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MAIN DIFFERENCE BETWEEN "WHITEWATER" AND ENRON? I HAVE THE ANSWER
dfu | 1-10-02 | dfu

Posted on 01/10/2002 8:23:49 PM PST by doug from upland

The RATS are circling in the waters like sharks. They go to bed every night hoping upon hope that they can do something to destroy the Bush administration.

Do the RATS care about our war effort? Perhaps some of them do. I would say, however, that the great majority of the far leftist hardcore of the RAT party wants Bush to have trouble more than they want the U.S. to defeat terrorism. Hey, that's why we call them the RATS.

We hear the Clinton complicit press jumping all over the Enron case and comparing it to Whitewater. Some have already suggested it is much worse.

It is clear to any good Clintonologist why they think it is worse. They loved Clinton. They hate Bush. They were too lazy or too stupid, or both, to follow what happened in the myriad of scandals called Whitewater. And the Clinton DNA is still dripping down their chins. If they can make Bush look bad, they can make Clinton look better. There is that legacy thing, you know.

Will Enron be a problem for Bush? It will be an irritant as the RATS think it is payback time. They will attempt to smear this president with the same enthusiasm as they tried to protect and defend real Clinton criminal activity.

But the real difference should put some of you at ease. George W. Bush is basically a decent and honest man. Conversely, we learned very early that Bill Clinton was a lying, manipulating, evil, self-serving, piece of human debris.

The first instinct of Bush is to tell the truth. The first instinct of Clinton is to tell a lie.

Clinton, we know, would do anything to be president. In fact, he did. There was nothing out of bounds. Bush did not need the job. His life would be fine without out. Certainly it would be less stressful.

Might they find some wrongdoing? There is a chance, however, I doubt it. Unlike Clinton, Bush has surrounded himself with good people rather than compromised people. Clinton sick-o-fants stayed with him because they were as dishonest as their boss. It started at the top and ran right down the line.

It should give you comfort that a pretty honest and decent man with character is guiding our ship in these troubled waters. Those who did wrongdoing are not going to get a pass in this administration.


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To: Frances_Marion
But this argument "they did it too" is a measure of how far all of us have coarsened during the clinton years. Just because democrats are dishonest crooks does not mean it is OK for republicans to act the same way. Democrats think that is a good argument. Hopefully, we don't and that is a key difference between us and them.

Big picture so far. Enron asked for help just before bankruptcy. The Bush administration said no. Hard to find a scandal there. Now, Arthur Anderson and the company execs have their toes in the wringer. But so far, the only allegation against the administration is that Bush admin members spoke with and took campaign contributions from execs of a company that later went bankrupt. Pretty bland. Hopefully, it stays that way.

Oh, and Bush is from the same state as Enron. Even worse, Bush was once in the same business as Enron. Those arguments convince true believer dems and "progressives", they don't do much for Americans.

41 posted on 01/10/2002 10:16:12 PM PST by ffrancone
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To: Frances_Marion
Lady in Blue's posted a great article on Bill Clinton's traveling companions while on his India trip; Enron....
Clinton's Enron Ties
42 posted on 01/10/2002 10:17:04 PM PST by Libertina
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To: doug from upland
another difference I found, whitewater had dead bodies (Jon Walker, others) Enron no dead bodies. (that wew have heard jof yet)
43 posted on 01/10/2002 10:25:16 PM PST by isom35
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To: calebcar
This is what I was talking about, doesn't look good.

----------------------------------------------------------- I put this here from your link that you posted as I heard at the top of the hour news that they were going to investigate Bush while he was the Governor of Texas. ***********************************************************

Enron's Ken Lay and the Bush Boys

Enron Founder and Chairman Kenneth Lay also worked in the Pentagon for the Nixon administration during the Vietnam War.

Lay is a close friend of George Bush, Sr. In fact, his Houston home in River Oaks is near the Tanglewood residence of the former President and CIA Director.

Although there have been no published reports of Bush Sr. doing favors for Lay, three of the Bush Boys have used their father's name to get contracts for Enron.

According to an article by Seymour Hersh in the New Yorker, Neil and Marvin Bush tried to influence government officials for an Enron bid to rebuild Shuaiba North power plant in Kuwait.

Ironically this power plant was destroyed in George Bush's Persian Gulf War. Enron abandoned the bid a year ago.

