[Dr. Frank fan]

Someone please educate me. What freedoms that I presently enjoy will be taken away by a NID card?

The freedom to exist without having a NID card, for one. (Sorry, was that one just too obvious that you missed it?)

As a cell phone user and a credit card user, I'm extremely easy to track but I have not noticed anyone tracking me except for marketeers.

They know that if they do something to truly offend you, then you will just cancel your cell phone and/or credit card.

What if the government uses your NID card to try to track whether you have guns, and then (later) to take them away? How will you "cancel"?

I guess you haven't thought about that.

My driver's license in Texas now has my thumbprint associated with it.

Same with mine in California. And I'm none too happy about it; if I had my druthers, that policy would be abolished.

You can't use one misguided policy to justify another. Did you think you could?

I'd love to trade all the plastic crap in my wallet with a single, universal smart card that only I can use to make purchases or vouch for my identity.

Go for it. I won't stop ya.

What am I missing?

You're missing the fact that just because you, personally wouldn't mind doing something doesn't mean it is therefore justified to force all your countrymen to do the same thing. In short you are missing the fact that the world does not revolve around you and your personal preferences.

It's a common mistake.

P.S. I notice you made no attempt whatsoever to actually argue that forcing everyone to carry a NID card would help stop terrorism. Which (I thought) was the whole justification for it. But the fact is, it wouldn't help stop terrorism, so I'm not surprised that you made no attempt to argue to the contrary. It was a wise move on your part.

[Ben Chad]

All this reminds me of the arguments that used to be made against caller id. Since I subscribed for CID, I haven't gotten too many prank calls and it is indispensable as a defense against telemarketing that admittedly using credit cards has probably stimulated. Add CID to my list of things to be grateful for this year. The same kind of argument has been made against being able to trace computer communications to individual computers. Would we be spending billions on fighting computer viruses if these things could be traced to their source? I don't particularly like having my finger print on file with the DMV but since I'm not planning on being a fugitive from law or ex wife any time soon, I'm not going to lose sleep over it. I would imagine that criminals and child support deadbeats might feel otherwise. Re terrorists: NID card would seem a good first step at tracking people on visas which is sorely lacking right now. I hear the proposal that we'll start with just non-citizens. But if you don't have a good id system in place, how will you stop bad guys from just getting fake ids like the 9-11 guys and enjoy the mobility of citizens? I'm not an advocate, yet, of NID cards. Just trying to grasp implications I haven't thought of because my type is so egocentric and all. The first thing I thought after the plane hit the tower---there goes civil liberties down the drain. We are all suspect. Bastards.

Don't peg me as a big government sheeple type. If you want to fight government intrusion in the lives of ordinary citizens, let's start with the gestapo known as family court that is badly in need of some sunshine, and federal judges like Jerry Buckmyer (sp?) of Dallas who can order a welfare housing project to be built in your neighborhood. But that's another thread.

[BlackbirdSST]

Thanks to the good Dr. for stating the obvious! Hope you enlightened Ben Chad, as well as others in this thread. Your views reflect that of a substantial number of your countrymen. Hope it's enough to turn this tide. Blackbird.