Posted on 10/15/2001 6:54:40 AM PDT by malakhi
| Statesmen may plan and speculate for liberty, but it is religion and morality alone which can establish the principles upon which freedom can securely stand. The only foundation of a free constitution is pure virtue. - John Adams |
LOL..oh boy, even simple question can lead to questions. We'll forget about what heaven is for a moment and I'll answer it this way. I believe that I am on the road to salvation. I am in the process of repenting for my transgressions of Gods law and I am earnestly seeking Gods forgiveness through Christ.
If you mean that I believe that I don't have to obey the Ten Commandments in order to get to Heaven, then you are right.
"[21] I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain." - Ga 2:21"[1] O foolish Galatians, who hath bewitched you, that ye should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ hath been evidently set forth, crucified among you? [2] This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith? [3] Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?" - Ga 3:1-3
"[19] Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator. [20] Now a mediator is not a mediator of one, but God is one. [21] Is the law then against the promises of God? God forbid: for if there had been a law given which could have given life, verily righteousness should have been by the law. [22] But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe. [23] But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed. [24] Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith. [25] But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.
The Law serves its purpose in pointing out our sinfulness so that we will understand our need for a Saviour and will seek Him out.
-ksen
You learned that Mary is older than God, created God, and is therefore the Mother of the entire Triune Godhead in Catholic school and every Catholic you know thinks this?
This is the ridiculous "reason" given why we should not call Mary the "Mother of God." That uninformed people, upon hearing the phrase will think all of the above. Therefore we should not call her "Mother of God," even though it's true, because of what ignorant people will think.
This is the argument made by all of the non-Catholics here.
My argument is that if we limit what we say, what we declare as true, based upon the lowest common denominator, the staunchest, unteachable, ignorant slob we limit ourselves to saying nothing. Telling some ignoramus that Mary is the Mother of God will make him thing that Mary created God. So we better not say it. Telling that same ignoramus that he is saved by "faith alone" will make him think that he doesn't need to try to avoid sin. So we better not say it.
You can question anything you want about my beliefs but If I answer that I don't believe those are areas we should go such as making a statement like "Mary is the mother of God" becasue she is the mother of Jesus, accept my answer.
I do accept that your answer is your answer. I also accept that it displays a fear of rationality, and I will say so.
SD
Should you try?
SD
Why do you make such a sweeping generalization. Ya oughta stop doin' that. She's the mother of Jesus. She's not God.
Why do you make such a sweeping generalization.
I'm sorry. Many of the non-Catholics here.
She's the mother of Jesus. She's not God.
Who in the hell said she was God?
Can you step back and think abstractly for a minute? Why should my "Truth" be censored because of what dumbasses will think it means?
SD
Did you read the Scriptures I posted?
No, I should not try to keep the Ten Commandments in order to get to Heaven. I could think of no better way to scoff at what Christ has done for me on Calvary than to tell Him,"I know you paid the whole thing Lord, but I want to try it on my own anyway."
We should strive to keep the Moral Law because of our gratitude to Him and to keep from having bad consequences while we are still on earth. To take an example from a previous post of yours: I have Christ as my Saviour, He has paid the Eternal penalty for all of my sins past, present, and future. If I were now to go out and rob a bank and die in the attempt I will still go to Heaven, but I have also reaped what I have sown here on earth because I am now dead due to a gunshot wound inflicted while I was trying to rob said bank.
God is under no obligation to protect me from the consequences of my actions here on earth.
-ksen
There is no proof that Jesus rose on Sunday, in fact he rose between the legal sunset and the Jewish sunset, which would make his resurrection time up to the person who had a personal reason for wanting either one.
In all accounts of his resurrection, it states that at sunrise he has risen, which is a past tense term which could mean from one minute ago as far as day's ago.
I would like to show you a few verses:)
1 Tim. 1:9 Who hath saved us and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own prupose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the orld began.
Eph. 2:8-9 You are saved by grace through faith and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God. Not of works lest any man should boast.
Titus 3:5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and the renewing of the Holy Spirit.
Can you see from these verses that salvation is immediate when the person sincerely seeks it. Yes we do need to repent but the repentance is BECAUSE we are saved not to get saved. There is nothing we do or don't do that will save us. Only belief in the sacrafice of Jesus Christ.
John 6:28-29 Then said they unto him what shall we do that we might work the work of God, Jesus answered and said to them, This is the work of God that ye beleive on him who he has sent.
EVERYTHING we do from Baptism to good works is done BECAUSE we are saved, not to get saved or stay saved. We do it because of love and gratitude to God for sending his son to take our punishment.
If you don't understand salvation, worrying about the 10 commandments or what day to worship on will not matter. I am not saying they are not important but look over God's plan because his plan is the one that matters.
John 14:6 Jesus said unto him I am THE way, THE truth and THE life, no man cometh unto the Father but by me. In other words ONE way to heaven.
Becky
If done by rote and without any actual feeling it is vain and lifeless. If the acts of penance are done mechanically they are of no avail. You are absolutely right and this is something that needs to be taught better.
SD
I cannot think of a more important question that everyone needs to make that they don't have the wrong answer to.
-ksen
If there is no actual mention of the day in Scripture, then I guess we have here one of the great all time passed on Traditions of Christianity. Everyone knows it was on Sunday.
What is the difference between "legal" and "Jewish" sunsets? I've never heard of such a thing.
SD
thank you
Who in the hell said she was God?
Nobody, I just threw that in like you did when ya said "all non-christians believe this"
Can you step back and think abstractly for a minute?
Sure I'm just as cable of doing that as you are.
Why should my "Truth" be censored because of what dumbasses will think it means?
cuz your truth isn't necessarily "the truth"?
I have no problem calling Mary the mother of God here on earth. I'm just not sure how they got all that ironed out in the spiritual realm. Neither do you. And quit calling people Asses, assholes and dumasses, its beneath you.
Becky
I'm sure I will be. ;o) Just make sure he doesn't bad mouth Texas!
This is very much along the lines of what I was trying to say.
Becky
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