‘WE'RE GOING TO CONQUER AMERICA'

New York Post ^ | 11/12/01 | DANIEL PIPES

[Anamensis]

We need to recognise that Islam, as written in the Qu'ran, is as hateful as anything the KKK could have come up with. We need to make being a Muslim about as popular in general society as being a Klansman or a Nazi.

Frankly, between Arab terrorists, and creeps from Nation of Islam, they are doing the job for us. If Bush would just shut up and quit trying to put a pretty face on Islam and just let its philosophy speak for itself, the job would go even more smoothly.

[Marysecretary]

Who's asking them to live under the rule of the OT? Christ's message is what's important, not the Old Testament. It's an important part of the Bible, for sure, but there's salvation ONLY in Jesus Christ.

[DoughtyOne]

Yep, that PC mindset is quite dangerous.

[Clinton's a rapist]

‘MUSLIMS make an incredibly valuable [but completely dispensable] contribution to our country,"

[Brian Allen]

Until we get immigration under control, we are doomed.

Amen!

[But let's fight the Good Fight together!]

[Brian Allen]

Judgement of my [Impeccable] relationship with Historical Fact, with Moral Integrity -- and with veracity -- and, come to that, of everything else -- is reserved.

Not that you'd have noticed.

[Righty1]

Yes and they have revived the vaccine business and are bucking up antibiotic profits. Because of them we are paying to harden an entire society that was built for access and efficiency. So I guess it must be the donut shops in Dearborn that really make the experience positive? Importing muslims whom our ancestors kept out of the west at the price of oceans of blood will prove to be the biggest mistake the west ever made. Muslims also seem to be inordinately adept at propoganda. Will their over-sized speech centers and fanaticism trump our technology and liberalism?

[woofer]

Judgement of my [Impeccable] relationship with Historical Fact, with Moral Integrity -- and with veracity -- and, come to that, of everything else -- is reserved.

Not that you'd have noticed.

Oh, I noticed.

But I don't even read more than a dozen words into your convoluted rants. Get a life. And maybe a grammitacal guide.

[John Valentine]

Islam is a totally synthetic religion, somewhat akin to Scientology in the respect that they are each the singular creation of one man.

I was not equating Islam and Scientology, as thee are profound and obvious differences. I was only noting that they eare both INVENTED religions.

[doug from upland]

"Our plan is, we are going to conquer America."

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And the Mental Patient from Virginia was going to shut down FreeRepublic.

[Tolerance Sucks Rocks]

Don't forget the contribution to in-flight crash tests.

[HP8753]

Bring it on....We need some cheap pig food here in the Midwest.
Corn can be expensive,and pigs ain't as fussy about You as you are about them.

[Brian Allen]

..... But I don't even read more than a dozen words into your convoluted rants .....

Then you won't have noticed they are convoluted rants, will you, woofie?

[And we won't be having this exchange!]

On the other hand, seeing you have just stated that you have noticed -- and we are -- I can see that your lying, at least, is catholic.

And that it seems reasonable to conclude that yours is the religion of the Fundamentally Dishonest.

Cordially

Brian

[Brian Allen]

I was not equating Islam and Scientology, as thee are profound and obvious differences.

I was only noting that they eare both INVENTED "religions."

Got that. And agreed.

And, I would further contend, neither scientology -- more akin to a "social-security"-like ponzi scam -- nor "islam," a malevolent form of mass-murdering Naziism -- is a "religion."

And that both are profound blasphemies.

FReegards

Brian

[Elsie]

There is a part of the Old Testament that did die with Christ on the cross.  That portion was the ceremonial portion dealing with sacrificial services which pointed to a future sacrifice of the Lamb of God. When Christ died on the cross the most holy place in the temple was opened by an unseen hand, wrending the curtain from the top to the bottom.  This signified that "the sacrifice" had been fulfilled.

The covenant that you keep refering too was the convenant (agreement) between God and man that He would purchase our souls back from Satan.  Christ, by living a perfect life, then dying on the cross did just that.  Thus the convenant was fulfilled.  Sacrificial ceremonies were therefore no longer needed.

