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To: cpforlife.org
I thought this was a neat little study on John The Baptist and our Lord's Birth. It pionts out in Scripture the inside details. Some great Mines from the word of God.
Dave

On What Day Was Jesus Born?




While much of the world celebrates the birth of Jesus Christ on the 25th of December, can the actual day of Jesus' birth be determined from scripture? This question will be explored in some detail, and will yield a result that is quite intriguing. The first passage we will consider begins with the father of John the Baptist, Zacharias:

Luke 1:5 There was in the days of Herod, the king of Judaea, a certain priest named Zacharias, of the course of Abia: and his wife was of the daughters of Aaron, and her name was Elisabeth.

Luke 1:8 And it came to pass, that while he executed the priest's office before God in the order of his course, ...

Luke 1:23 And it came to pass, that, as soon as the days of his ministration were accomplished, he departed to his own house.
Luke 1:24 And after those days his wife Elisabeth conceived, ...

The clue given to us here is that Zacharias was of the "course" of Abia.

The 24 Courses of the Temple Priesthood.

King David on God's instructions (1 Chr 28:11-13) had divided the sons of Aaron into 24 groups (1 Chr 24:1-4), to setup a schedule by which the Temple of the Lord could be staffed with priests all year round in an orderly manner. After the 24 groups of priests were established, lots were drawn to determine the sequence in which each group would serve in the Temple. (1 Chr 24: 7-19). That sequence is as follows:

1 Chr 24:7 1. Jehoiarib 2. Jedaiah
1 Chr 24:8 3. Harim 4. Seorim
1 Chr 24:9 5. Malchijah 6. Mijamin
1 Chr 24:10 7. Hakkoz 8. Abijah
1 Chr 24:11 9. Jeshuah 10. Shecaniah
1 Chr 24:12 11. Eliashib 12. Jakim
1 Chr 24:13 13. Huppah 14. Jeshebeab
1 Chr 24:14 15. Bilgah 16. Immer
1 Chr 24:15 17. Hezir 18. Aphses
1 Chr 24:16 19. Pethahiah 20. Jehezekel
1 Chr 24:17 21. Jachim 22. Gamul
1 Chr 24:18 23. Delaiah 24. Maaziah

1 Chr 24:19 These were the orderings of them in their service to come into the house of the LORD, according to their manner, under Aaron their father, as the LORD God of Israel had commanded him.

Now each one of the 24 "courses" of priests would begin and end their service in the Temple on the Sabbath, a tour of duty being for one week (2 Chr 23:8, 1 Chr 9:25). On three occasions during the year, all the men of Israel were required to travel to Jerusalem for festivals of the Lord, so on those occasions all the priests would be needed in the Temple to accommodate the crowds. Those three festivals were Unleavened Bread, Pentecost, and Tabernacles (Deut 16:16).

The Yearly Cycle of Service in the Temple.

The Jewish calendar begins in the spring, during the month of Nisan, so the first "course" of priests, would be that of the family of Jehoiarib, who would serve for seven days. The second week would then be the responsibility of the family of Jedaiah. The third week would be the feast of Unleavened Bread, and all priests would be present for service. Then the schedule would resume with the third course of priests, the family of Harim. By this plan, when the 24th course was completed, the general cycle of courses would repeat. This schedule would cover 51 weeks or 357 days, enough for the lunar Jewish calendar (about 354 days). So, in a period of a year, each group of priests would serve in the Temple twice on their scheduled course, in addition to the 3 major festivals, for a total of about five weeks of duty.

The Conception of John the Baptist.

Now back to Zacharias, the father of John the Baptist.

Luke 1:23 And it came to pass, that, as soon as the days of his ministration were accomplished, he departed to his own house.
Luke 1:24 And after those days his wife Elisabeth conceived, ...

Beginning with the first month, Nisan, in the spring (March-April), the schedule of the priest's courses would result with Zacharias serving during the 10th week of the year. This is because he was a member of the course of Abia (Abijah), the 8th course, and both the Feast of Unleavened Bread (15-21 Nisan) and Pentecost (6 Sivan) would have occurred before his scheduled duty. This places Zacharias' administration in the Temple as beginning on the second Sabbath of the third month, Sivan (May-June).

