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To: fortheDeclaration
The Bible teaches total depravity. But that simply means that there is nothing good in man to earn or deserve salvation.

If you are willing to believe in Christ then you are NOT "totally depraved" and there IS something good in you (to earn salvation). Has an Arminian EVER answered this? Isn't your desire to follow Christ, the "good thing" that merits your salvation.

The Bible never hints that people are lost because they have no ability to come to Christ.

This is correct. People are lost because they have no desire to come to Christ. Calvin would call it a voluntary slavery. That is what Jeremiah 17:9 teaches: "The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked."

It always drives me crazy when people explain Calvinism incorrectly, before they pitifully attempt to discredit it.

21 posted on 02/18/2002 1:13:22 PM PST by Right_Wing_Mole_In_Seattle
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To: Right_Wing_Mole_In_Seattle
If you are willing to believe in Christ then you are NOT "totally depraved" and there IS something good in you (to earn salvation).

Now, you know even the Calvinists do not believe man is so depraved that he cannot do any good. Calvinism Total Depravity really means Total inability, to do anything for his salvation.

Since, however it is a free gift, responding to the offer is not a work. Is it a 'good' thing. Yes, for the one responding it is. But God reveals the truth to him so the man can make that choice (2Cor.4:6)

man cannot do anything Has an Arminian EVER answered this? Isn't your desire to follow Christ, the "good thing" that merits your salvation.

No Christian ever 'merits' anything (Rom.4:4-5) it is a free gift (Rom.6:23)

The Bible never hints that people are lost because they have no ability to come to Christ. This is correct. People are lost because they have no desire to come to Christ. Calvin would call it a voluntary slavery. That is what Jeremiah 17:9 teaches: "The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked."

I am really unconcerned what Calvin called anything. What does the Bible say about it. God states that He wants all men to be saved (1Tim2:4) and Christ said He would draw all men to Him (Jn.12:32).

It always drives me crazy when people explain Calvinism incorrectly, before they pitifully attempt to discredit it.

Well, I have never yet met a Calvinist who stated that anyone explained Calvinism correctly. It must be one of those great mysteries that only Calvinists can understand. Frankly, the issue is the Bible vs TULIP!

168 posted on 02/19/2002 12:39:26 AM PST by fortheDeclaration
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To: Right_Wing_Mole_In_Seattle
If you are willing to believe in Christ then you are NOT "totally depraved" and there IS something good in you (to earn salvation). Has an Arminian EVER answered this? Isn't your desire to follow Christ, the "good thing" that merits your salvation.

Yes. Paul did. He said there's a God built piece that remains in us, through which God communicates and prompts.

If GOD built it and put it there, then it is not because of any human work that we are enlightened. Jesus is the light who "lightens every man who comes into the world." He uses that residual piece that Paul speaks of "the law of God written on their hearts, their CONSCIENCES now excusing, now accusing."

The right to choose is also a God-given gift..."those who believe have life...those who don't believe don't have life, but the wrath of God REMAINS upon him.."

If both the means to hear and the capacity to respond are gifts of God, then NO MAN can take credit for it.

232 posted on 02/19/2002 6:35:37 AM PST by xzins
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