Posted on 01/02/2002 7:00:39 AM PST by Pokey78
Feelings? Where did I use that word? You asked me a question and I answered it.
Good for you...great!
I have spent too much of my day on this this subject. Bottom line...Pat Buchanan does not, will not, will never have a large following.
I do have a large following - and they will all want fed in the next few hours, so I am leaving the Pat debate to get back to the real world.
Well then, your definition of 'liberal' must be anyone with whom a Buchananite loses an argument.
That is a common response, it is very hard to prove, and possibly only opinion, albeit old and now called reality.
In the past we were talking about 10s of thousands, we are now talking about 10s of millions, a slight difference, and of course the Europeans had to come by boat, and access was easily controlled.
The socialist state of our country is also a very large difference, at least when the Poles came, they knew they had to work, and weren't lined up waiting for others to pay for the birth of their children etc.
As the Italians came here, they weren't known for printing newspapers or starting organizations advocating the overthrow of the system of govt, and demanding that their children be taught in Italian.
How long until the tradition of working the lower paying jobs, becomes a demand for access to the higher paying jobs, without the work and education it requires.
Soon we will have a new group(the recently legalized illegals) demanding preference and affirmative action, and the Republicans will have to pour the gravy, or be buried electorally. Of course politicians being what they are (lower life forms than lawyers) they will give what is asked, taking from the producers at even greater rates, and calling it progress, or better yet compassionate conservatism.
There is no need to defend yourself from me. I simply asked you to support your claim with a fact. [So far, you offer no facts, only bluster and rants. What's next? Pounding your shoe on the table?]
Secondly, if you read my posts you would see that I criticize Buchanan, not his book.
Also, where was it written that we could only post on this thread IF we had read the book? If we deleted all post from freepers who had NOT read Buchanan's book, this thread would be about four posts long.
hehe... I know a number of former Buchanan supporters who have made that same decision.
* By 2050, only 10% of the world’s people will be of European descent
* ...23 million Germans will have disappeared along with 16 million Italians and 30 million Russians
* Europe must import scores of millions of Arabs and Africans to care for the elderly and pay the taxes...
* There are 30 million foreign born in the U.S. today...
* European-Americans are a minority in America’s most populous state...
* White Americans are fleeing California...
* ...assault on Confederate books, symbols, flags, heroes, and holidays almost complete...
* Mark Twain, Flannery O’Connor, and any realistic portrayal of the America South, including Harper’ Lee’s To Kill a Mockingbird, are now forbidden
I am not saying that Buchanan is lying or wrong with his facts and stats...I am only saying that he sounds racists in his delivery because he highlights racial distinctions and racial issues, which in turn is going to cause the majority of Americans to reject his warnings. <<
You have a point that all his statements are race baiting, except for the one I put in bold. What Pat "save the white man" Buchanan fails to realize is that many BLACK americans are against illegal immigration even more so than white Americans. I can't tell you how many blacks I've seen complain about illegal immigrats gettting special "benefits" that working-class black CITIZENS do not, REGUARDLESS of whether those illegals are Hispanic, Arab, Asian, or white.
Even LIBERAL blacks are against illegal immigration. Ultra-liberal Chicago Alderman Dorthy Tillman is known to snap at La Raza members: "This is America and we speak ENGLISH. My ancestors learned it and if you don't want to, then you should leave".
It should also be noted that many Hispanic Americans oppose amnesty because those who worked hard to get citizenship see it as a slap in the face from their government. Many Hispanics from Latin America see the "amensty" plan as biased in favor of only Mexican hispanics, and they are correct in that reguard.
Opposing massive ILLEGAL immigration from ALL nations (which will bring the country's population to a overflow of 1 billion in 100 years), is not a driving force for "European Americans" but for ALL Americans who personally, or through ancestry, have family who worked hard to assimulate, earn their way, and adapt to our culture. Pat should indeed present the facts this way, but he's caught up on his OWN background, thereby tainting everything with a "confederate Irish-American devote Christian" obsession. As result, no one will listen to him. Also note the hypocracy with the "they are tearing down our traditional American icons like Andrew Jackson". Many of Pat's neo-confederate buddies do the same thing (ask them about the nullication crisis), but ol' Pat not only turns a blind eye when THEY do it, he encourages it.
>> He is intelligent enough to drop all of the white man stuff and plead with ALL AMERICANS to demand a change in the immigration laws and enforcement because it is good for ALL of us. <<
And if only he had, he wouldn't have margilized himself into a joke in 2000. It's a tragedy, really. Pat has the right idea many times, but he's dead wrong when it comes up with ways to carry it out.
Admin Moderator
2002-01-02 11:36:13
FYI- ONE copy was pulled for having more racist comments than non-racist comments.
The next copy up was left. Then the next four copies were pulled for being duplicates.
I guess no one stops to ask themselves why the thread that is up
is up if we wanted to keep it from being discussed.
" My fellow Americans I come here tonight with a heavy heart... for I and your congress have spent trillions on the war on poverty and some of you are not yet poor!"
In many ways this is past tense ... considering that its already difficult to impossible to secure employment in many of the service fields unless you are bi-lingual.
OK...empirical laws suggest that Pat is right...the West is going to die, just like every other great civilzation.
If people looked around in any Catholic Church during Mass- many of you would note the significant number of non-white, mainly immigrant faces. Around here I note the increasing number of Korean-Baptist or Chinese-Baptist or Vietnamese-Baptist churches in this area.
Fine.
Now why aren't Protestant immigrants allowed to come here, hmmm?
So talking about those facts is racist. In other words europeans cant be concerned with their own self-preservation.
The majority of Americans rejected warnings about terrorists freely gaining access to the country too. As the problems get worse maybe more people will prefer facts to feelings and soundings.
Heh. That wasnt directed at me but how would your posts help anyone? You say you agree with the facts presented by Buchanan but you dont like that he brought it up. So how should the problems be presented?
You seem to be unaware:
A. The Roman Catholic church's members outnumbered members of any other Christian church BEFORE the 1960s (think back to Irish and Italian immigration of the 1800s, not to mention the people who founded Maryland in the 1600s)
B. Pat Buchanan, Alan Keyes, Gene Taylor, and many of the most vocal "Christian Right" are NOT Protestant.
That being said however, his demographic trends are factual and those of us who are political ascientists have known them for a long time. No one would have deared to write such a book because they would not have sold one copy and their academic careers would have been destroyed.
Secondly the Marxists in my department and throughout academia see this as the vision of the world to come and have actively participated in making sure that it came to pass.
You may not like the messenger, but what he says is true. Unfortunately it is Buchanan who wrote this book and nobody will pay attention to it. The West is dying and it has been dying for a long time now. It's death began with the birth of Karl Marx and the romantic revolution of the 19th century. The cancer of collectivism and multicuturalism has been spreading ever since. Conformity to the new ethos is demanded by society.
Welcome to the new century.
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