1st Month 2nd Month 3rd Month
Abib - Nisan
(March - April) Zif - Iyyar
(April - May) Sivan
(May - June)
First
Week Jehoiarib (1) Seorim (4) All Priests
(Pentecost)
Second
Week Jedaiah (2) Malchijah (5) Abijah (8)
Third
Week All Priests
(Feast of Unleavened Bread) Mijamin (6) Jeshuah (9)
Fourth
Week Harim (3) Hakkoz (7) Shecaniah (10)

Having completed his Temple service on the third Sabbath of Sivan, Zacharias returned home and soon conceived his son John. So John the Baptist was probably conceived shortly after the third Sabbath of the month of Sivan.

The Conception of Jesus Christ.

Now the reason that the information about John is important, is because according to Luke, Jesus was conceived by the Holy Spirit in the sixth month of Elisabeth's pregnancy:

Luke 1:24 And after those days his wife Elisabeth conceived, and hid herself five months, saying,
Luke 1:25 Thus hath the Lord dealt with me in the days wherein he looked on me, to take away my reproach among men.
Luke 1:26 And in the sixth month the angel Gabriel was sent from God unto a city of Galilee, named Nazareth,
Luke 1:27 To a virgin espoused to a man whose name was Joseph, of the house of David; and the virgin's name was Mary.

Note that verse 26 above refers to the sixth month of Elisabeth's pregnancy, not Elul, the sixth month of the Hebrew calendar, and this is made plain by the context of verse 24 and again in verse 36:

Luke 1:36 And, behold, thy cousin Elisabeth, she hath also conceived a son in her old age: and this is the sixth month with her, who was called barren.

Now working from the information about John's conception late in the third month, Sivan, and advancing six months, we arrive late in the 9th month of Kislev (Nov-Dec) for the time frame for the conception of Jesus. It is notable here that the first day of the Jewish festival of Hanukkah, the Festival of Lights, is celebrated on the 25th day of Kislev, and Jesus is called the light of the world (John 8:12, 9:5, 12:46). This does not appear to be a mere coincidence. In the book of John, Hanukkah is called the feast of dedication (John 10:22). Hanukkah is an eight day festival, celebrating the relighting of the menorah in the rededicated Temple, which according to the story, stayed lit miraculously for eight days on only one day's supply of oil.

The Birth of John the Baptist.

Based on a conception shortly after the third Sabbath of the month of Sivan, projecting forward an average term of about 10 lunar months (40 weeks), we arrive in the month of Nisan. It would appear that John the Baptist may have been born in the middle of the month, which would coincide with Passover and the Feast of Unleavened Bread. It is interesting to note, that even today, it is customary for the Jews to set out a special goblet of wine during the Passover Seder meal, in anticipation of the arrival of Elijah that week, which is based on the prophecy of Malachi:

Mal 4:5 Behold, I will send you Elijah the prophet before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the LORD:

Jesus identified John as the "Elijah" that the Jews had expected:

Mat 17:10 And his disciples asked him, saying, Why then say the scribes that Elias must first come?
Mat 17:11 And Jesus answered and said unto them, Elias truly shall first come, and restore all things.
Mat 17:12 But I say unto you, That Elias is come already, and they knew him not, but have done unto him whatsoever they listed. Likewise shall also the Son of man suffer of them.
Mat 17:13 Then the disciples understood that he spake unto them of John the Baptist.

The angel that appeared to Zacharias in the temple also indicated that John would be the expected "Elias":

Luke 1:17 And he shall go before him in the spirit and power of Elias, to turn the hearts of the fathers to the children, and the disobedient to the wisdom of the just; to make ready a people prepared for the Lord.

So then, the Feast of Unleavened Bread begins on the 15th day of the 1st month, Nisan, and this is a likely date for the birth of John the Baptist, the expected "Elijah".

The Birth of Jesus Christ.

