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The FReeper Foxhole Remembers Sherman's March to the Sea (Nov 1864 - Mar 1865) - Dec 23rd, 2003
Speech Presented to Pensacola Civil War Round Table ^ | March 4, 1993. | William A. Byrne, Ph.D.

Posted on 12/23/2003 12:00:09 AM PST by SAMWolf

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When Sherman left Atlanta, he had no Confederate army in front of him. John Bell Hood had gone back to Tennessee, hoping to persuade Sherman to follow him. Instead Sherman sent George Thomas, the Rock of Chickamauga, after Hood, while he, Sherman, turned east. Then he did an astounding thing: His supply lines consisted of the railroad between Chattanooga and Atlanta. To keep Hood from cutting those lines, he cut them himself. He was entirely on his own, no supplies, no communications, as if he had simply dropped off the end of the earth. That brought much destruction right off the bat. He had to feed those 60,000 troops of his, and his foragers -- his "bummers" -- were not especially mannerly or genteel when they looked for food, particularly since Southerners were doing all they could to keep their food hidden. (This, by the way, was why the swath he cut was 50 to 460 miles wide. If a single column had gone through Georgia, the people in front would have feasted, but the people in back would have starved, to death. This way everybody got fed.)


General John Bell Hood, CSA


Sherman's foragers were under orders not to "enter the dwellings of the inhabitants or commit any trespass." Officers alone could order destruction of property and then only in areas of guerrilla activity. Do not think that these orders were strictly followed. They weren't. But do not think they were wholly disregarded either. While many houses in Georgia were plundered, relatively few were burned. Even when Sherman left Atlanta, few private residences were burned, David O. Selznick to the contrary notwithstanding. Anything useful in the Confederate war effort, though, was destroyed: railroads, mills, cotton gins, factories, foundries, anything of that sort, and this was true not only in Atlanta, but also along the way. Anything connected with slavery -- auction blocks, slave pens, whipping posts -- was destroyed too.

Still, the real devastation did not begin until Sherman's men hit South Carolina in February 1865. The March to the Sea had been total war, but it had been conducted almost as a philosophical exercise. We must break the will of these people to resist, we must show them that they cannot continue to fight us. If some eggs get broken -- or eaten -- well, we're sorry about that. The march through South Carolina was different. Sherman, Sherman's army, Northerners in general, hated South Carolina. South Carolina was -- and obviously quite deservedly so -- the symbol of Southern secessionist defiance. When the army entered South Carolina, it was total war with a vengeance, not just burning and looting and destroying, but burning, looting, and destroying with conviction. The capital city of Columbia was burned. The army said it was an accident, and it seems clear today that it was, but many of Sherman's troops agreed that if the accident had not taken place they would have done it on purpose. At least 13 other cities were burned. Right before the army left Savannah, Sherman wrote, "Don't forget that when you have crossed the Savannah River you will be in South Carolina. You need not be so careful there about private property as we have been. The more of it you destroy the better it will be. The people of South Carolina should be made to feel the war, for they brought it on and are responsible more than anybody else for our presence here. Now is the time to punish them." So, you say, this is what you call gentle? I understand, you say, that Sherman may have had a reason for his depredations and his cruelties. War is hell, after all. But you, Byrne, you brought up the possibility that Sherman was gentle and that we should be thanking him for that. Again, this is what you call gentle?



And I would say, yes it is. And that's because there is one word that I have not yet used in this talk, not in direct connection with Sherman anyway, and that word is death. The one thing we always associate with warfare is the one thing not associated with Sherman's march, not even the South Carolina part of it. Even though the Civil War was the bloodiest in American history, hardly anybody died in this campaign. For all intents and purposes anyway, no noncombatants died. If people were belligerent to Sherman's troops, they paid for it. What they possessed was destroyed. But, unless they were stupid enough to try to take on Sherman's whole army, they themselves lived to tell the tale. Once, they were stupid enough, with tragic results. At Griswoldville, Georgia, the local militia actually decided to attack Sherman's army, right out in the open. The outcome was predictable: the militia was stomped, and afterwards Sherman's men were horrified to find out that the Georgians were all either old men or young boys.