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John 1: 29  The next day John saw Jesus coming toward him and said, "Look, the Lamb of God, who takes away the sin of the world!

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The covenant that you keep refering too was the convenant (agreement) between God and man that He would purchase our souls back from Satan.  Christ, by living a perfect life, then dying on the cross did just that.  Thus the convenant was fulfilled.  Sacrificial ceremonies were therefore no longer needed.

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Genesis 17

 

 

 1.  When Abram was ninety-nine years old, the LORD appeared to him and said, "I am God Almighty ; walk before me and be blameless.
 2.  I will confirm my covenant between me and you and will greatly increase your numbers."
 3.  Abram fell facedown, and God said to him,
 4.  "As for me, this is my covenant with you: You will be the father of many nations.
 5.  No longer will you be called Abram ; your name will be Abraham,  for I have made you a father of many nations.
 6.  I will make you very fruitful; I will make nations of you, and kings will come from you.
 7.  I will establish my covenant as an everlasting covenant between me and you and your descendants after you for the generations to come, to be your God and the God of your descendants after you.
 8.  The whole land of Canaan, where you are now an alien, I will give as an everlasting possession to you and your descendants after you; and I will be their God."
 9.  Then God said to Abraham, "As for you, you must keep my covenant, you and your descendants after you for the generations to come.
 10.  This is my covenant with you and your descendants after you, the covenant you are to keep: Every male among you shall be circumcised.
 11.  You are to undergo circumcision, and it will be the sign of the covenant between me and you.
 12.  For the generations to come every male among you who is eight days old must be circumcised, including those born in your household or bought with money from a foreigner--those who are not your offspring.
 13.  Whether born in your household or bought with your money, they must be circumcised. My covenant in your flesh is to be an everlasting covenant.
 14.  Any uncircumcised male, who has not been circumcised in the flesh, will be cut off from his people; he has broken my covenant."

 

But what does Paul say in Romans, Chapter 2?

 23.  You who brag about the law, do you dishonor God by breaking the law?
 24.  As it is written: "God's name is blasphemed among the Gentiles because of you."
 25.  Circumcision has value if you observe the law, but if you break the law, you have become as though you had not been circumcised.
 26.  If those who are not circumcised keep the law's requirements, will they not be regarded as though they were circumcised?
 27.  The one who is not circumcised physically and yet obeys the law will condemn you who, even though you have the  written code and circumcision, are a lawbreaker.
 28.  A man is not a Jew if he is only one outwardly, nor is circumcision merely outward and physical.
 29.  No, a man is a Jew if he is one inwardly; and circumcision is circumcision of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the written code. Such a man's praise is not from men, but from God.

 

And here, in Romans 4........

 6.  David says the same thing when he speaks of the blessedness of the man to whom God credits righteousness apart from works:
 7.  "Blessed are they whose transgressions are forgiven, whose sins are covered.
 8.  Blessed is the man whose sin the Lord will never count against him."
 9.  Is this blessedness only for the circumcised, or also for the uncircumcised? We have been saying that Abraham's faith was credited to him as righteousness.
 10.  Under what circumstances was it credited? Was it after he was circumcised, or before? It was not after, but before!
 11.  And he received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness that he had by faith while he was still uncircumcised. So then, he is the father of all who believe but have not been circumcised, in order that righteousness might be credited to them.
 12.  And he is also the father of the circumcised who not only are circumcised but who also walk in the footsteps of the faith that our father Abraham had before he was circumcised. 
 13.  It was not through law that Abraham and his offspring received the promise that he would be heir of the world, but through the righteousness that comes by faith.
 14.  For if those who live by law are heirs, faith has no value and the promise is worthless,
 15.  because law brings wrath. And where there is no law there is no transgression.
 16.  Therefore, the promise comes by faith, so that it may be by grace and may be guaranteed to all Abraham's offspring--not only to those who are of the law but also to those who are of the faith of Abraham. He is the father of us all.

 

Galatians 2:3

Yet not even Titus, who was with me, was compelled to be circumcised, even though he was a Greek.

