[Steve_Seattle]

"Also, it's hard to defend the modern West. Mohammedans look at the West and see homosexuality, abortion, drunkenness, drug usage and immorality all around."

This angle fascinates me because many of the Christians who are the most anti-Islamic share many of the Islamist critiques about the corruption of modern Western society. And, ironically, the liberals who are most likely to make excuses for Muslim extremism ("why they hate us") rarely mention these issues - they talk about Israel, oil, etc., but never admit that sexual permissiveness, alcohol use, etc., give fuel to the Islamists' rage. But it seems to me that from a traditional Christian point of view, Islam cannot be faught only - or even primarily - with weapons, but by returning to Christian values. It seems that the rise of Islamic rage has coincided very neatly with the decline of Christian values in the West.

[Monty22]

So now you're doing the 'it's our fault' argument even. Whose side are you two on?

[Iron Matron]

but never admit that sexual permissiveness, alcohol use, etc., give fuel to the Islamists' rage

The thing is, our culture is NONE OF THEIR FRIGGIN BUSINESS! THEY can just keep their petty rage to themselves! I dont care how corrupt other nations "think" we are - IT STILL IS NONE OF THEIR BUSINESS - ESPECIALLY IDOL--WORSHIPPING RAGHEADS!

[Guillermo]

Well said.

[Guillermo]

Also, another way I've heard it said (in regards to why both Europeans and Mohammedans hate us) is this: Europeans think Americans are too religious and Mohammedans think that Americans are not religious enough.

That about sums it up.

[Wolfhound777]

"Also, it's hard to defend the modern West. Mohammedans look at the West and see homosexuality, abortion, drunkenness, drug usage and immorality all around."


Spend some time in the Middle East. The same things go on with the Moose Limbs. Apparently if you are from Saudi Arabia but are on vacation in Dubai or Bahrain, Allah can't see you so you are wide open to sin.

[ought-six]

The Islamists don't hate us because America has abortion, porn, and rap music; it hates us because we are not Islamic. They've slaightered hundreds of thousands of Christians in Africa over the years, and those folks sure as hell didn't practice abortion, or watch porn, or listen to rap. It has nothing to do with our lifestyle, but everything to do with the fact we are not Moslems. That's a fact, Jack.

[Styria]

That's an interesting point. Nevertheless, the Netherlands, where drugs, homosexuality and other sexual permissiveness, abortion, and other things are specifically legalized, are not a primary target of Islam. Why don't they whine about Europe as much as they do us? Why haven't they had more terrorist attacks there?