Since Jesus was conceived six months after John the Baptist, and we have established a likely date for John's birth, we need only move six months farther down the Jewish calender to arrive at a likely date for the birth of Jesus. From the 15th day of the 1st month, Nisan, we go to the 15th day of the 7th month, Tishri. And what do we find on that date? It is the festival of Tabernacles! The 15th day of Tishri begins the third and last festival of the year to which all the men of Israel were to gather in Jerusalem for Temple services. (Lev 23:34)

Immanuel.

Isa 7:14 Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign; Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel.

Immanuel means "God with us". The Son of God had come to dwell with, or tabernacle on earth with His people.

John 1:14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

The word in the Hebrew for dwelt is succah and the name of the Feast of Tabernacles in Hebrew is Sukkot, a festival of rejoicing and celebration:

Luke 2:7 And she brought forth her firstborn son, and wrapped him in swaddling clothes, and laid him in a manger; because there was no room for them in the inn.
Luke 2:8 And there were in the same country shepherds abiding in the field, keeping watch over their flock by night.
Luke 2:9 And, lo, the angel of the Lord came upon them, and the glory of the Lord shone round about them: and they were sore afraid.
Luke 2:10 And the angel said unto them, Fear not: for, behold, I bring you good tidings of great joy, which shall be to all people.
Luke 2:11 For unto you is born this day in the city of David a Saviour, which is Christ the Lord.

Why was there no room at the inn? Bethlehem is only about 5 miles from Jerusalem, and all the men of Israel had come to attend the festival of Tabernacles as required by the law of Moses. Every room for miles around Jerusalem would have been already taken by pilgrims, so all that Mary and Joseph could find for shelter was a stable.

Also of note is the fact that the Feast of Tabernacles is an eight day feast (Lev 23:36, 39). Why eight days? It may be because an infant was dedicated to God by performing circumcision on the eighth day after birth:

Luke 2:21 And when eight days were accomplished for the circumcising of the child, his name was called JESUS, which was so named of the angel before he was conceived in the womb.

So the infant Jesus would have been circumcised on the eighth and last day of the Feast of Tabernacles, a Sabbath day. The Jews today consider this a separate festival from Tabernacles, and they call it Shemini Atzeret.

Conclusion

So, if you have followed the above reasoning, based on the scriptural evidence, a case can apparently be made that Jesus Christ was born on the 15th day of the month of Tishri, on the first day of the Feast of Tabernacles, which corresponds to the September - October timeframe of our present calendar!

Jewish month Begins the
New moon of John the Baptist Jesus
1. Abib / Nisan March-April Birth of John
15 Nisan 4

2. Zif / Iyyar April-May 5
3. Sivan May-June Conception of John
after 3rd Sabbath
6
4. Tammuz June-July 1 7
5. Ab / Av July-August 2 8
6. Elul August-September 3 9
7. Ethanim / Tishri September-October 4
Birth of Jesus
15 Tishri

8. Bul / Marheshvan / Heshvan October-November 5

9. Chisleu / Chislev / Kislev November-December 6
Conception of Jesus
25 Kislev ?

10. Tebeth / Tevet December-January 7 1
11. Shebat / Shevat January-February 8 2
12. Adar February-March 9 3

Tabernacles Future Fulfillment

It is also interesting to note the Tabernacles was a feast in ingathering of the Harvest (Exo 23:16 and 34:22). If Jesus' first coming was indeed on 15 Tishri, the first day of Tabernacles, then it is quite reasonable to presume that the harvest of this earth, the ingathering of the second coming of Jesus Christ, will also occur on precisely the same date. The unknown factor would be the year that this would happen.
24 posted on 12/25/2003 4:47:40 AM PST by RaceBannon
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To: RaceBannon
Great post! I am running into more and more Christians who are observing Tabernacles and Passover, while paying little, if any, attention to Christmas.
27 posted on 12/25/2003 7:48:24 AM PST by who knows what evil? (Under the personal care of the Great Physician...full coverage.)
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To: RaceBannon; John R. (Bob) Locke; cpforlife.org; concerned about politics; MHGinTN; Coleus; ...
Very interesting, commentary, Race. I think that is the way I heard the conception date explained by Pastor Arnold Murray a couple of years ago, but I didn't have a written transcript. Thanks!