In 1988, then Texas governor George Bush Jr., reportedly telephoned Rodolfo Terragno, Argentina's Public Works Minister, to ask him to award Enron a contract to build a pipeline from Chile to Argentina.

"He assumed that the fact he was the son of the president would exert influence. I felt pressured. It was not proper for him to make that kind of call," Terragno told The Nation.

Finally, when Carlos Menem, another Bush Sr. crony, became president of Argentina, Enron won the bid.

Neil Bush, director of the failed Denver-based Silverado Savings and Loan, created a subsidiary of his oil company to conduct business in Argentina in 1987.

Argentina finally got so fed up with the Bush Boys, they formally had a parliamentary investigation regarding their so-called "business dealings ***********************************************************

I believe this is going to get real ugly as ones try and save their butts.

From the: Barr to be on CNN thread

44 posted on 01/10/2002 10:37:55 PM PST by horsewhispersc
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To: horsewhispersc
You're right. It doesn't look good at all. In fact, it looks like a damned pack of lies.

GWB, for instance, was not governor of Texas in 1988.

45 posted on 01/10/2002 11:39:33 PM PST by Post Toasties
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To: Post Toasties
You're right I didn't pick that up, it will be interesting to see how this unfolds since they plan on investigating him while he was Governor and all his Enron connections. I for one want the Truth to come out.
46 posted on 01/11/2002 12:05:41 AM PST by horsewhispersc
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To: Post Toasties
Here's the Original Article I found on google by Mother Jones, note the date Don't Cry for Bush, Argentina

George W. may not recall the names of world leaders, but when it comes to foreign affairs, he knows the value of his own family's name.

by Louis Dubose and Carmen Coiro

March/April 2000 Texans watched with interest last winter as Governor George W. Bush was home-schooled on international affairs by former Secretary of State George Shultz and other veterans of his father's foreign-policy team. Even Carl Bildt, the former prime minister of Sweden, was brought in for a tutorial at the governor's mansion, in the hope that his recent U.N. experience in the Balkans could help Bush understand that Kosovars are not "Kosavarians" and that Greeks are not "Grecians."

But no one had to prepare a prompt card to remind him who stepped down as president of Argentina in December.

Shortly before Bush announced his own campaign for president, he had received a visit from Carlos Saul Menem, the right-wing leader of Argentina for the past decade. The two men retired to an Austin country club, where they were joined by Bush's father. Governor Bush had the flu, so he contented himself with riding along as the former president and Menem played a round of golf.

The capitol press corps trailed along, dutifully recording the governor's cordial relationship with a visiting head of state. Unknown to the assembled reporters, however, was the story of how Bush and his family became immersed in Argentine politics.

The little-known tale begins with George W. making a phone call to secure a $300-million deal for a U.S. pipeline company --

a deal that provoked a political firestorm in Argentina, drawing scrutiny from legislators and a special prosecutor.

The episode marked one of George W.'s first ventures into foreign affairs, demonstrating the fundamental rule by which the Texas governor and his family conduct business:

Always know that the Bush name is a marketable commodity.

Bush first made his presence felt in Argentina in 1988, shortly after his father was elected president. At the time, the junior Bush's political career was just beginning --

and the political career of Raúl Alfonsín, who was approaching the end of his term as president of Argentina, was ending. Alfonsín had returned his country to civilian rule, prosecuted those responsible for human rights abuses during Argentina's rule by a military junta, and struggled to manage an economy that seemed to defy management.

Determined to complete one major private-sector industrial program, he pushed for the development of a "gasoducto" that would connect Argentine gas fields with domestic and foreign markets. And he appointed his minister of public works, Rodolfo Terragno, to oversee the pipeline project.

Unlike Bush, Terragno achieved political prominence the old-fashioned way: through a life dedicated to public service. A noted journalist and public official, he was forced into exile for 10 years after the military seized power in Argentina in 1976.

Only after Alfonsín restored civilian rule did Terragno return to his homeland, where he went on to serve as minister of public works, a member of congress, and most recently as cabinet chief to the newly elected president, Fernando de la Rua.

In 1988, Terragno was considering two proposals for the $300-million pipeline, one from an Italian firm called Ente Nazionale Idrocarburi and the other from Pérez Companc, an Argentine company working in partnership with Dow Chemical.

After a year of consideration, the minister was close to making a decision when Enron, the largest pipeline company in the United States, suddenly entered the bidding.

