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To: PoliSciStudent
Well, PSS, I'm glad you weren't a troll and did come back to continue the discussion. I hope you stick around and keep posing provoking questions. You are lucid, rational, not insulting, and well organized. We can use that around here.

Now, let me address some of your later points without going back and cutting and pasting.

It is clear to me from your comments that your earlier life experiences have biased you toward the socialist side. PolySci student, public policy analyst, etc would tend to make me think you lean in that direction. It's obvious your ideas differ from those of most of us here, but that's OK. Not likely we're going to change each other's minds, but it may make us consider some things we hadn't previously.

Does income disparity bother me? No. Is there any monetary level of disparity that would bother me? No. Would I feel the same way under a return to the fuedal system? No. Apples and Oranges. In a fuedal system no amount of hard work or study gets the peon off the land (other than military service.) Here and now, there are always ways to get ahead if you stop whining and take them.

I mean, hell, if you dangle a big enough carrot in front of me, I'd probably loot a pension fund or bilk little old ladies out of their life savings, whatever.

That, unfortunately say a lot about you. Especially if you think that everyone thinks that way. They don't. I don't. Some do. They need to be sanctioned, not restrict commerce in general because some may be unethical. Besides, until you codify "unethical" into crimminal behaviour, it's just another set of opinions.

I believe that the purpose of a national economy should be to provide the greatest good to the greatest number of the country's population. So, yeah, call me a socialist if you must, but if an economy reaches a level at which the vast majority of the rewards are going to a tiny fraction of the population, at the expense of the majority of the population, then, yes, I have a problem with it.

I believe that there should be NO purpose to a national economy. It just IS. The national economy is merely the aggregate of the individual microeconomic activites. To try to impose control over the national economy is an unacceptable intrusion into the actions of free individuals. (I know, I know, it's done constantly, but it's the principle.) As to the percentage of rewards going to the few, if it's the few that are putting out the effort, then so be it. I mentioned above that I am not encouraged by the attitude of today's youth. The majority attitude of most (including, unfortunately, my own 24 yr old son) is to work just enough to get along. Yes, there are exceptions, but the trend is depressing.

In addition, although I don't pretend to be an expert on it, I certainly hear a great deal from a wide variety of sources about the ingenuity that the wealthy demonstrate in finding offshore tex shelters and other creative ways of escaping tax bills. Do people here contest that those kinds of tax shelters exist and are used?

I don't. The politicians write laws carefully crafted to extract as much tax as they can without being thrown out by their constituents. The people examine these same laws to find ways to lessen the tax. In many cases the tax code is written in a way to encourage a certain social or economic behavior. Then they complain when too many people take advantage of it. Want to get rid of tax shelters? Write tax laws without loopholes. It's hard. How about a flat tax?

Several million people without health insurance. So? That's about 1% of the population. Almost insignificant statistically. Maybe it's not to them, but I am not responsible for their well-being. They are. Call me cruel.

I guess that's enough for now. I usually don't write this much, but I've been home from work for two weeks now with a lung infection, so have more time on the 'net. Yes, I have health insurance, but I have still had to write checks for over $1000 in the last two weeks for doctor's copay and procedures that weren't fully covered. But. hey, I'm insured.

Come back.

132 posted on 02/13/2004 5:22:45 PM PST by weaponeer
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To: weaponeer
Good post. I hope you feel better soon.

It is telling that this young man thinks that so many people are crooks that his statement about looting pension funds would go un-noticed.
133 posted on 02/13/2004 5:31:35 PM PST by radiohead
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To: weaponeer
Hi, weaponeer!

Thanks for your courteous greeting and for sharing your views. As you say, although it's unlikely that we're going to change each other's minds, that's really not the point of the exercise as far as I'm concerned - I'm honestly not trying to convince anyone of anything here - the goal is to keep an open mind and hear as many different perspectives on an issue as possible in order to arrive at the most responsible conclusion possible, which is why I'm here.

Okay, so I probably wouldn't bilk some old lady out of her life savings, you're right, I'm exaggerating. But I do think that corporate malfeasance does exist and one ignores that at one's peril. I think it's asking a lot of a business executive who spends all of their time and energy educating themselves on the issues most pertinent to their company's interests, to simultaneously be an authority on every subject area which may be directly or indirectly affected by that company's actions. If, for instance, an executive knew that their chosen method of disposal of hazardous waste byproducts was detrimental to the health of inhabitants in a nearby community, I certainly hope that they would chose to find some other solution to their problem. But is an executive trained to be an environmental public health specialist? No, of course not, that's not their job, but I still think someone who is thus trained has a role to play in that equation.

With respect to the uninsured, I managed to find a number for you. According to the US Census Bureau (http://www.census.gov/prod/2003pubs/p60-223.pdf for those of you who keep asking for links (-:), the number of uninsured in the US as of 2002 was 43.6 million, accounting for 15.2% of the population. Also worth mentioning, that figure is on the rise, up by 2.4 million people from the year before. C'mon, weaponeer, 1 out of every 6 people is not "statistically insignificant."

By the way, I hope your lung infection's clearing up. Are you alright?
136 posted on 02/13/2004 6:05:57 PM PST by PoliSciStudent
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