Have you ever seen THIS theory of Christ's birthdate being not on Tishri 15, but on Tishri 1 Rosh Hashanaah, THE DAY OF TRUMPETS, (which fell on SEPTEMBER 11, 3 B.C.), from David Chilton's DAYS OF VENGEANCE (an exposition of the book of Revelation). Perhaps the two-week difference can be explained by the fact that Mary was heavy with child http://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/Luk/Luk002.html#5 . What must have been a grueling trip for a woman in her condition, would most likely have brought the birth to fruition a tad early by our standards, but right on schedule, according to God's plan. For, reading again in Luke 2, if I am interpreting this correctly, it appears that Mary was confined for seven days, according to the law, and the child was circumcised IN BETHLEHEM [which means literally 'house of Bread', fitting for 'The Bread of Life'] on the EIGHTH DAY, and THEN was taken to JERUSALEM to be presented to the LORD during the FEAST OF TABERNACLES, thus fulfilling both the DAY OF TRUMPETS AND the FEAST OF TABERNACLES. I have added links to many of the Bible passages mentioned, and in addition, links to the Treasury of Scripture Knowledge, which will show historical precedences and progression of God's word through the ages. For any I missed, find here: http://www.blueletterbible.org/index.html . I would advise that one read the main part of the text through first, then come back and read the links and comments in brackets, [ ]'s, for further understanding. Or maybe you would find it easier to read it first at the source, then come back and read this post. [ Days of Vengeance, Rev. 1-2. See pages 326 through 329 http://freebooks.entrewave.com/freebooks/docs/html/dcdv/dcdv.html ]. It took me a couple of readings before I got all of it. I got goosebumps this morning when I realized what he was saying about even the order of the stars coinciding with the order of the tribes around the tabernacle. Please enjoy.

[ Luk 2:21 And WHEN EIGHT DAYS WERE ACCOMPLISHED FOR THE CIRCUMCISING of the child, his name was called JESUS, which was so named of the angel before he was conceived in the womb. http://www.blueletterbible.org/tsk_b/Luk/2/21.html

Luk 2:22 And WHEN THE DAYS OF HER PURIFICATION ACCORDING TO THE LAW OF MOSES WERE ACCOMPLISHED, THEY BROUGHT HIM TO JERUSALEM, TO PRESENT [HIM] TO THE LORD;
http://www.blueletterbible.org/tsk_b/Luk/2/22.html

Luk 2:23 (As it is written in the law of the Lord, Every male that openeth the womb shall be called holy to the Lord;) http://www.blueletterbible.org/tsk_b/Luk/2/23.html

Luk 2:24 And to offer a sacrifice according to that which is said in the law of the Lord, A pair of turtledoves, or two young pigeons.

Luk 2:25 And, behold, there was a man in Jerusalem, whose name [was] Simeon; and the same man [was] just and devout, waiting for the consolation of Israel: and the Holy Ghost was upon him.

Luk 2:26 And it was revealed unto him by the Holy Ghost, that he should not see death, before he had seen the Lord's Christ.

Luk 2:27 And he came by the Spirit into the temple: and when the parents brought in the child Jesus, to do for him after the custom of the law,

Luk 2:28 Then took he him up in his arms, and blessed God, and said,

Luk 2:29 Lord, now lettest thou thy servant depart in peace, according to thy word:

Luk 2:30 For mine eyes have seen thy salvation, http://www.blueletterbible.org/tsk_b/Luk/2/30.html

Luk 2:31 Which thou hast prepared before the face of all people;

Luk 2:32 A light to lighten the Gentiles, and the glory of thy people Israel. http://www.blueletterbible.org/tsk_b/Luk/2/32.html

Luk 2:33 And Joseph and his mother marvelled at those things which were spoken of him.