At the time, the Houston-based Enron had no experience in Argentina. It had formed a business relationship with Westfield, a small Argentine firm, but Westfield wasn't much of a player either.

El Boletín Oficial -- the Argentine equivalent of the Federal Register -- reported that Westfield's only asset in 1988 was $20, its corporate filing fee. Westfield was a prestanombre, literally a "borrowed name" used to provide a domestic front for a foreign firm.

Terragno was concerned that a newly formed corporation with no resources was attempting to land a contract that companies with proven track records had been working on for a year.

"I had a lot of reservations about Enron because the company wasn't well established in Argentina," Terragno told Mother Jones, providing details of the episode for the first time.

The minister recalls that Enron sent him "a one-page outline" proposing a price Terragno now describes as "laughable." Enron wanted to pay "something like 20 percent of the international market price," he says. "It all seemed so inadequate.

Enron asked the country of Argentina to practically give them the gas." Terragno was unenthusiastic about the pipeline bid, but Enron initiated a full-scale campaign to pressure him.

Pro-business newspapers attacked the minister for blocking the proposal, and Terragno recalls that Ted Gildred, the U.S. ambassador to Argentina, "called me and visited me constantly" to push the deal.

Terragno wasn't concerned about the ambassador's lobbying -- that was politics as usual. "It was good that he was representing the interest of his country's businesses," he says.

But Terragno found that some of the politics surrounding Enron's campaign were anything but usual.

A few weeks after the U.S. presidential election in 1988, Terragno received a phone call from a failed Texas oilman named George W. Bush, who happened to be the son of the president-elect.

"He told me he had recently returned from a campaign tour with his father," the Argentine minister recalls. The purpose of the call was clear: to push Terragno to accept the bid from Enron.

"He was taking a moment to call me because he knew that I was dealing with this," says Terragno, adding that Bush told him that he "viewed with some concern the slow pace of the Enron project.

" According to Terragno, the president-elect's son noted that a deal with Enron "would be very favorable for Argentina and its relations with the United States."

When a brief report on the attempt to influence the Argentine deal appeared in The Nation and the Texas Observer years later, the Bush team reacted angrily.

His staff produced a copy of his day planner to show that Bush never placed the phone call, and a top-level adviser personally called reporters to dismiss the story as a fantasy by "some guy in Argentina."

Bush's staff continues to deny his involvement, and no other media outlet ever reported on the episode, despite the high-ranking source.

More than a decade later, Terragno still recalls details of the phone call clearly -- as well as his outrage.

"It looked bad and it surprised me," he says. "There was this political endorsement, apparently from the White House.

I don't know if George Bush the father was aware of it, or if it was only a business contact by his son, who hoped that his family name would have some influence."

George W. wasn't the only Bush plying the family name in Argentina. His brother Neil had tried to funnel $900,000 in loans from Silverado Savings and Loan, where he served as a director, into a failed attempt to drill for oil in Argentina.

The S&L eventually collapsed, costing taxpayers nearly $1 billion to bail out, and federal regulators banned Neil from certain banking activities.

But Terragno was unimpressed by the family connections. He told George W. the pipeline concession would be awarded according to Argentine law.

It hardly mattered -- Argentine law was about to change. Time had run out for Raúl Alfonsín. His party lost the election, and he left office four months early to make way for his successor, Carlos Menem.

Enron, for its part, couldn't have appointed an Argentine president more favorable to its interests. A right-wing follower of Juan Peron, Menem was eager to open his country to American enterprise -- and his own lavish spending. He took to traveling with a huge entourage aboard Tango-01, his $66- million presidential jet.

The Bushes took an immediate liking to him. The day after the 1989 election, Neil Bush arrived in Buenos Aires for a tennis match with the president-elect.

The following year, President Bush made the first of eight trips to see Menem, becoming the first U.S. chief executive since Eisenhower to visit Argentina.

Several days after the president's trip in 1990, Bush's ambassador to Argentina, Terence Todman, wrote a stern letter to Menem's minister of the economy to follow up on issues that Bush had "intended to address, but failed to do so for lack of time."

Todman went on to imply that eight U.S. companies would walk away from their investment plans unless Argentina stopped favoring domestic corporations. The first company on the list was Enron, which the ambassador described as being "poised to invest $250 million" --

as soon as the Argentine government met its demands for tax breaks. Todman closed his letter by warning that the Enron decision was "extremely urgent," as the gas company would make a final decision on its investment in less than a month.