The norm, though, was very different. Sherman clearly was determined to bring the war home to the Southern people, but he equally clearly preferred destruction to death. He put it this way in January 1864, "Of course I must fight them when the time comes, but wherever a result can be accomplished without battle, I prefer it." And he was serious. If Grant was the Joe Frazier of Civil War generals, Sherman, in a very real, if weird sort of way, was the Ali. He could sting like a bee when he had to, but he much preferred to float like a butterfly.


Savannah, Ga., vicinity. Sherman's troops removing ammunition from Fort McAllister in wheelbarrows


He was trying to teach a lesson, and when Southerners demonstrated they had learned the lesson, he stopped the teaching. Two examples: When he arrived at Savannah, the city fathers were there to welcome him. He was treated hospitably, and as a consequence, his troops were on their best behavior. Neither property nor persons were harmed while Sherman was in Savannah. If he wanted to show Southerners that continued resistance was folly, he had to reward them when they stopped resisting -- and he did. Example number two: When he left Savannah, his troops, as you know, went on a rampage through South Carolina, the first state to leave the Union, but, when they hit North Carolina, the last state to leave, their behavior changed. Sherman wanted them to "deal as moderately and fairly by the North Carolinians as possible." Military targets were still smashed, of course, but the wanton destruction ceased. Besides, victory by now was assured. Why continue to destroy?

Sherman really did think, then, that he was being gentle on the South, compared to what the possibilities were. And there was a reason for his gentleness: He was genuinely fond of the South, except, of course, for its wayward, secessionist ways. Some of his happiest times before the war had been spent in the South, especially when he was the first superintendent of the Louisiana Military Seminary in Alexandria, which would go on to become L.S.U. Many of his best friends were Southern. He really did cry when South Carolina seceded. And he wrote, from Louisiana, "You are driving me and hundreds of others out of the South, who have cast fortunes here, love your people and want to stay... Yet I must give up all, and go away; and if war comes, as I fear it surely will, I must fight your people whom I best love." Listen to the anguish in that voice. When he left Alexandria in February 1861, he called a formation. He told his students, who were crying, goodbye. When he came to his professors, he broke down. All he could do was point to his heart and whisper, "You are all here." He had no desire, on the battlefield, to kill his friends.


Charleston, South Carolina


And so we have here the supreme irony. Sherman accomplished his mission. Because of his extraordinary change of tactics and strategy, he succeeded in saving a great many lives indeed, but he did so at the cost of his own future reputation in the South. Most ironic indeed.

Regardless of his reputation, after the war Sherman got along well with many of his previous Confederate opponents. He remained friendly, for example, with Hood and Bragg and Longstreet, and especially with his principal adversary that last year of the war, Joe Johnston. When Sherman died in February 1891, Joe Johnston came north to New York City to be an honorary pallbearer at the funeral. It was a very cold day. As Sherman's casket was being carried from his house, Johnston, whose own health was weak, stood outside, bareheaded, with the other pallbearers. Someone urged Johnston to put his hat on, or he might get sick. Johnston replied, "If I were in his place and he were standing here in mine, he would not put on his hat." It was a sweet and lovely gesture, but when Johnston left New York City he left with a severe cold. It is not writ in stone that Johnston caught the cold from standing bareheaded, but who can say he didn't. The cold aggravated a bad heart condition, and a month later Joe Johnston passed away. Which means that, even when he wasn't trying, Sherman could hurt the South. Even in death, Southerners could not escape him. But you can't blame him for that, I don't think.