Luk 2:34 And Simeon blessed them, and said unto Mary his mother, Behold, this [child] is set for the fall and rising again of many in Israel; and for a sign which shall be spoken against; http://www.blueletterbible.org/tsk_b/Luk/2/34.html

Luk 2:35 (Yea, a sword shall pierce through thy own soul also,) that the thoughts of many hearts may be revealed. http://www.blueletterbible.org/tsk_b/Luk/2/35.html

Luk 2:36 And there was one Anna, a prophetess, the daughter of Phanuel, of the tribe of Aser: she was of a great age, and had lived with an husband seven years from her virginity;

Luk 2:37 And she [was] a widow of about fourscore and four years, which departed not from the temple, but served [God] with fastings and prayers night and day. http://www.blueletterbible.org/tsk_b/Luk/2/37.html

Luk 2:38 And she coming in that instant gave thanks likewise unto the Lord, and spake of him to all them that looked for redemption in Jerusalem. http://www.blueletterbible.org/tsk_b/Luk/2/38.html

Luk 2:39 And when they had performed all things according to the law of the Lord, they returned into Galilee, to their own city Nazareth. http://www.blueletterbible.org/tsk_b/Luk/2/39.html ]


*** Now, from DAYS OF VENGEANCE, by David Chilton:

THE HOLY WAR Revelation 12:1-3

[ http://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/Rev/Rev012.html#top ]

p. 326-329

[ Rev 12:1 And there appeared a great wonder in heaven; a woman clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet, and upon her head a crown of twelve stars: http://www.blueletterbible.org/tsk_b/Rev/12/1.html

Rev 12:2 And she being with child cried, travailing in birth, and pained to be delivered.
http://www.blueletterbible.org/tsk_b/Rev/12/2.html ]

PART FOUR: THE SEVEN TRUMPETS

p. 326
As the pregnant woman approaches the time to give birth, She writhes and cries out in her labor pains, Thus were we before Thee, O LORD. (Isa. 26:17 http://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/Isa/Isa026.html#17 )

As prophetic revelation progresses in Scripture, it becomes increasingly clear that the Old Covenant Church is laboring to bring forth the Christ (cf. Mic. 4:9-5:9
http://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/Mic/Mic004.html#9 and
http://www.blueletterbible.org/tsk_b/Mic/4/9.html and
http://www.blueletterbible.org/tsk_b/Mic/4/10.html and
http://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/Mic/Mic005.html and
http://www.blueletterbible.org/tsk_b/Mic/5/9.html ): He was the basic promise of the Abrahamic covenant. This is what Israel was waiting for, being in labor and pain throughout her existence. This is the most essential meaning of Israel’s history, apart from which it has no significance: the bearing of the Manchild (cf. John 16:20-22
[ http://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/Jhn/Jhn016.html#20 and http://www.blueletterbible.org/tsk_b/Jhn/16/20.html and http://www.blueletterbible.org/tsk_b/Jhn/16/21.html and http://www.blueletterbible.org/tsk_b/Jhn/16/22.html ], the Savior of the world. From the protevangelium to the Flood, from the Abrahamic Covenant through the slavery in Egypt, the Exodus, the settling of Canaan, the Babylonian Captivity, the return from exile, and the suffering under the Greeks and the Remans, Israel was laboring to give birth to the Christ, to bring in the Messianic age.

In the midst of the Church’s struggles, therefore, she cried out. This verb (Icrazd) has special significance in Scripture, generally being used for an oath or the solemn proclamation of God’s revelation; it is often used of God’s servants speaking in the face of opposition. 7 Here it has reference to the Church’s official declaration of the Word of God, the prophecy that she uttered as she travailed in birth. This was the essence of all prophetic revelation, to bear witness to the Christ (John 5:39, 45-46; Luke 24:25-27; Acts 3:24; 13:27).

