Only in the sense that Indian was tinkering with a 100cc OHV *sport version* circa 1950, with H-D's flathead 750cc K Sportster not to come along until 1952, with the 883cc/55-inch OHV XL Sportster engine eventually introduced in 1957. It wasn't until 1972 that the 1000cc Ironhead Sportster engine was offered by the factory, Indian having only been ahead of the Milwaukee engineering team by 20 years.

As with the rear suspension on the big Indians that appeared in '46, not to show up on FLH Harletys until 1958, Indian was ahead on engineering points as usual. Pricey, but if they'd only been offered and available, Harley might have made some of their changes sooner, too

[jimt]

I know the Japanese have made great strides with their V-Twin copies. But the Harley is still unique.

Take a look at this torque (upper) curve.

I couldn't find one for your bike, but read a comment that "80% of the torque was available at 3500 rpm."

That's true of the Harley from virtually off-idle.

I used to think Harleys were junk and Harley owners crazy until a friend made me ride his SuperGlide. The attraction became immediately obvious.

[archy]

Harley-Smarley my guy wants a kayak. What a waste of yard space. Like he's gonna use it. Same with the motorcycle that he thinks he sorta wants. LOL

I think a year's membership at a golf course is much more useable and he might get alittle exercise. :)

I first got dragged kicking and screaming into kayaking after arriving here in Memphis in 1997. Aside from the sport of running the Mississippi at flood or surfing in the wake of barge river traffic, there are plenty of Mississippi tributaries to explore.

In general, I rate kayaking just behind motorbikes and just ahead of parachutes. A lot depends on locale and convenient local waterways, of course, and it's helpful to either own a pickup or have a real tolerant friend who does.

But there are worse hobbies....

[xsrdx]

Why would that be "disturbing"? It's not complicated; the "relative lack of sophistication" is awfully appealing to some.

My disquiet boils down to cost - if a FatBoy was $15k instead of $22k+, no sweat.

Alternatively, if a 180hp, 186 mph Yamaha R1 was $25k, I'd probably be less critical of HD.

To me, it's the same as selling a Dodge Ram diesel for twice as much as a Porsche 911.

[archy]

Sadly, I'm bikeless at the moment, but I hope to remedy that again soon. The only thing I'm sure of is that my next bike will be British, have one cylinder, and be no later than 1963. Beyond that, I'm pretty open, and will be looking for a bargain-priced obscure bike, I suspect.

Actually, an AJS sounds pretty good right now.

If you don't locate something soon and get back up on two shortly, there is a Britbike thumper, slightly removed, available with both the character you describe and modern electrics and factory spares support. You could do a lot worse, at least as an intirm measure.

[Betis70]

I've always like Brit bikes, though I've never ridden any motorcycle. If I did, I'd do the same as when I started shooting my gun--take a thorough safety course, then practice, practice, practice.

Discovery Home and Leisure had a recent show from the UK called "A Bike is Born" where the host restores a Bonneville (along with a 40's HD military bike). Damn nice bike.

[archy]

And if you're riding a thousand miles a day, carrying a passenger behind you, and pushing a windshield and large saddlebags, Harleys are still the bikes to beat.

When I am riding 1K/day with anything, I take my Goldwing, thank you.

Nothing wrong with a good Goldie out on the road . Likewise the Valkyrie has some serious possibilities. In either case, the old observation that there is no substitute for cubic inches is neatly and completely met.

[-YYZ-]

Well, my engine is more like a Ducati 998 Superbike engine copy retuned for torque. 90-degree V-twin, 996 cc, 10,000 rpm redline. But a similar sort of character, just with less peak torque but quite a bit more HP. And like I say, relative to the redline and the normal operating rpm, 3500 rpm on my bike is comparable to 2000 rpm on a Harley. My normal cruising rpm is about 4000, and when I whack the throttle open at that rpm it just goes, no need for downshifting.

But I'd venture to guess some of the Japanese cruisers engines have similar charts.

Anyway, my point was that I agree with you, flat torque curves are nice. And no, I don't think Harleys are junk either, what they do they do very nicely, just as well if not better than their Japanese imitators, which have crept up in price very close to what Harleys cost. If I was in the market for a cruiser or touring cruisers, other things being equal, I'd likely go for the Harley.