1 posted on 12/23/2003 12:00:10 AM PST by SAMWolf
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To: snippy_about_it; PhilDragoo; Johnny Gage; Victoria Delsoul; Darksheare; Valin; bentfeather; radu; ..
War Approaches the Heart of South Carolina


It was near the close of the war before invasion reached for the very heart of South Carolina. Prior to this, only the coast had suffered invasion by the bluecoat. Sherman's march to the sea was the beginning of the end for South Carolina. In 1864 the Confederacy was tottering to its fall. By that time the crisis of the war had passed with the fall of Vicksburg on the Mississippi and the battle of Gettysburg. Most of the seaports had fallen and the South was shut off from commerce, except such as could be carried on under blockade conditions. Our people went back to home-made clothes, raised less cotton and more grain. Coffee, tea and other luxuries were not to be had, while such necessaries as salt were hard to get. Sherman began the Georgia expedition with the intention of destroying the military resources of the state. He entered Georgia in May, 1864, with nearly 100,000 soldiers. He was opposed near Dalton by General Joseph E. Johnston, with a force of 50,000, later increased to 64,000 men. Johnston had difficulty getting his commanders to stand and fight, and fell back again and again.


General Joesph E. Johnston, CSA


I have read many excuses for Johnston's inability to fight, but the simple fact remains that a good commander can get his men to fight, and get more out of them than an ordinary mortal. Viewed in this context, Johnston was unable to stem the Sherman tide. Johnston retreated before Sherman's greater army until he reached Marietta, where in the mountainous country he made a stand for twenty-three days of hard fighting. Johnston lost 10,000 of his men, but Sherman's loss was 25,000 (putting the numbers at ~75,000 versus ~54,000). Early in July Sherman forced Johnston to fall back again to prevent being cut off from Atlanta.

On July 17th President Davis removed Johnston from command, turning his army over to General Hood. General Hood was a poor commander. He attacked Sherman, throwing away seasoned and badly needed men, and was severely defeated. He was forced to leave Atlanta, and instead of going southward, he led his army toward Tennessee, hoping that Sherman would follow. But the Federal general detached a part of his army to watch Hood and prepared the remainder for his march. Hood's ineptitude left Sherman essentially unopposed. There was no force left in the deep South that could come close to opposing Sherman now. South Carolina here we come! (gulp)

The Burning of Atlanta - a Portent of Things to Come!
Ya'll Don't Come Now - You Heah?



Atlanta Depot, after Sherman's departure


When he entered Atlanta, Sherman issued an order requiring all the people to leave within five days. Hood protested against this order, and the mayor and council of Atlanta appealed to Sherman to withdraw it, pointing out that most of the inhabitants were women and children, who would suffer greatly if compelled to leave their homes. To this Sherman replied, "I have read it [the petition] carefully, and give full credit to your statements of the distress that will be occasioned, and yet shall not revoke my orders, because they were not designed to meet the humanities of the case." When all preparations for the southward march had been made and the people had been forced to depart, Sherman burned Atlanta to the ground.

The March Begins


In preparing for the long march before him, Sherman left behind all disabled or weak men, and made up a fine army of 60,000 seasoned veterans, of whom 5,000 were cavalry. The army was to feed itself on the country. Each brigade had a party of foragers, called "bummers." These men were instructed to take all necessary provisions, horses and mules, but were ordered not to enter dwellings, nor insult the people, and were told to leave a part of their property to every family, so that none would be destitute. Where the army was not opposed, Sherman ordered that mills, cotton gins and houses should not be destroyed; but they were to be burned, if resistance were made. All these orders were very badly obeyed, no effort seemingly having been made to enforce the instructions.

Atlanta to Milledgeville



Sherman's "Bummers" foraging in South Carolina


The march was directed toward the capital, Milledgeville. Sherman divided his army into two divisions, the right wing under General O. O. Howard following the railroad by Jonesboro and McDonough, with orders to stop at Gordon, on the Central of Georgia Railroad; the left wing, under General H. W. Slocum, marching by way of Decatur and Covington to Madison; and thence to Milledgeville. General Sherman was with the left wing. The army spread out, visiting the important towns in that section of the state. The movement from Atlanta began on November 15th, and by the 23rd Sherman and the left wing reached Milledgeville, and the right wing had stopped at Gordon. Sherman did not destroy the capitol buildings at Milledgeville.

