You don't have a clue what Calvinism teaches with regards to Total Depravity. Until you are able to express our belief, you will be the one "groping around in the dark." In order for this verse to overthrow my position, then this verse must teach that God has given all men a desire to seek Him. If this verse does not teach this, then you aren't even refuting Total Depravity.
I am at face value accepting that you are attempting to refute Total Depravity. I have obviously overestimated your understand and ability in the past. This is not a lie on my part; it is the error of being overly gracious to you. Since you are not saying that this verse teaches that all men have a desire to seek God, then it is you who are lying about our position. You have been told several times on this thread that you need to stop and define our position to show us that you are even qualified to be in a discussion with us. You refuse, instead choosing to lie about our position.
How long will this go while you realize that you cannot even define our position on Total Depravity?
In fact, the Scriptures he quotes, and his continual insistence that man is seeking after god (notice the small "g") continually affirm the doctrine that all men are "dead in trespasses and sins" and that they are incapable of performing any God (large "G") actions prior to regeneration.
And GOD saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually. (Genesis 6:5) Just as true today as it was in the day's of Noah.
No it it does not! What it has to show is that man is capable of seeking God. It is you who constantly make a reference to the 'corpse' analogy. The passage states not only groping but groping for God.That they should seek the lord, if haply they might feel after him, and find him, though he be not far from every one of us (Acts.17:27)
Now, your positions states that no man is seeking God-period!
I am at face value accepting that you are attempting to refute Total Depravity. I have obviously overestimated your understand and ability in the past. This is not a lie on my part; it is the error of being overly gracious to you.
Woody, you are about as 'gracious' as rattlesnake!
Since you are not saying that this verse teaches that all men have a desire to seek God, then it is you who are lying about our position. You have been told several times on this thread that you need to stop and define our position to show us that you are even qualified to be in a discussion with us. You refuse, instead choosing to lie about our position.
Why should I define your position, when you refuse do so? Your position is very clear, that man cannot seek God nor wishes to do so. Now, that passages states that God has made it possible for him to do so, so man is capable of that action.
How long will this go while you realize that you cannot even define our position on Total Depravity?
(the below are from the Other Side of Calvinism, by Lawrence Vance,)
So, when consulting the Westminster Confession to back up the first point of Calvinism, the proper place to look is not the aformentioned Chapter 6, but rather chapter 10, 'of free will' which says in part:III. Man, by his fall into a state of sin, hath wholly lost all ability of will to any spiritual good accompanying salvation: so as, a natural man, being altogether averse from that good, and dead in sin, is not able, by his own strength, to convert himself, or to prepare himself thereunto. IV. When God converts a sinner, and translates him into the state of grace, he freeth him from his natural bondage under sin; and by his grace alone, enable him freely to will and to do that which is spiritually good; yet so, as that by reason of this remaining corruption, he doth not perfectly, or only will that which is good but doth also will that which is evil.(p.188)
Therefore the heart of the matter is whether a man has the free will to respond to the word of God and the Holy Spirit without being the subject of Unconditional Election and Irresistible Grace.(p.200)All that is meant that man has a free will in the matter of salvation is that he has the ability to respond to the word of God and the conviction of the Holy Spirit. The fact that most men choose to reject Christ and remain in their sin shows the extent of man's depravity, but does not change the fact that man has free will to do otherwise. A man is only free if he is able to have chosen to do otherwise (p.216)
There are two alternatives: the Bible and TULIP Calvinism And brought them out, and said Sirs, what must I do to be saved? And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and thou shalt be saved, and thy house (Acts.16:30-31)(p.200)
I understand your rotten system all too well despite the change in terminology and the twisting of the meaning of words that would even make a Jesuit blush!