[ http://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/Jhn/Jhn005.html#39
http://www.blueletterbible.org/tsk_b/Jhn/5/39.html
http://www.blueletterbible.org/tsk_b/Jhn/5/45.html
http://www.blueletterbible.org/tsk_b/Jhn/5/46.html
http://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/Luk/Luk024.html#25
http://www.blueletterbible.org/tsk_b/Luk/24/25.html
http://www.blueletterbible.org/tsk_b/Luk/24/26.html
http://www.blueletterbible.org/tsk_b/Luk/24/27.html
http://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/Act/Act003.html#24
http://www.blueletterbible.org/tsk_b/Act/3/24.html

http://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/Act/Act013.html#27 Read the entire chapter. The desciples fasted and prayed before Paul and Barnabas were sent out on the following mission. Note the sorcerer Barjesus, which means son of Jesus; Elymas was his Arab name. He was evil incarnate:

Act 13:9 Then Saul, (who also [is called] Paul,) filled with the Holy Ghost, set his eyes on him,

Act 13:10 And said, O full of all subtilty and all mischief, [thou] child of the devil, [thou] enemy of all righteousness, wilt thou not cease to pervert the right ways of the Lord?

After Barjesus is restrained, they go on their way to announce the kingdom being taken from the false shepherds and given to the gentiles, to those who would 'bear fruit' for the kingdom of God. After re-capping the history of the Israelites, we read this:

Act 13:44 And the next sabbath day came almost the whole city together to hear the word of God.

Act 13:45 But when the Jews saw the multitudes, they were filled with envy, and spake against those things which were spoken by Paul, contradicting and blaspheming.

Act 13:46 Then Paul and Barnabas waxed bold, and said, It was necessary that the word of God should first have been spoken to you: but seeing ye put it from you, and judge yourselves unworthy of everlasting life, lo, we turn to the Gentiles. ]


It is important to recognize the relationship of all this to the very obvious astronomical symbolism in the text. The word St. John uses for sign was the term used in the ancient world to describe the constellations of the Zodiac; St. John’s model for this vision of the Church is the constellation of Virgo, which does have a “crown” of twelve stars. 8 It seems likely that the

p. 327
twelve stars also represent the twelve signs of the Zodiac, from ancient times regarded as symbols of the twelve tribes of Israel; in Joseph’s famous dream his father, mother, and the twelve tribes were symbolized by the sun, the moon, and twelve stars or constellations (Gen. 37:9 http://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/Gen/Gen037.html#9 Note also the sons of the bondwoman who seek to kill the heir.). 9 We have already seen how the divine arrangement of Israel’s tribes around the Tabernacle (Num. 2 http://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/Num/Num002.html#top ) corresponded to the zodiacal order of the constellations. 10 The Seventh Trumpet of 11:15 brought us to Rosh Hashanah: the Day of Trumpets, the first day of the seventh month, the first day of the new year, the Day of the enthronement of the King of kings in the New Creation. The statement that Virgo is “crowned” with the twelve constellations, therefore, “means that she is the one among the twelve who reigns at the time,” i.e. during the seventh month, just as “the Scorpion’s claws seem about to catch the Virgin.” 11 In terms of astral symbolism, therefore, the birth of the Messiah takes place on the Day of Trumpets.

It is interesting that by pursuing several lines of very convincing evidence, Prof. Ernest Martin carefully and painstakingly narrows down the probable date of Christ’s birth to sometime in September, 3 B.C. 12 Martin then adds the icing to the cake: “In the period of Christ’s birth, the Sun entered the head-position of the Woman about August 13, and exited from her feet about October 2. But the Apostle John saw the scene when the Sun ‘clothes’ or ‘adorns’ the Woman. This surely indi- cates that the position of the Sun in the vision was located somewhere mid-bodied of the Woman — between the neck and knees. (The sun could hardly be said to ‘clothe’ the Woman if it were situated in her face or near her feet.)

“The only time in the year that the Sun could be in a position to ‘clothe’ this celestial Woman (to be mid-bodied) is when it was

p. 328
located between about 150 and 170 degrees along the ecliptic. This ‘clothing’ of the Woman by the Sun occurs for a 20-day period each year. This 20-degree spread could indicate the general time when Christ was born. In 3 B. C., the Sun would have entered this celestial region about August 27 and exited from it about September 15. If John in the Book of Revelation is associating the birth of Christ with the period when the Sun is mid-bodied to the Woman, then Christ would have had to be born within that 20-day period. From the point of view of the Magi (who were astrologers), this would have been the only logical sign under which the Jewish Messiah might be born — especially if he were to be born of a virgin. Even today, astrologers recognize that the sign of Virgo is the one which has reference to a messianic world ruler to be born of a virgin. . . .

