Tech bosses defend overseas hiring.

San Francisco Chronichle ^ | 1/8/04 | Carolyn Lochhead

[rightisright]

Washington -- Two leading Silicon Valley chief executives, reacting Wednesday to criticism they've shipped too many high-tech jobs overseas, defended hiring workers in India and China and warned that the United States and particularly California were in danger of losing their competitive edge to the Far East.

[LeftiesBinWhinin]

I used to work for Carly Fiorina.

She can kiss my big fat lily white a**.

[rightisright]

I don't have a problem with legal immigrants coming to America and taking advantage of the freedoms afforded to them here and making something of themselves. I would be a hypocrite of the highest order if I did have a problem with it because both of my parents are immigrants to this country.

That being said, I notice these hard working Silicon Valley immigrants came to the United States to become educated, to start their company and make their success. If they had attempted to do that in their native countries they would not have gone far. Now they seem to have forgotten the lessons of their success and have decided that bottom line is more important than loyalty to ones country.

[Dialup Llama]

>Bringing in immigrunts to do work that Americans won't is not free market... A free market pays the employee a 'fair' wage. If Americans will not take these jobs... they are undervalued and the pay should go up. That is supply and demand.

CEOs believe in supply demand and the free markets...for other people. CEOs want you to compete for wages (the free market) but they complain it is againt free markets for them to compete for workers.

[Dead Dog]

Or when the Army Air Corp risked life and limb bombing former Ford plants in Germany.

[Orangedog]

yeah, but they when they take 30-50 million with them, the trip down the drain isn't that unpleasant.

A friend of mine had a saying a long time ago: "Lide is a big sh*t-sandwich, and the more dough you have, the less sh*t you have to chew on."

[enviros_kill]

Looks very similar to Hillary Clinton for some reason . . .

Carly presented a keynote address at a conference I attended in 2003: she was ill-prepared and basically gave off a very uncomfortable feeling during her speech. She held several 8.5" x 11" sheets of paper in her hand the whole time and basically READ her speech in front of 700 people in a massive hotel conference hall. Of the four keynotes-all by CEOs-she was by far the worst. I did not like her.

[Pan_Yans Wife]

So it is the wage that is insulting? Americans won't reduce themselves to that low level of pay? WHY?

[Desron13]

"And we don't want companies outsourcing jobs to those who will perform the quality work for lower wages."

GRRRR... I generally hate it when I'm reduced to name calling, but with this comment I just can't help myself! BONEHEAD! To compete with those kinds of wages you would quickly end up living under a bridge in this country! The air in Chinese cities is so bad that you spend most of the day dislodging black boogers from your sinuses and 99% of the population lives on pennies a day and you want to compete with their wage structure? ARE YOU MAD? Competing in a free market is one thing. Competing with third world totalitarian dictatorships is quite another.

[BushCountry]

check your facts on some of those "companies created by foreigners" you list.

___________________ don't feel like using html........

Founders of some of the companies I listed. Check the rest of my list and it will pan out.

Intel Founder: Andrew S. Grove was born in Budapest, Hungary.

Sun Microsystems: Andreas von Bechtolsheim was born in Germany.

Computer Associates: Charles B. Wang was born in Shanghai

Solectron Corp: Winston H. Chen, a Taiwanese immigrant saved the company.

Frenchman Philippe Kahn founded Borland International Inc.

[WackyKat]

These corporate parasites will be screaming for government protection when those smart, loveable Chinese and Indians decide they can take over all those high-tech companies and maybe even come up with the next "new, big idea".

You better believe it. They want all the benefits of doing business and living in the US while they exploit Third World labor

[Jim Cane]

If Americans will not take these jobs... they are undervalued and the pay should go up. That is supply and demand.

Shhhh. The Free Traitors and Rove's NeoMonicas will flame you for pointing out their glaring ommission.

See, if the government employs tariffs (as proscribed in the U.S. Constitution) it's meddling in the free market.

Now if the government passes laws to make the labor pool larger, then it's not meddling.

If the government sunsets those laws causing the labor pool to be smaller, then it's meddling again.

The borders are to be wide open, whether it's for the exchange of products or labor, unless those products violate U.S. copyright laws, in which case, the Free Traitors suddenly like government interference in the Free Market and it becomes important to target those really cheap products to prevent them from entering our borders.

[Orangedog]

These corporate parasites will be screaming for government protection when those smart, loveable Chinese and Indians decide they can take over all those high-tech companies and maybe even come up with the next "new, big idea".

The situation is worse than many are willing to contemplate, let alone admit. When the next World War comes (and it WILL come as soon as the Chinese feel they are ready), what do you think will happen over here when all of those factories that the US government and companies have funded are nationalized? I may be wrong on this, but I don't think we have any companies based in the US that manufacture motherboards for PC's anymore. There are a lot of industries that are not here any longer. Sure, we could probably rebuild a good part of that capacity, but how many years would it take to ramp up domestic production of everything to make PC's to match what we import today? Imagine the average, base level PC costing about $5000 for two or three years, not to mention everything else.

[A. Pole]

and because many need to send kids to private schools because of our education system

Can you spell "busing"?

[Fee]

I think a number of states already made it illegal to outsource legal services to overseas practitioners. If anyone attempts to outsource CEO's, they will probably have Congress pass a law that prevents such act. Lawyers have job protection, why can' CEO's.

[Pan_Yans Wife]

Homeschool.

[Mr. Bird]

This is all about their bottom line and they have determined that they would rather not pay an American programmer $75,000 to do a job that an Indian and Chinese programmer can do for 1/3 of that.

There you have it. Why this is outrageous is what gets me. A confluence of advances in transportation, communication, training and education, and foreign countries' politics has created the opportunity for businesses to improve their bottom line. That's what businesses are supposed to do.

The trick for the U.S. is developing policies that make doing business in America, and employing U.S. citizens, the better business position. Some people think that means taxing the crap out of anything that moves in from outside our boundaries. I've never thought that raising taxes on anything was a good idea, but I could be wrong.

I don't know what the solutions are, but I'm not reading many viable options here, either.

[oceanview]

Intel was founded by Gordon Moore, who developed Moore's law. Sun had 4 founders, McNealy and Joy among them.

[BushCountry]

Intel Founders: Andy Grove, Robert Noyce, Gordon Moore

Source Forbes

Every company I listed had an immigrant that played a vital role in its founding.

[oceanview]

here's an easy one: tax their US profits on a sliding scale in proportion to their relative levels of employment in the US. So if Intel makes 60% of their profits in the US, and their workforce is 60% US, they pay no incremental. But if HP makes 95% of their profit in the US, and 30% of their workforce is offshore, they get hit with a surcharge.

The point is: we must raise the cost of employing offshore labor, because the alternative is that the cost of US labor must fall to that level, and that means that either the US standard of living for those workers will also fall to that level, or that our workers will abandon that field and turn it all over to foreign production and employment. The latter is happening now, applications to law schools are bulging while people are bailing out of engineering.

[BushCountry]

Heck, I didn't even have Borland (Frenchmen) listed which would have added another billion or two the total. };O)