An Interview with Michael Davies, From Sursum Corda magazine

Michael Davies, 60, is a retired British teacher who has written 15 books of special interest to Catholic traditionalists. As president of Una Voce International-he has met recently with Archbishop Justin Rigali of St. Louis, and Cardinals Joseph Ratzinger, Alfons Stickler and Angelo Felici, all Vatican officials. He reports they are uniformly encouraging about Una Voce's goal to establish the traditional Latin Mass everywhere as an option for Catholics.

SURSUM CORDA: You are now in your second year as President of the International Una Voce Federation. Could you tell us something about the origins of the federation?

MICHAEL DAVIES: You will be very surprised to learn that the Federation came into being not in a predominantly Catholic Country but in Norway, which has one of the smallest percentages of Catholics in Europe. It was the idea of Dr. Borghild Krane, an eminent Norwegian psychologist, who appealed to concerned Catholics to group together in defense of the Church's Latin liturgical heritage. As a result of her appeal a number of national associations came into being in 1964/65, starting with France, where, by a most happy inspiration, it was named Una Voce- One Voice. The official date of its foundation is 19th December 1964. Dr. Eric de Saventhem was President of the Federation from its inception until the end of 1994, which was when I became president.

We now have affiliated organizations in about twenty countries and several more may apply for membership within the coming year.

I am surprised that the Federation was founded in 1964, as I understand that its purpose is to preserve and promote the use of the Tridentine Mass, which was still in use at that time.

You are perfectly correct. The New Order of Mass-Novus Ordo Missae- was not promulgated until April 1969, and the complete New Missal of Pope Paul VI did not appear until 1970. The original purpose of the Federation was to preserve the use of Latin in the liturgy of the Roman Rite in obedience to Vatican II, which had commanded that Latin should remain the norm. Our founders were particularly concerned at the evident threat to the Church's musical heritage, which was almost entirely Latin and was described in the Council's Liturgy Constitution as a treasure of immeasurable value, one that was to be preserved and fostered with great care.

But the Council did not close until December 1965. Are you saying that it was being disobeyed while it was still in session?

Quite the contrary. In January 1964 Pope Paul VI signed a motu proprio entitled Sacram Liturgiam. A motu proprio is a papal act, a document of the very highest authority. It forbade the hasty introduction of the vernacular and insisted that all translations must be approved by Rome.

Several hierarchies expressed their displeasure with the Pope, and the French hierarchy made it clear that it was going ahead with the vernacular no matter what Rome might say.

It rewrote the motu proprio, making fifteen changes to the original version so that the French hierarchy, and any other hierarchy that decided to introduce the vernacular at once, would not be breaking the law.

Actually, Dietrich von Hildebrand lamented the fact that by 1966 Latin had virtually vanished from the Roman Rite, the Latin Rite, throughout the world. In the United States the Latin Mass was practically non-existent. Von Hildebrand made the most perceptive analysis that I have ever seen of the fundamental error at the heart of the liturgical reform, an error which explains why it is devoid of good fruits.

Let me quote von Hildebrand: "The basic error of most of the innovations is to imagine that the new liturgy brings the holy sacrifice of the Mass nearer to the faithful, that shorn of its old rituals the Mass now enters into the substance of our lives. For the question is whether we better meet Christ in the Mass by soaring up to Him, or by dragging Him down into our own pedestrian, workaday world. The innovators would replace holy intimacy with Christ by an unbecoming familiarity. The new liturgy actually threatens to frustrate the confrontation with Christ, for it discourages reverence in the face of mystery, precludes awe, and all but extinguishes a sense of sacredness. What really matters, surely, is not whether the faithful feel at home at Mass, but whether they are drawn out of their ordinary lives into the world of Christ-whether their attitude is the response of ultimate reverence, whether they are imbued with the reality of Christ."

Is this why you opted for the preservation of the Tridentine Mass rather than simply seeking to have the New Mass celebrated in Latin when it was introduced in 1969?