Todman prevailed: Menem agreed to the company's terms, signing a presidential decree that included Enron in a national program freeing it from tariffs and valued-added taxes.

Reports of the Enron deal outraged Argentines, who had supported Alfonsín's struggle to create a democracy out of what remained after 10 years of military dictatorship. >P>Lawmakers demanded a congressional inquiry, and a special prosecutor launched an investigation. Menem dealt with the scandal in a forthright manner: Since his own justice department was looking into the tax giveaway, he simply fired the investigator.

Enron ultimately abandoned the project when gas prices fell, but an Enron subsidiary later bought into the pipeline and now owns almost a third of the gasoducto.

Among the subsidiary's board members is Brent Scowcroft, national security advisor to former President George Bush.

George W. has certainly benefited from his association with Enron. Kenneth Lay, the company's chief executive, has personally contributed $100,000 to Bush's two gubernatorial campaigns.

When Bush announced in 1999 that he was running for president, executives and political action committees connected to Enron contributed $89,650 to his campaign in the first three months.

Lay signed on as a "Bush Pioneer," pledging to raise $100,000.

The involvement of George W. and Neil in Argentina has become something of an m.o. for the Bush brothers in foreign affairs.

The sons of the former president have certainly not been shy about using their family name to enrich themselves and their friends.

Jeb sold $74 million worth of water pumps to the Nigerian government in 1988. Marvin tried to sell electronic fences to the defense ministry of Kuwait two years after the Gulf War, while Neil sought contracts to provide oil-field antipollution equipment.

And George W. lent his name to tiny Harken Energy to help secure a huge offshore drilling contract in Bahrain (see "Slick W.," page 48).

Undoubtedly, the family name will continue to open doors internationally if George W. is elected.

Last November, an airplane with Houston registry numbers landed in Buenos Aires; on board was former President Bush, who had arrived to spend the night with his friend, President Menem, 10 days before the end of Menem's final term.

The two men attended a dinner at the home of Argentine banker José Rohm, where they were joined by the vice president of Chase Manhattan Bank, the director of Credit Suisse First Boston, the president-elect of Argentina and the former president of Uruguay.

What was the purpose of President Bush's visit? "Fishing," says Michael Dannenhauer, a Bush spokesman. But when the Buenos Aires daily, Pagina 12, asked several of the dinner guests why the president was in town, they smiled and quietly replied, "Business."

Bush's "real interest," they added, was to learn how the new government would deal with CEI, an Argentine media company whose former chief had fled the country under investigation for fraud.

One of CEI's principal investors, the paper noted, is Tom Hicks, "one of the funders of the presidential campaign of Bush's son, George, the governor of Texas."

E-mail the Editor

47 posted on 01/11/2002 12:53:05 AM PST by horsewhispersc
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To: JulieRNR21;doug from upland
So did Clinton help to bloat Enron like he encouraged the bloating of our economy?
48 posted on 01/11/2002 4:24:03 AM PST by RedBloodedAmerican
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To: doug from upland
Enron’s Campaign Contributions, 1989-2001- Senate & House
49 posted on 01/11/2002 7:34:39 AM PST by angkor
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To: angkor
Thanks for the link. Send it to talk show hosts. I just sent it to Dennis Prager.
50 posted on 01/11/2002 7:58:48 AM PST by doug from upland
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To: horsewhispersc
So, the only thing this hit piece has to retail about GWB is a phone call that he probably never even made when he was a private citizen, the same as the rest of us?

Hate to disappoint you, horseshispersc, but Mother Jones pulled this one out of the wrong end of the horse.

51 posted on 01/11/2002 10:35:09 AM PST by Post Toasties
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To: Libertina
Thanks for the link, should come in handy!
52 posted on 01/11/2002 12:03:17 PM PST by Frances_Marion
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To: ffrancone
"Big picture so far. Enron asked for help just before bankruptcy. The Bush administration said no. Hard to find a scandal there. Now, Arthur Anderson and the company execs have their toes in the wringer. But so far, the only allegation against the administration is that Bush admin members spoke with and took campaign contributions from execs of a company that later went bankrupt. Pretty bland. Hopefully, it stays that way."

Good points...it's looking more and more to me like Brown and Clinton did more for Enron than Bush...

53 posted on 01/11/2002 12:05:06 PM PST by Frances_Marion
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