Milledgeville to Savannah


On November 24th the march was resumed, now in the direction of Savannah. Sherman's army visited in this section Sandersville, Tennille, Louisville, Millen and other towns. Although I cannot speak for all towns, in Louisville, where some of my kin resided, Sherman's men piled all deed books in front of the court house and burned them. The logic was that the big plantations would not be able to prove land ownership. These actions are the bane of Georgia and South Carolina genealogists. The cavalry, under Kilpatrick, passed through many places not visited by the army, such as Waynesboro. In this part of Georgia Sherman was opposed by small bodies of cavalry and infantry under various generals. These small forces did not expect to stop Sherman's army, but hoped to keep it in a narrow path, so as to limit the amount of destruction.

The Fall of Savannah



Sherman's Army Entering Savannah


On December 9th the Federal army reached the neighborhood of Savannah. The city was defended by General Hardee with 10,000 men, and was well protected by forts and by the rice swamps which had been flooded. Though cannonading was kept up for a number of days between attackers and defenders, the city was not hurt. After cooperation had been established between Sherman and the Federal gunboats on the coast and in the mouths of the rivers, Hardee saw that it would be impossible to hold Savannah, and in order to save his army he withdrew across the Savannah River into South Carolina, on December 21st. On the following day Sherman entered Savannah and sent this telegram to President Lincoln: "I beg to present you as a Christmas gift the City of Savannah, with one hundred and fifty guns and plenty of ammunition, also about twenty-five thousand bales of cotton."

Sherman's Conduct in Georgia


No other campaign in the entire war has contributed more to keeping alive sectional feeling than Sherman's march through Georgia and South Carolina. The march began in November, after the crops had been gathered. The "bummers" found the barns bursting with grain, fodder, and peas, the outhouses full of cotton, the yards crowded with hogs, chickens, and turkeys. The soldiers in the Southern armies were starving, not because there was no food, but because the rail roads had been destroyed and it was impossible to send supplies to the front. Sherman was not content simply to use what food and supplies he needed, but boasted that he would "smash things to the sea" and make Georgia howl. His men entered dwellings, taking everything of value that could be moved, such as silver plate and jewelry; and killed and left dead in the pens thousands of hogs, sheep and poultry. Many dwellings were burned without any justification. Sherman in his own Memoirs testifies to the conduct of his men, estimating that he had destroyed $80,000,000 worth of property of which he could make no use. This he describes as "simple waste and destruction." One of the most serious aspects of his work was the destruction of the railroads; the Central from Macon to Savannah, for instance, was almost totally ruined. According to Angle and Miers (1960), Sherman had no black soldiers in his army and did not think highly of them.


Columbia, South Carolina


When William Tecumseh Sherman finally crossed the Savannah River into South Carolina, destruction and the torch were the game. There was no Confederate force remaining in the area that could stop him. The Battle of Honey Hill occurred in Jasper Co. The map tells it all. He burned Orangeburgh and Columbia to the ground.

The End of the War, 1865


Leaving Georgia, General Sherman continued his excursion through South Carolina, burning Columbia, the capital. He had reached North Carolina when news came of Lee's surrender at Appomattox. Johnston had by this time been replaced in his old command, and had somehow gathered all remaining troops in the area in North Carolina in a last desperate attempt to meet up with Robert E. Lee. Johnston realized the end was at hand, and he surrendered to Sherman in North Carolina.

Summary




The war lasted four years, from April, 1861, to April, 1865, and during the entire time the South was on the defensive. Was this contest hopeless against the great resources of the North? We shall have more to say on this, and it can be argued that the war could have been won by the South, but that the outcome would have been the same, slavery was at an end. Immigration and the stimulus given to industry in the North by the war constantly increased the wealth of that section; whereas in the South men killed or captured could not be replaced, and the Confederacy grew poorer financially with every passing year. In time, the Southern ports were blockaded and the export of cotton, our one source of money, prevented. The most remarkable thing about the war is that it lasted so long; and this can be explained only by taking into account the spirit of Southerners, plus the fact that this was a defensive war. As South Carolina was a very distant state from the Army of the Potomac, it was necessary to break the barrier afforded by the other states before invasion could reach us. As nearly all able-bodied men were then in the army, resistance to Sherman was for all practical purposes impossible, and the Union army had an almost unopposed march through Georgia in the winter of 1864 and on into South Carolina. Lee's surrender the following spring closed the war.