Precisely. Once again von Hildebrand expresses the spirit that motivated our Federation far more eloquently than I could. In the same article he writes: "A Catholic should regard his liturgy with pietas, he should revere, and therefore fear to abandon the prayers and postures and music that have been approved by so many saints throughout the Christian era and delivered to us as a precious heritage."

Pope Pius XII described von Hildebrand as "the twentieth-century doctor of the Church."

And with good reason. I would defy anyone to cite a more profound exposition of the heart of the Catholic liturgy than his book Liturgy and Personality.

But it rewards the effort. But there is a book by him which is easy reading and which I would urge every reader to obtain.

The Devastated Vineyard. All I will say is that he seems to have been possessed by a holy fury, the sort that motivated the Old Testament prophets.

What progress would you say that your federation has made since its foundation? Many would say that you are fighting a lost cause.

Not at all. Let me take you through the facts. When Pope Paul VI promulgated his New Mass in 1969 he took it for granted that it would totally replace the Missal of St. Pius V, which dated back in all essentials to the pontificate of St. Gregory the Great at the end of the sixth century.

Yes, but within a year Pope Paul had been persuaded to allow the Missal of St. Pius to continue as an approved Missal within the Roman Rite.

It would indeed. It was obtained for the faithful of England and Wales entirely on his own initiative by Cardinal John Heenan of Westminster.

There is not the least doubt that it was the founding of the Society of St. Pius X and the establishment of a seminary at Econe in Switzerland by Archbishop Marcel Lefebvre in 1970. This was done with the full approval of the Vatican, which was fully aware of the fact that priests of the Society would celebrate only the traditional Mass. The progress of the Society can only be described as spectacularly successful, which infuriated those who had insisted that the cause of the Traditional Mass was lost. In 1975, after a process which I think was a travesty of justice, the Archbishop was ordered to dose his seminary and disband his Society; but he refused, continued to ordain and was suspended. Young men still flocked to him and were soon offering the traditional Mass without permission in several European countries and the U.S.A. The Society has now spread throughout the world and has at least six seminaries. The faithful were assisting at these Masses in such large numbers that in October 1984, permission was given to every bishop of the Roman Rite to allow the traditional Roman Rite. This was a very important development, as the Traditional Missal was now recognized as an authorized liturgical book throughout the entire world, and not simply England and Wales.

It certainly was, but there is more significance in the fact that it was implemented by a small number in several countries. Each new celebration helped to dispel the widespread perception that the traditional Mass was forbidden.

It would be impossible to exaggerate the impact. The Apostolic Letter Ecclesia Dei of July 2, 1988 contained provisions clearly entitled to win support away from the Society. Pope John Paul II stated: "To all those Catholic faithful who feel attached to some previous liturgical and disciplinary forms of the Latin tradition I wish to manifest my will to facilitate their ecclesial communion by means of the necessary measures to guarantee respect for their rightful aspirations. In this matter I ask for the support of the bishops and of all those engaged in the pastoral ministry in the Church." In order to provide for these legitimate desires of the faithful he established the Pontifical Commission Ecclesia Dei and indicated his mind with regard to its primary task when he decreed that "Respect must everywhere be shown for the feelings of all those who are attached to the Latin liturgical tradition, by a wide and generous application of the directives already issued some time ago by the Apostolic See for the use of the Roman Missal according to the typical edition of 1962."

Does this mean that Rome conceded that the faithful have a right to the traditional Mass?

It certainly does according to the official interpretation of the Apostolic Letter by Cardinal Augustin Mayer, during his term of office as President of the Ecclesia Dei Commission. The cardinal explained that the 1984 indult was presented as a privilege which might be requested from the bishops, but that in Ecclesia Dei a "privilege" in the canonical sense was granted to the faithful by the supreme legislator of the Church.

You seem to be saying that the faithful who now attend what are known as "indult Masses" really have to thank Archbishop Lefebvre for the privilege that you have just mentioned? Even if they disagree with his disobedience of the Pope in 1988?