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If I'm not mistaken, the Old and New Testament titles were probably a fabrication of the Biblical schollars during the King James era.  Perhaps you can point to a different derivitave.  But it's my opinion that when you start chopping up the Bible, respecting some parts and dismissing others, you've made a grave mistake.

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If I post the WHOLE chapter or book, MEGO occurs in the viewers: My Eyes Glaze Over.  If someone wants to look at it in context, they can do it quite easily enough.  On the OPPOSITE end of the spectrum are those who give their OPINION and then post hardly anything to support it.

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You quoted:

NIV Hebrews 8:6-13
 6.  But the ministry Jesus has received is as superior to theirs as the covenant of which he is mediator is superior to the old one, and it is founded on better promises.
 7.  For if there had been nothing wrong with that first covenant, no place would have been sought for another.

Are you going to sit there and tell me you take this literally?  This is a metaphor.  Of course the ministry of Jesus is better than anything that came before.  But reading more into this is state that you accept that God made a mistake with the first covenant.  The God I serve doesn't make mistakes.

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Any other bible scholars out there agree with the above statement?

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[Elsie]

 

 

the ceremonial portion?

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Deuteronomy 5
1. Moses summoned all Israel and said: Hear, O Israel, the decrees and laws I declare in your hearing today. Learn them and be sure to follow them.
(Commandments 1 thru 10 go here.......)
22. These are the commandments the LORD proclaimed in a loud voice to your whole assembly there on the mountain from out of the fire, the cloud and the deep darkness; and he added nothing more. Then he wrote them on two stone tablets and gave them to me.

 

 

2 Corinthians 3
3. You show that you are a letter from Christ, the result of our ministry, written not with ink but with the Spirit of the living God, not on tablets of stone but on tablets of human hearts.
4. Such confidence as this is ours through Christ before God.
5. Not that we are competent in ourselves to claim anything for ourselves, but our competence comes from God.
6. He has made us competent as ministers of a new covenant-- not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.
7. Now if the ministry that brought death, which was engraved in letters on stone, came with glory, so that the Israelites could not look steadily at the face of Moses because of its glory, fading though it was,
8. will not the ministry of the Spirit be even more glorious?
9. If the ministry that condemns men is glorious, how much more glorious is the ministry that brings righteousness!
10. For what was glorious has no glory now in comparison with the surpassing glory.
11. And if what was fading away came with glory, how much greater is the glory of that which lasts!
12. Therefore, since we have such a hope, we are very bold.
13. We are not like Moses, who would put a veil over his face to keep the Israelites from gazing at it while the radiance was fading away.
14. But their minds were made dull, for to this day the same veil remains when the old covenant is read. It has not been removed, because only in Christ is it taken away.
15. Even to this day when Moses is read, a veil covers their hearts.
16. But whenever anyone turns to the Lord, the veil is taken away.
17. Now the Lord is the Spirit, and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom.

 

 

 

Galatians 1
6. I am astonished that you are so quickly deserting the one who called you by the grace of Christ and are turning to a different gospel--
7. which is really no gospel at all. Evidently some people are throwing you into confusion and are trying to pervert the gospel of Christ.
8. But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let him be eternally condemned!
9. As we have already said, so now I say again: If anybody is preaching to you a gospel other than what you accepted, let him be eternally condemned!

 

 

Galatians 5
1. It is for freedom that Christ has set us free. Stand firm, then, and do not let yourselves be burdened again by a yoke of slavery.
2. Mark my words! I, Paul, tell you that if you let yourselves be circumcised, Christ will be of no value to you at all.
3. Again I declare to every man who lets himself be circumcised that he is obligated to obey the whole law.
4. You who are trying to be justified by law have been alienated from Christ; you have fallen away from grace.
5. But by faith we eagerly await through the Spirit the righteousness for which we hope.
6. For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision has any value. The only thing that counts is faith expressing itself through love.
7. You were running a good race. Who cut in on you and kept you from obeying the truth?
8. That kind of persuasion does not come from the one who calls you.
9. "A little yeast works through the whole batch of dough."
10. I am confident in the Lord that you will take no other view. The one who is throwing you into confusion will pay the penalty, whoever he may be.
11. Brothers, if I am still preaching circumcision, why am I still being persecuted? In that case the offense of the cross has been abolished.
12. As for those agitators, I wish they would go the whole way and emasculate themselves!
13. You, my brothers, were called to be free. But do not use your freedom to indulge the sinful nature ; rather, serve one another in love.
14. The entire law is summed up in a single command: "Love your neighbor as yourself."
15. If you keep on biting and devouring each other, watch out or you will be destroyed by each other.
16. So I say, live by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the sinful nature.
17. For the sinful nature desires what is contrary to the Spirit, and the Spirit what is contrary to the sinful nature. They are in conflict with each other, so that you do not do what you want.
18. But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under law.