Dr. Frank Oliver Clark

Additional Sources:

www.geocities.com/genebrooks
sciway3.net/clark
www.angelfire.com/md/camp1400
www.civilwarhome.com
www.rootsweb.com/~neresour
www.webcom.com/crumbley
www.hsgng.org
www.cohums.ohio-state.edu
memory.loc.gov
libweb.uncc.edu
ngeorgia.com
www.sewanee.edu
www.savannahmorningnews.com
johnbellhood.org
www.savannahbound.com
www.historyhouse.com

2 posted on 12/23/2003 12:01:15 AM PST by SAMWolf (I love deadlines. Especially the whooshing sound they make as they go flying by.)
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To: All
Sherman's March


General William T. Sherman's march to the sea has been depicted in history books as a grand event equal in scope to the exploits of the Roman Empire or Napoleonic France. White Southerns, however, had quite a different view of the "grand event." They saw it as a marauding band of barbaric invaders intent only on plunder and utter devastation of all they touched.

Indeed, there were few strategic military objectives and no armies to fight--only defenseless civilians to whom Sherman showed merciless disdain as he systematically destroyed the accumulated wealth of generations.

Sherman's army entered Columbia, S.C., on February 17, 1865. Despite Sherman's assurance to the contary, the city was, in the words of Rebel General Wade Hampton, "burned to the ground, deliberately, systematically, and atrociously" that night by tourch-wielding Union soldiers. "Having utterly ruined Columbia," according to Sherman, his army resumed its march northward on February 20, burning everything in its path until reaching North Carolina on March 7.

Sherman's men did not feel the same hatred toward North Carolina as they did for the "cradle of secession" to the south--or perhaps they were finally sickened by their actions. In any event, the great devastation abated, but plunder and robbery continued as Sherman's troops moved through the state.

By March 11, Sherman's force was concentrated at Fayetteville, N.C., and the next day he made contact with the federal force that had recently captured Wilimington, N.C. "Up to this point," Sherman reported, "I had perfectly succeeded in interposing my superior army between the scattered parts of the enemy." But now he found that Confederate forces commanded by General Joseph E. Johnson were concentrating in his path.

Fascinating Fact: Columbia's Ursuline Convent and Academy, where the daughters of prominent Southerners and Northerners had been educated, was burned to the ground despite the fact that the mother superior had once taught Sherman's daughter.

Stephen T. Foster


3 posted on 12/23/2003 12:01:51 AM PST by SAMWolf (I love deadlines. Especially the whooshing sound they make as they go flying by.)
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To: All


Veterans for Constitution Restoration is a non-profit, non-partisan educational and grassroots activist organization. The primary area of concern to all VetsCoR members is that our national and local educational systems fall short in teaching students and all American citizens the history and underlying principles on which our Constitutional republic-based system of self-government was founded. VetsCoR members are also very concerned that the Federal government long ago over-stepped its limited authority as clearly specified in the United States Constitution, as well as the Founding Fathers' supporting letters, essays, and other public documents.





Tribute to a Generation - The memorial will be dedicated on Saturday, May 29, 2004.





Actively seeking volunteers to provide this valuable service to Veterans and their families.



4 posted on 12/23/2003 12:02:22 AM PST by SAMWolf (I love deadlines. Especially the whooshing sound they make as they go flying by.)
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To: carton253; Matthew Paul; mark502inf; Skylight; The Mayor; Professional Engineer; PsyOp; Samwise; ...



FALL IN to the FReeper Foxhole!



Good Tuesday Morning Everyone

If you would like added to our ping list let us know.