Had the 1988 consecrations not taken place the privilege referred to by Cardinal Mayer would not have been granted. Furthermore, as a result of the consecrations, a number of Archbishop Lefebvre's priests felt that they could no longer in good conscience remain in the Society of St. Pius X, and the Priestly Fraternity of St. Peter came into being. The Holy Father granted them the privilege of using all the liturgical books in use in 1962, and the Fraternity is operating with great success in 15 or 16 American dioceses, and has seminaries in Germany and Elmhurst, Pa. Unlike most American seminaries, the Fraternity's only vocations problem is to accommodate all the young men who apply.

The Fraternity of St. Peter is not the only priestly community recognized by Rome with the right to the 1962 liturgical books.

Precisely, and this is the principal reason that I can say that the battle for the traditional Mass has been won. The most exciting aspect of the General Assembly of our Federation in Rome last year was the presence of many priests and seminarians from these communities, not to mention others from national seminaries or those of established religious orders.

They certainly do and they certainly will. The liturgical establishment would have nightmares if it knew the number of seminarians using Fortescue's Ceremonies of the Roman Rite Explained to teach themselves to celebrate the traditional Mass. Just before Christmas I had dinner with several dozen young priests who say the traditional Mass at every opportunity.

If they do not ask they do not have a problem. There is a growing acceptance among traditionally minded diocesan clergy that they have a right to celebrate the traditional Mass. Cardinal Stickler stated at our General Assembly that it is definitely the will of the Holy Father the Tridentine Mass should be accorded to those who request it, and that bishops who refuse to permit this Mass are disobedient. I find it hard to understand how a disobedient bishop, defying the pope on the question of the Latin Mass, can expect obedience from his clergy.

Could you mention some of the priestly communities approved by the Vatican apart from the Fraternity of St. Peter?

There is the Institute of Christ the King, which has a seminary near Florence in Italy which I visited last year. I was impressed and heartened by everything I saw. Like the Fraternity of St. Peter the Institute is overwhelmed by the number of applicants. Thirty new rooms for seminarians are under construction, and as soon as sufficient donations have been received to complete them, new seminarians will be accepted. The Institute also has a thriving mission in Gabon where it has been invited to open as many traditional parishes as it can provide priests for. The young President of the Episcopal Conference is so impressed by the Institute that he came to stay at their seminary in Italy to learn to say the traditional Mass.

By the end of this year our American affiliate will be among the most thriving in the world. Until this year organizations sympathetic to our aims have been operating independently throughout the country. But an American federation has been founded, Una Voce America, to which existing organizations can affiliate and which will inspire the foundation of new affiliates. Una Voce America is already on the Internet and will publish its first bulletin within a few months. The youth and dynamism of those establishing the American Federation leave me in no doubt that it will be a resounding success. Una Voce America will be campaigning not simply for more Sunday Masses but for the establishment of traditionalist parishes such as St. Joseph's in Richmond, or those administered by the Fraternity of St. Peter, and for the administration of all the sacraments according to the 1962 liturgical books. Any bishop with sufficient good will can now permit this.

Yes, this has been made possible for those living in an area where no affiliated organization exists. Any organizations or individuals interested should write to Una Voce America, P.O. Box 1159, St. Charles, Missouri 63302-1159.

Is the positive situation that you hare described in the U.S.A. paralleled in most countries where you have affiliates?

By no means. In such countries as Holland, Belgium and Scotland the hierarchies are very antagonistic towards the traditionalist movement, and Masses are accorded infrequently and grudgingly. In Germany priests of the Fraternity of St. Peter are forbidden to offer the traditional Mass because they will not offer the new one. One German bishop has even said that he would rather the people had no Mass at all than be allowed the old one. I must also point out that in the U.S.A. the bishop of Charleston, for example, seems to believe that the Mass he once celebrated is the only practice that cannot be tolerated in the contemporary Church.