 

[JCG]

Thank you for the PBS link it was a real eye-opener for me! I have posted it on my site.

Thanks for posting the link.  Everybody needs to see it.  Scary stuff.

 America's Fifth Column ... watch PBS documentary JIHAD! In America -- here

 For better viewing download 8Mb file here

[SmartEnough]

While inviting Muslim leaders to fellowship and "share about Islam," they should in turn "share about the Gospel." from wjeanw
Yes sir, stop the Muslims from forcing us the live under the soul-crushing weight of Sharia (rule by Quranic law) by forcing us to live under the crushing weight of rule by the Old Testament. I gotta better idea. You practice your religion, I'll practice mine and the Muslims will practice theirs. Keep all of the different religion out of government. But most importantly, keep government out of religion. from woofer

This is as far as I could get in this thread before I lost it.
We Americans need to get a clue. Islam wins through a Divide and Conquer strategy as much as any other mechanism.

To wjeanw: The majority of Muslims are BORN Muslims, not converted. When born into Islam, one cannot escape eaisly. The majority of converts to Islam are COMPELLED to convert, frequently on pain of suffering or death. ALL converts are motivated to convert through threat of violence or eternal damnation. ALL. To equate the efforts of Islam to convert non-believers to the efforts and method of Christian evangelism is highly misleading and inaccurate. When presented correctly, there is no coercion in Christian evangelism . Islam depends on coercion.

To woofer: Christianity is based on New Testament practice, not Old Testament Law. Christianity is the act of following Christ, not the act of following the Law of Moses. No Christian is forced to live by a set of laws. All Christians are asked to live as Christ asked and as the Holy Spirit leads. That is why you'll see so much diversity in the practice of Christianity. Each denomination has it's own distinctive 'personality', some strict, some liberal.

You obviously have an irrational fear of religion. Christianity is not your enemy woofer. Christians will leave you alone if that is your desire. Muslims will not. Given the opportunity and power to do so, they will convert you, or kill you, (witness the Sudan and many others throughout history).

We Americans, Christian and non-Christian, atheist or whatever, have got to get our heads on straight. We've been deeply divided and manipulated politically for so long we have fallen into opposing camps with imaginary conflicts. That is what is truly empowering our enemies. Black vs White, (for that matter Black against everyone), Non-Christian vs Christian, female vs male, etc.

Drop the silly differences and unite! Get some perspective on who the enemy truly is!

[cardinal4]

Im sorry,Im now going on record saying that it is about Islam.You know,the only Arab or Muslim leader that I have heard condemning the attacks is Qaddafi!Im sure there were others but hes the only one I heard.As long as Im breathing,America will not be muslim.If they want to convert me,its going to take a hell of a lot more than hijacking planes and crashing them into buildings.Islam is the enemy since they wont condemn the attacks.If I was a muslim in America,I would be shouting from the rooftops,that this is a crime before God and does not speak for Islam.But there is nothing but silence from the American Muslim community,except to say our policies caused it.Lets Roll!

[woofer]

You obviously have an irrational fear of religion.

No, I don't fear religion. I am quite rational.

However, my hackles get raised when the call for how to live my life is dictated by some fundamentalist teetering on the far right edge of the political spectrum. I equate those as the same as the anarchists teetering on the left edge. I like this country the way it is. I live my life as I see fit. I practice my religion as I want and I do not wear it on my sleeve. Nor do I force-feed it to all within shouting distance.