5 posted on 12/23/2003 3:27:42 AM PST by snippy_about_it (Fall in --> The FReeper Foxhole. America's History. America's Soul.)
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To: snippy_about_it
Good morning to everyone at the Foxhole. We had a cold front pass through yesterday. It feels a bit chilly and windy this morning but they're forecasting lower 60's for Christmas day.<p.How's things where you are?
6 posted on 12/23/2003 3:33:09 AM PST by E.G.C.
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To: SAMWolf
The war was fought not so much to conquer a territory, as to conquer a people.

Thank God the North was never able to conquer the idea of the South, it still lives!

Interesting read Sam, lots of information I hadn't considered before. However, I still think what Sherman did, especially to South Carolina was overboard and unnecessarily cruel and evil and just plain vindictive. /rant

Thank you for presenting this information. The FReeper Foxhole, we report, you decide.

7 posted on 12/23/2003 4:23:56 AM PST by snippy_about_it (Fall in --> The FReeper Foxhole. America's History. America's Soul.)
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To: E.G.C.
Good morning EGC.

We had a heat wave over night, it's 48 degrees this morning. It's all downhill from here though. Down to 29 and only up to 32 the next few days with some snow.
8 posted on 12/23/2003 4:26:18 AM PST by snippy_about_it (Fall in --> The FReeper Foxhole. America's History. America's Soul.)
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To: snippy_about_it
If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. —1 John 1:9


Lord, give me courage to confess,
To bare my sinful heart to Thee;
Forgiving love You long to show
And from my sin to set me free. —D. De Haan

Confession to God always brings cleansing from God.

9 posted on 12/23/2003 4:44:38 AM PST by The Mayor (You don't need to know where you're going if you let God do the leading)
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To: The Mayor
Good morning Mayor.
10 posted on 12/23/2003 4:46:20 AM PST by snippy_about_it (Fall in --> The FReeper Foxhole. America's History. America's Soul.)
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To: SAMWolf; radu; RadioAstronomer; Aeronaut; AntiJen; Victoria Delsoul; Valin; All
Hello everybody!

Hope everyone has a SUPER GREAT Christmas and New Year!

Happy Hanukkah to all the Jewish Freepers!

This will my last day to post on FR until 2004 as I am going to be off from work from 12/24/03 until 01/02/04.

YIPPIE!

Tomorrow I’m gonna see “The Return of the King” and then I’m going over to my parents’ house for Christmas Eve dinner and to open presents (a family tradition ever since I was a kid)

I need to make some wishes for all my Friends on FreeRepublic for this Christmas and for the coming year.

I wish everyone the happiest of Christmases and may God bless you all!

I wish 2004 will be a year a triumph and prosperity for each and every one of you. May this election year be a successful one for President Bush and for all good people running for office.

May all good Americans be celebrating victory on Nov. 2 this year.

May the terrorists be made small while true patriots become tall!

May God continue to bless President and Mrs. Bush; the Troops; All our elected officials; and all that post and lurk on Free Republic; and may God continue to bless America!


11 posted on 12/23/2003 5:07:31 AM PST by Pippin (world's TALLEST hobbit)
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To: snippy_about_it; SAMWolf
Topic switch:

There has been a lot of speculation about the battle of Gettysburg if Jackson had survived his wounds at Chancellorsville.

I would like to introduce two new scenarios to kick around.

The maps that Lee used at Gettysburg were drawn by Jed Hotchkiss of Jackson's staff during the winter 1862-1863. Jackson wanted to go North.

Most of the "what ifs" have Jackson taking the high ground, but I don't think the South would have engaged at Gettysburg at all because there would have been no need.

If Jackson hadn't died, Lee would not have split the 2nd Corp. So Ewell and AP Hill would not have been in two parts of the country.

Ewell was sent to Harrisburg, but moved slowly and cautiously. This allowed the Union soldiers to burn the bridge over the Susquehanna before the 2nd Corps arrived. That's not a mistake that Jackson would have made. His reputation was of swift movement and arriving into cities by ways the enemy least expected. So, if the 2nd Corp was to go to Harrisburg and occupy it... Jackson would have done so.

