JACKO ABUSE ACCUSER, KIN STILL LIVING A NIGHTMARE 10 YRS. LATER

New York Post ^ | November 23, 2003 | LINDA STASI

[Bubba_Leroy]

ACCUSING Michael Jackson of sexual abuse comes with a hefty price tag.

A decade after shocking the world with allegations in 1993 that he was molested by the bizarro superstar, the lives of a California man and his relatives remain a living hell.

[Conservative til I die]

BS. I hug, cuddle and kiss my nieces, nephews and my friends childrens too. And its not just because I'm femaile, so does my father.

You sound like you have trouble setting appropriate boundaries yourself. And that's *all* I'll say about that, lest I open myself up to any trouble.

[tracer]

More evidence of the superiority of the "Old World" approach to such obscene outrages.

Deterrrance and "closure," all in one private, personal, limited, efficient, effective, memorable, and lawyer-less "stroke of the brush," -- as it were....

[Conservative til I die]

There is a line, however. And I think we'd need more of a description to determine the appropriateness. "Hug" and "cuddle" are a bit vague. Depends on the type of hug or cuddle, the length, the frequency, the body language, etc.

[RantEng]

Move over O.J.

[Conservative til I die]

I haven't read the Jackson charges, I haven't been following the story,

Gee, no shit.

I really could care less and don't consider it news.

Yeah, sure.

How about fellatio and mutual masturbation? Because that's what Jackson is accused of, among other things.

[Conservative til I die]

Do *any* of you people see *any* difference between a mom or dadhugging their kids and a suspected pedophile who is non-family and has children over for unsupervised sleepovers?

How f-ing dense or stupid can people be.

[Conservative til I die]

BTW, OJ Simpson was found not guilty. Would you not have a problem being alone with you and a steak knife??

[Conservative til I die]

If you want to judge people on their appearances, or because they are out of the norm, that’s your prerogative, I’ll wait until something is available other than accusations and media hype to begin making up my mind.

I love when the Jacko sycophants show their true selves. It only takes a few posts for them to use the old "don't judge him because he looks weird" line.

Look, some of us are discussing likely guilt or not. But most of us are talking about the wisdom in allowing your child to sleep over a grown non-family member man's house, ANY grown man, much less one accused of child molestation and who to any normal person with eyes and ears, is a bit off in how he thinks.

[GWfan]

There is something wrong with MJ and the kid's mom. There is probably abuse by both of them in some way.

[cajungirl]

Whatever you wish fine. But you wouldn't associate a handshake with sexual exciting of children. But carry on waiting for proof that Jackson is a pedophile.

[cajungirl]

Give up,,some people do not believe in anything other than a very concrete approach to making decisions about others. They demand a proof beyond a reasonable teeny tiny outrageous doubt and probably require a videotape and that might not suffice. I don't quite get it but think it has to do with fear that they might be accused of beiing a pedophile or criminal. Or some kind of terminal concreteness that is stubbornly refusing to wake up and smell the coffee. they resort to acting as if we, the public, are required to act like a jury and ignore everything we know from our years of living and watching others and being able to be intuitive and wise about people and how they present themselves. But I suspect a few of these types have god knows what going on under their very noses and just won't see. Some things you can't teach others,,,they are bound and determined to go toward the dark not the light. I give up on them for the most part.

[luckystarmom]

Did you read my post 36? I said there's a big difference between parents hugging their kids, and non-family members hugging, cuddling, sleeping with kids.

[GWfan]

Looks may be deceiving but MJ said on TV that he likes to share his bed with little kids that aren't related to him. That is inappropriate behavior, IMO. Part of my job is to report child abuse and I would certainly have reported that to authorities.

[luckystarmom]

You don't let your kids have sleep over with their friends?

I don't have a problem with my kids going over to their friends house for a sleep over as long as I know the parents and think well of them.

Now, we have a couple of single male friends. I would not let my kids sleep over at any of their houses unless it was a total emergency (like hubby and I in the hospital they were our only friends available to watch the kids). I would think it would be very strange if they asked if our kids could sleep over at their house. I would think it was strange if they invited my kids to do anything with them.

Now, my nephew does take my son to do things. He's 19, and my son is 9. My nephew's a family member, and he's a good kid. He's in the Corps of Cadets at Texas A&M, and he's a good role model. I also would not have a problem with my brothers doing stuff with my kids.

[cyncooper]

I haven't heard any specific allegations as to what he has done.

The counts are for lewd and lascivious acts with intent to arouse either party, committed on a child under 14 years of age.

You may wish to go to the Smoking Gun website and read the affadavit of the boy from 1993. It was not normal and wholesome interaction that was alleged. Nor is it in this case either. It is not alleged that merely sleeping in the same bed is the wrong thing, or just hugs or kisses as a parent would bestow on their child. What is alleged are acts with intent for sexual gratification--either by the adult or to cause arousal of the child.

Get it?

It is complete and utter nonsense to pretend that charges like this would be drawn up based on a hug.

[cyncooper]

If you want to judge people on their appearances, or because they are out of the norm, that’s your prerogative, I’ll wait until something is available other than accusations and media hype to begin making up my mind.

I saw this boy on that documentary with my own eyes and I remember posting at the time that the way he and Jackson were sitting holding hands looked just like a boyfriend and girlfriend sit. I'm inclined to believe the charges because that is exactly how it looked and they even declared they slept in the same bed. You may shrug and claim that such has an innocent explanation. I do not deny the obvious.

[cyncooper]

I don't see how the sight of someone’s shoes can be considered sexually arousing, but it does arouse some people, so, the action itself is not as pertinent as the result of it.

If Jacko gets off by shaking a kid’s hand, then, the definition fits.

Could be. Then you can expect the testimony would include that the boy witnessed Jackson's arousal at such a mundane action and made sure the boy saw it. That's what would have to happen if you take your scenario and make it fit the charge.

If you are going to pretend that innocent shaking of hands or hugs would be enough to file charges, don't forget the arousal aspect. There will be testimony that goes beyond "he hugged me" or "shook my hand" and there will have to be the sexual aspect.

It will be there. No doubt about it.

[Conservative til I die]

That's fine. But I kept seeing people referencing what families do together, when of course, when talking about Jacko, we aren't talking about family, so it's totally irrelevant to the discussion.

That is, it shouldn't matter how appropriate it is that you and your father are affectionate, or you and your kids or nephews. Simply because, Michael Jackson is not a family member to any of these kids and never will be or was.

[luckystarmom]

Some people were saying that they thought it was inappropriate for family members to be affectionate with their kids after a certain age.

So it was relevant to the discussion, because I was disagreeing with them.

[cajungirl]

Affection between family members is appropriate, healthy and good at any age. I think the rub is how is it expressed. And that is where we all differ. I for one think kids need to be taught boundaries within a family to protect them as they leave the family. Say if you are 10 and a girl, noone in the family intrudes on you while bathing or showering, no one. That was my rule actually beginning earlier than 10. Now any ten year old girl who knows that will not be seducible by anyone, an older lesbian, a male, a kinky uncle. That is my thought. It doesn't work for all but it does for me. I just want my children to be loved but to have a good sense of when others are not appropriate. It is a delicate balance, you don't want scared kids but you really don't want little sitting vulnerable ducks for cunning pedophiles, and they are cunning, look at Jackson the king of them all.