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To: _Jim

To start with, the 747-100 that comprised FLT TWA800 was a on airframe (90,000 some odd hours) and had at one time been owned by Iran (WHO KNOWS how roughly they may have treated it) and had a well-known problem with wiring AND a previous accident (UA811) where the forward outward-opening cargo bay door blew open ..

And the 100 or so people who saw what looked like a missle...all at the same time...some on land...some on the water...couple in the air...mass hysteria?

179 posted on 08/13/2005 6:06:41 PM PDT by garybob (More sweat in training, less blood in combat.)
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To: garybob
And the 100 or so people who saw what looked like a missle.
Trumped - there are a number of reliable pireps (pilot reports) from that area/in those same flight lanes that discount any sort of 'missile' sighting ...
181 posted on 08/13/2005 6:08:41 PM PDT by _Jim (Listening 28.400 MHz USB most every day now ...)
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To: garybob

From: Ex_4A_appBB_MichaelJulianRussel.pdf


Mr. Russell is a civil engineer and was a passenger on a survey
vessel on July 17, 1996, which was proceeding from Moriches Inlet
to a dredge located approximately 1 mile southeast of the inlet.
He stated he was in the cabin seated next to a window and he
observed a white flash in the sky. According to Mr. Russell,
within a second of the white flash he observed a burst of fire
forming a huge fireball. He described the fireball as an object
or substance of extreme flammability being suddenly ignited as
opposed to an explosion expending side to side energy. He said
that black smoke appeared over the fireball immediately and white
smoke over the black smoke. Two large pieces engulfed in flames
fell to the ocean, side-by-side, one lower than the other. These
items fell straight down while it appeared the fireball remained
suspended in air still burning for a period of time.

Mr. Russell said that he did not hear an explosion, but advised
that the noise of the boat diesel engines is quite loud. In
addition, he related that he saw no projectiles or light from
surface to air and had not seen the aircraft flying. Also, he
emphasized that he was unaware of what he was observing and had
no idea that an aircraft was the object.

Following this event, according to Mr. Russell, the boat on which
he was a passenger proceeded to the crash site at best speed
(approximately 18 to 20 knots and a distance calculated to be
approximately 7 miles). He said he witnessed debris falling in
small pieces and described this as "raining debris." He also
radioed the Coast Guard and described that the boat began to
encounter debris when l/2 mile from the crash site. Upon getting
closer, he observed fire bubbling up and out of the ocean.


- - - - -



Ex_4B_WitnessGroupStudyReport.pdf

Observations by situation

Safety Board investigators determined the situation (land, sea, or air) of 699 of the
736 witnesses (refer to the Geographic information, which begins on page 25 of the
Witness Group Chairman?s Factual Report for more information about witness situation).

Of these 699 witnesses, 460 were on land, 202 were on water, and 37 were in aircraft.

Most of the witnesses on land were outside, and most of the witnesses on the water were in
boats. Table 1 provides more detail about the specific observations of the witnesses by
situation.


Table 1: Number of witnesses by situation and observation.



Witness situation

Item Land Sea Air Subtotal Unknown Total


Sight 420 195 37 652 18 670
Sound 167 48 0 215 24 239
Streak 172 78 6 256 2 258
Fireball (FB) 365 182 37 584 15 599
FB Split 122 61 16 199 1 200
FB Water 122 69 21 212 5 217
Total 460 202 37 --- 37 736



Pilot witnesses

Most of the airborne witnesses were pilots and experienced observers of aircraft.
Consequently, they are believed to be especially trained, qualified, and credible observers.
These observers can be especially useful because their statements to air traffic controllers
are often recorded, and because radar data can be used to determine their position and
altitude at a given time.


The captain of Eastwind flight 507 told the witness group that he had observed a
"pretty bright landing light" and that he watched it "on and off for over two minutes,
minimum, but I probably had seen him [the light] for over five minutes." (From page 19 of
the interview transcript, which appears as Appendix Z to the Witness Group Chairman?s
Factual Report).

The captain of Eastwind flight 507 was not the only airborne witness to report
seeing what he described as landing lights.

Document CC3-416 notes that Witness 702, who was operating a general aviation airplane
reported that he "spotted a white light which suddenly exploded into a giant red orange
ball."33

However, at 0042:11, Witness 702 (or another person aboard the same aircraft) advised
air traffic control, "we saw landing lights facing us and all of a sudden it turned
into a bright orange flame"

- - - - - -

Witness 138, Eastwind flight 507?s first officer,

Witness 329 also reported seeing an "explosion"
Witness 329 was the captain of Alitalia flight 609.
Alitalia flight 609 was located about 21 nautical miles
southwest of flight 800, at about 15,400 MSL


Witness 657 and Witness 658 reported that they first saw "flaming debris"
above them at an altitude of 4,000 to 5,000 feet
these witnesses were aboard a New York Air National Guard (NYANG)
HH-60 helicopter located about 15 nautical miles north-northeast of flight 800
at about 600 feet MSL.

Witness 684 was aboard , a NYANG C-130, and reported seeing a "fireball"
descend from about 4,000 feet MSL (CC3-480, interviewed July 18, 1996).
According to radar data, the C-130 was about 20 nautical miles northeast of
flight 800 at about 2,000 feet MSL

Witness 669 reported an "orange ball of light" and estimated that it was at
5,000-6,000 feet MSL (CC-283, interviewed July 26, 1996), and Witness 670
reported a "ball of flames" and estimated that it was at 5,000 to 5,500 feet MSL
(CC3-372, interviewed July 24, 1996). These witnesses were aboard a general
aviation airplane that was near Brookhaven Airport (about 18 nautical miles
northwest of flight 800) at about 3,100 feet MSL.


Witness 110, the captain of Great American Airways flight 507, reported seeing
a "flash" between 3,000 to 5,000 feet (CC3-85, interviewed July 24, 1996).

Witness 701, the first officer, reported seeing a "hot pink flash" below his
aircraft (CC3-376, interviewed July 25, 1996). At about the time of the last
secondary radar return from the accident airplane, Great American Airways
flight 507 was located about 76 nautical miles southwest of flight 800, at about
22,800 feet MSL.

? Witness 441, the captain of Piedmont Airlines flight 3112, reported seeing a
"bright orange ball of light" between 5,000 and 8,000 feet (CC3-245).
Witness 475, the first officer, reported seeing a "yellow ball" between 4,000 and
6,000 feet (CC3-246). Piedmont Airlines flight 3112 was located at about 19
nautical miles southwest of flight 800, at about 10,600 feet MSL.

? Witness 705 reported seeing "multiple explosions" at about 1,000 feet (CC3-
419, interviewed July 22, 1996). This witness was aboard a general aviation
airplane that was located about 12 nautical miles northeast of flight 800 at about
1,200 feet MSL.

? Witness 718, the pilot of an East Hampton Airlines commuter flight, reported
seeing a "big fireball" at about 4,000 feet (CC3-459, interviewed July 28,
1996). This flight was about 29 nautical miles northwest of flight 800, at about
2,000 feet MSL.







183 posted on 08/13/2005 6:13:43 PM PDT by _Jim (Listening 28.400 MHz USB most every day now ...)
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