But, lets say that Lee would not have sent Jackson to Harrisburg and assigned the 2nd Corp the position AP Hill occupied with the 3rd Corp. I still don't think the battle would have occured.

The Battle of Gettysburg happened because Harry Heth went looking for shoes. First, would Jackson have given Heth permission to go requisition those shoes? He might have.

But, and this is a huge but... AP Hill disregarded Johnston Pettigrew's report that Union Calvary was in Gettysburg. Hill did that because Pettigrew was from North Carolina and somehow that diminished Pettigrew in Hill's thinking. (Hill thought Pettigrew didn't know the difference between Calvary and militia) I believe Jackson would have believed Pettigrew. If Jackson believed that dismounted Calvary was in Gettysburg, he might have not sent Harry Heth into Gettysburg under those circumstances.

Even though Stuart was having trouble getting back to the Army, Jackson wouldt not have permitted Stuart to venture so far away from the army while the invasion was taking place.

Jackson said the only reason he could do the flank move around Hooker at Chancellorsville is because Hooker sent away his Calvary. I wonder if Jackson would have insisted that some part of Stuart's calvary be assigned to his command in the 2nd Corp so that he was not wandering through the enemy territory blind.

Just fuel for thought.

12 posted on 12/23/2003 5:14:53 AM PST by carton253 (It's time to draw your sword and throw away the scabbard... General TJ Jackson)
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To: snippy_about_it
And once again my theory, there are North Koreans, North Vietnamese, and Yankees. They are all the same, coming down South causing problems.
13 posted on 12/23/2003 5:42:42 AM PST by U S Army EOD (When the EOD technician screws up, he is always the first to notice.)
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To: SAMWolf; stand watie; sultan88; yankhater; AppyPappy; WhiskeyPapa; Militiaman7
"I mean, nobody white and Southern hates Ulysses S. Grant any more. Nobody hates Abraham Lincoln any more."

Somebody ain't been FReepin' the same Civil War threads that I have, apparently...MUD

14 posted on 12/23/2003 5:42:53 AM PST by Mudboy Slim (RE-IMPEACH Osama bil Clinton!!)
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To: Pippin

15 posted on 12/23/2003 5:47:03 AM PST by snippy_about_it (Fall in --> The FReeper Foxhole. America's History. America's Soul.)
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To: SAMWolf
Johnston had difficulty getting his commanders to stand and fight, and fell back again and again.

I've never heard this, but didn't Johnston fall back time and time again because he was fighting for the rail line connecting Atlanta and the deep south to Tennessee and Richmond. Time and time again, Sherman flanked him to cut the rail line.. Johnston had no choice but to retreat. But, when he fought, he fought with great vigor defeating the Yankees until once more Sherman flanked him and threatened to cut off the railroad.

16 posted on 12/23/2003 5:51:25 AM PST by carton253 (It's time to draw your sword and throw away the scabbard... General TJ Jackson)
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To: snippy_about_it
Thank You Snippy!
17 posted on 12/23/2003 5:51:47 AM PST by Pippin (world's TALLEST hobbit)
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To: SAMWolf
Now I'm all depressed. :( Thanks for the interesting lesson, nonetheless.
18 posted on 12/23/2003 5:52:26 AM PST by SpookBrat
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To: carton253
To much fuel for thought for me. LOL.

Most of the "what ifs" sound good in theory, in practice or if they would have happened, who knows. My problem with "what ifs" are that even those theories will then have their own "what ifs". While interesting to theorize about, I see them as never ending. I know this, I wish the South had prevailed in their fight for State's Rights.

Good morning carton253. :-)
19 posted on 12/23/2003 5:52:48 AM PST by snippy_about_it (Fall in --> The FReeper Foxhole. America's History. America's Soul.)
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To: U S Army EOD
Good morning W.

Where have you been? I like your theory!
20 posted on 12/23/2003 5:55:50 AM PST by snippy_about_it (Fall in --> The FReeper Foxhole. America's History. America's Soul.)
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