“But there is a way to arrive at a much closer time for Christ’s birth than a simple 20-day period. The position of the Moon in John’s vision could pinpoint the nativity to within a day – perhaps to an hour period or less. This may seem absurd, but it is entirely possible. “The key is the Moon.

The apostle said it was located ‘under her feet.’ What does the word ‘under’ signify in this case? Does it mean the Woman of the vision was standing on the Moon when John observed it or does it mean her feet were positioned slightly above the Moon? John does not tell us. This, however, is not of major consequence in using the Moon to answer our question because it would only involve the difference of a degree or two. Since the feet of Virgo the Virgin represent the last 7 degrees of the constellation (in the time of Christ this would have been be- tween about 180 and 187 degrees along the ecliptic), the Moon has to be positioned somewhere under that 7-degree arc. But the Moon also has to be in that exact location when the Sun is mid- bodied to Virgo. *** In the year 3 B. C., these two factors came to precise agreement for less than two hours, as observed from Palestine or Patmos, on September 11. The relationship began about 6:15 P.M. (sunset), and lasted until around 7:45 P.M. (moonset). This is the only day in the whole year that this could have taken place.”lJ

p. 329
***An added bonus: SUNDOWN ON SEPTEMBER 11, 3 B. C., WAS THE BEGINNING OF TISHRI 1 in the Jewish calendar – ROSH HASHANASH, THE DAY OF TRUMPETS! 14 Martin summarizes: “THE CENTRAL THEME OF THE DAY OF TRUMPETS IS CLEARLY THAT OF ENTHRONEMENT OF THE GREAT KING OF KINGS. This was the general understanding of the day in early Judaism – and it certainly is that of the New Testament. In Revelation 11:15 ( http://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/Rev/Rev011.html#15 and http://www.blueletterbible.org/tsk_b/Rev/11/15.html ) the seventh angel sounds his ‘LAST TRUMP’ and THE KINGDOMS OF THIS WORLD BECOME [BECAME] THOSE OF CHRIST. This happens at a time when a woman is seen in heaven with twelve stars around her head and the Sun mid-bodied to her, with the Moon under her feet. This is clearly a New Moon scene for the Day of Trumpets.” 15......
___________________________________________________________
Footnotes:

7. See, e.g., Matt. 27:50; Mark 3:11; 5:7; 9:24; 10:48; 15:13; John 1:15; 7:28; 12:13, 44; Acts 19:28, 32, 34; Rem. 9:27; Gal. 4:6; James 5:4; and see its use especially in Revelation: 6:10; 7:2, 10; 10:3; 14:15; 18:2,18-19; 19:17. 8. The twelve stars are: “(l) Pi, (2) Nu, (3) Beta (near the ecliptic), (4) Sigma, (5) Chi, (6) Iota – these six stars form the southern hemisphere around the head of Virgo. Then there are (7) Theta, (8) Star 60, (9) Delta, (10) Star 93, (11) Beta (the second magnitude star), (12) Omicron – these last six form the northern hemisphere around the head of Virgo. All these stars are visible ones that could have been seen by observers.” Ernest L. Martin, The Birth of Christ Recalculated (Pasadena, CA: Foundation for Biblical Research, 2nd cd., 1980), p. 159.

9. See Josephus, Antiquities of the Jews, iii.vii.7, where he explains the twelve stones in the high priest’s breastplate, representing the twelve tribes of Israel (Ex. 28:17-21 http://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/Exd/Exd028.html#17 ), in terms of the Zodiac. 10. See comments on Revelation 4:7; cf. Ernest L. Martin, The Birth of Christ Recahdated, pp. 168f. 11. Farrer, The Revelation of St. John the Divine (Oxford: At the Claren- don Press, 1964), p. 141. 12. It is generally held that Herod the Great died in 4 B. C., and therefore that Christ was born in 6 or 7 B.C. Martin, however, presents a detailed and persuasive case for Herod’s death occurring in 1 B.C. See his Birth of Christ Recalculated, pp. 26-131.

