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To: Diamond
the actual nature of a living, existent, human being-in-fact does not change based upon how we refer to that human being.

Absolutely true when refering to the base essence of how things work. But we don't make decisions down there, we make decisions based on how we see things. And there's a very tight tie in between what we call something and how we see it, and that governs what we think should be done with it. For the prolife person everything that can become a baby is a baby (to put it crudely and not very well). While I understand the position I don't agree with the position. Maybe it's because of the large number of miscarriages in my family history (wombs in my family are not safe places, the good news is those of us that make it out are very tough, never get sick and live a long time). To me that causes a very obvious distinction between fetus and baby. My mom was pregnant 8 time for one kid, from where I sit it's very obvious that the 7 fetuses that never made it weren't babies, I can tell because I have no siblings.

It probably seems wierd to you that I focus so much on miscariages but that really is the source of my definitions. If a fetus can be "not born" with no interference from man I simply can't define it as a living human being, it makes no sense to me. While I can follow your logic I cannot accept your initial assumption. I can only hope I have presented my position well enough for you to be able to do the same.

130 posted on 12/14/2001 11:33:15 AM PST by discostu
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To: discostu
My mom was pregnant 8 time for one kid, from where I sit it's very obvious that the 7 fetuses that never made it weren't babies, I can tell because I have no siblings.

Bless your mother's heart. I am sorry for the trauma she experienced. Your 7 siblings are no longer alive, but they once were. Perhaps she may have expressed her grief to you over them, and her joy over you. Ontologically and scientifically speaking though, the only thing that does make coherent sense is the truth that they were living human beings (what else could your mom have been pregnant with?) who unfortunately died before birth, while you terminated your mom's pregnancy by being born.

I had a son who died suddenly at age 2, and he never made it to manhood. Does that mean that at one time he was not a living human being? Not at all. But be that as it may, let me tell you that I'm glad you made it out alive and have survived to tell the tale, and that we are both here to discuss it:-)

Cordially,

134 posted on 12/14/2001 11:55:35 AM PST by Diamond
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