The moral minefield of a boy's dying wish

www.dailytelegraph.news.com.au ^ | 21dec01 | LUCY CLARK

[Publius6961]

They can get to heaven if they repent. It would be nice to think the kid got a chance to repent before he died.

Isn't it the Jesuits who are credited with the oft used line, "It is easier to obtain forgiveness than to obtain permission"?

[agrace]

Is a 15 year-old, officially a child, intellectually and emotionally competent to make such a mature decision?

Planned Parenthood seems to think so.

Do the parents have a right to know?

Planned Parenthood doesn't seem to think so.

Regarding the article though, what a strange set of circumstances to weigh. Without condoning his actions, my heart certainly goes out to him.

[WindMinstrel]

A chance? Not many go without a chance, are there? He knew he was dying, he was on his way out in a hospital. He (had/will have) his chance

[Tall_Texan]

That's a good response. I can only think of all the other joys he was deprived of while undergoing treatment and knowing his death was immenent. To cross this one usually forbidden line doesn't offset the horror he must have gone through but it might have given him a small lift in the midst of his suffering and I, for one, could not hold such a thing against him.

As a Christian, I wish more people would use Scripture as a lamp instead of a sledgehammer, particularly when mercy and compassion are more sought than a lecture or a doctrinal thesis. I will not say what becomes of this child - it is God's to decide. That's what makes Him so difficult for us finite creatures to fully contemplate when we seek rigid answers.

[Lysander]

Since when is there a 'right' to have sex anyway?

You are joking arn't you?

[backup]

More specifically, allend, the word used in the passage you cite (as well as in Paul's letters) is PORNOS.

It is defined as a male prostitute or, more generally, "a man who indulges in unlawful sexual intercourse."

If you want to convince folks that the boy sinned, you must show us -- from the O.T. law -- why the act was "unlawful."

Regards.

[FormerLib]

My guess is that he what he wanted was either multiple quickies with a hooker or a quickie with multiple hookers.

Yes, that would be consistent with the 'Libertarian' way, wouldn't it?

[Chipper]

It sure worked to control you, didn't it?

you might have to back up your name after a juvenile comment like that. Nice.

[dvan]

Bump!!!!!!

[ConsistentLibertarian]

Why? You have your eye on one?

[Christian B]

I think those quoting scripture are using it as a lamp to see these actions in their true light. While we cannot condemn this boy's soul, we may judge the actions of the adults so long as we expect to be judged by the same set of rules.

[ConsistentLibertarian]

I didn't say he was a libertarian. For all I know, he's a Roman Catholic. But he was going to die and he didn't have long to live and he was asking for sex with "a woman". Seems unlikey he was thinking about something long term, but you never now.

[WindMinstrel]

I'm not sure I've met a Christian that apologizes for his sins before they happen (i.e. I'm sorry I'm going to blaspheme tomorrow. I'm sorry I'm going to rob an old lady tomorrow). I think you're supposed to recognize that sin is wrong, and not do it.

I'd disagree with you on this -- I rarely sin "by accident" myself. I think that sin requires mens rea like any other crime.

However, that's immaterial. A christian who sins willfully still sins. He will still be forgiven if he repents.

[backup]

Ezekiel 16:2

The word used in the passage is TAZNUTH.

It is defined (as is PORNOS in the Greek) as "unlawful sex."

So, that verse doesn't get us there.

We still need to know what makes it "unlawful."

[beGlad]

What would this dicussion thread look like if it had been a 15 year-old girl? Or a 13 year-old girl?

[Jefferson Adams]

OWK, I'd be interested in your opinion of this.

How about mine, until he gets here?

I'm a serious Christian. I'm a worship leader, I've led evangelism-oriented ministries, I've known the Lord for 25 years.

People DO NOT go to Hell because of what they do - they go because of what they are, unregenerate, fallen human beings. We are ALL born that way, and if we don't meet the Lord in a saving relationship through Jesus Christ, we WILL wind up in Hell.

In my opinion, one of the primary reasons that sex is supposed to be between man and wife is because of all the problems that result otherwise. There are bonds that form, etc., that are designed to be FOR LIFE when we have sex with another human being. That's how a loving Father designed it to work.

This young man, short of a miracle, had no future on this earth where the problems I mention above would happen to him. His life was about to end.

While I *do* believe that sex belongs inside marriage, I also know that we ALL have a very hard time being perfect. I don't know if this boy was saved or not - I would guess not. I don't think that we, as Christians, can hold non-Christians to the same standards that the Bible prescribes for us. It just doesn't work. And that being said, I'd be in favor, after a long talk with him to see if he knew the Lord or not, of letting him have his wish. If he WAS a Christian, I would feel otherwise - I'd remind him that his life wasn't ending, and that it would be better for him to stay pure, for the purpose of his relationship with God being as "right" as we can possibly make it. Which really isn't very "right" for any of us :)

So that's what I think :)

[Publius6961]

You are joking arn't you?

You're not suggesting that you're... *gasp*...
"operating" without a state license, are you?

[backup]

What would this dicussion thread look like if it had been a 15 year-old girl? Or a 13 year-old girl?

We wouldn't be having one.

For, as everyone knows, a girl of ANY age and, for the most part, ANY appearance can find someone to have sex with her within five minutes.