13. Ibid., pp. 146f. What about December 25, the traditional date of the Nativity? As Martin demonstrates, there were numerous startling astronomical phenomena taking place during the years 3-2 B.C. Chief among these celestial events was the fact that Jupiter, recognized by Jews and Gentiles alike as the “Planet of the Messiah:’ was located in Virgo’s womb and standing still, directly over Bethlehem, on December 25, 2 B. C., when the Child was a little over a year old. (Matthew states that the holy family was settled in a house, not in a stable, by the time the Magi visited [Matt. 2:11 http://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/Mat/Mat002.html#11 and http://www.blueletterbible.org/tsk_b/Mat/2/11.html ]. Moreover, Herod ordered the slaughter of the innocents “from two years old and under, according to the time which he had ascertained from the Magi” [Matt. 2:16 http://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/Mat/Mat002.html#16 and
http://www.blueletterbible.org/tsk_b/Mat/2/16.html ], indicating that the Child was no longer a newborn.) For a full account of the astronomical events of 3-2 B.c., see Martin, pp. 4-25, 144-77.
14. Ibid., pp. 152ff.
15. Ibid., p. 158.

From DAYS OF VENGEANCE, by David Chilton
http://freebooks.entrewave.com/freebooks/docs/html/dcdv/dcdv.html

We've gone round and round at our house about whether to celebrate Christmas or not. Don't do as I do, but we decided that WE aren't celebrating the Pagan aspects; we are celebrating that the TRUE LIGHT came into the world even when He entered Mary's womb. John the Baptist was only 6 months in the womb, and even he leapt for joy! It was an earth-shaking event. As Pastor Murray has said, if it weren't for Christmas, a lot of kids would never hear about Jesus. It's also a time for people to get together with families and friends, and to make memories to hold on to when the inevitable separations come, and also to think of and care for the less fortunate. A lot of us get so caught up in the day-to-day struggle, that the important things in life often get shuttled to the back burner. Christmas forces many of us to stop and reflect. It also makes a lot of people nicer than they are the rest of the year. If this only happens once a year, it's unfortunate, but it's better than nothing, and helps set a better tone for the new year. God says that what the devil intends for evil, He will turn to His glory. If we are wrong to celebrate His birth, I hope He will forgive us. We will put more study and prayer into it, and hope He will guide us toward the right choice in the future.

[And we will pray for the kill-joys who thought it would be a good time to put a damper on the day by conjuring up terrorism.]

Psa 2:12 Kiss the Son, lest he be angry, and ye perish [from] the way, when his wrath is kindled but a little. Blessed [are] all they that put their trust in him.
http://www.blueletterbible.org/tsk_b/Psa/2/12.html and

Deu 10:14 Behold, the heaven and the heaven of heavens [is] the LORD'S thy God, the earth [also], with all that therein [is].
http://www.blueletterbible.org/tsk_b/Deu/10/14.html

Oba 1:4 Though thou exalt [thyself] as the eagle, and though thou set thy nest among the stars, thence will I bring thee down, saith the LORD. http://www.blueletterbible.org/tsk_b/Oba/1/4.html

Psa 2:6 Yet have I set my king upon my holy hill of Zion.
http://www.blueletterbible.org/tsk_b/Psa/2/6.html


+++ JESUS IS GOD [ I ran across this recently, and am going to spend this year giving it out to friends and strangers.] http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/pentecostal/One-Ch4.htm#t4


Isa 9:6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.
http://www.blueletterbible.org/tsk_b/Isa/9/6.html

Luk 2:14 Glory to God in the highest, and on earth peace, good will toward men. http://www.blueletterbible.org/tsk_b/Luk/2/14.html

Kids want me off-line now so they can try out their new computer.
41 posted on 12/28/2003 11:08:32 AM PST by Ethan_Allen (Gen. 32:24-32 'man'=Jesus http://www.preteristarchive.com/Jesus_is_Israel/index.html)
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