Could you enumerate briefly any further positive signs of the resurgence of the traditional Mass?

I could mention what can be described accurately as the escalation of traditional "resources." Several editions of the Daily Missal are now available, as is the traditional ordo, professionally produced videocassettes of the traditional Mass of the very highest quality, a guild that saves and restores Mass vestments, and perhaps most important of all, the republication of the 1962 Breviary with the Vulgate psalms. The need for this Breviary is a very dramatic illustration of the enthusiasm for tradition particularly among young priests and seminarians. To put the icing on the cake, the 1962 Altar Missal will be published this year. With the permission of Cardinal O'Connor of New York, no less. It is to be a truly sumptuous edition and I am certain that the publisher would not have undertaken such a costly venture without being sure that the demand for it existed. I must also make special mention of Sursum Corda's "stable companion"-The Latin Mass. The impact this high-quality journal has made not just in the U.S.A. but throughout the world cannot be exaggerated. It is being praised and quoted in many countries and is circulating widely in seminaries. The Vatican has referred to it, obliquely, in one of its publications.

As a final example of the resurgence of tradition, perhaps the most heartening example of all, I must mention the annual Pentecost Pilgrimage to Chartres when about 15,000 pilgrims with an average age of twenty march from Notre Dame Cathedral in Paris to Notre Dame Cathedral in Chartres accompanied by about 150 mostly young priests. The Pilgrimage concludes with a truly heavenly sung Tridentine Mass in which all those present participate-including the thousands who are unable to enter the cathedral. No one who takes part in that pilgrimage could doubt that traditional Catholicism is the wave of the future.

I can do no better than quote Msgr. Klaus Gamber: "In the final analysis, this means that in the future the traditional rite of Mass must be retained in the Roman Catholic Church... as the primary liturgical form for the celebration of Mass. It must become once more the norm of our faith and the symbol of Catholic unity throughout the world, a rock of stability in a period of upheaval and never-ending change."

Readers wishing further information should write not to Sursum Corda but to the following addresses:

The Charitable Anathema, a collection of essays by Dietrich von Hildebrand including "The Case for the Latin Mass," The Devastated Vineyard by Dietrich von Hildebrand and The Reform of the Roman Liturgy by Msgr. Klaus Gamber are all available from Roman Catholic Books, Box 2286, Ft. Collins, CO 80522. This article was taken from the Summer 1996 issue of "Sursum Corda!" Published quarterly and mailed in December, March, June and September by the Foundation for Catholic Reform. Send all subscription requests to "Sursum Corda!", Subscription Dept., 1331 Red Cedar Circle, Ft. Collins, CO 80524. RATES: $26.95 per year.

As president of Una Voce International-he has met recently with Archbishop Justin Rigali (Cardinal-elect) of St. Louis, and Cardinals Joseph Ratzinger, Alfons Stickler and Angelo Felici, all Vatican officials. He reports they are uniformly encouraging about Una Voce's goal to establish the traditional Latin Mass everywhere as an option for Catholics.


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Michael Davies is an awesome man. "Apologia pro Marcel Lefebvre" was a good book that makes one cringe at the cowardice and lack of scruples of the N.O. establishment in the bad old days. Those bishops and vatican officials were clearly the role models for our present wasteproducts,

6 posted on 10/04/2003 7:16:01 AM PDT by TradicalRC (While the wicked stand confounded, Call me, with thy saints surrounded. -The Boondock Saints)

The innovators would replace holy intimacy with Christ by an unbecoming familiarity.

Replacing intimacy with familiarity seems to broad cultural trend...

. To put the icing on the cake, the 1962 Altar Missal will be published this year. With the permission of Cardinal O'Connor of New York, no less.

How old is this article?

... he has met recently with Archbishop Justin Rigali ... He reports they are uniformly encouraging about Una Voce's goal to establish the traditional Latin Mass everywhere as an option for Catholics.

Good. All the more reason I am going to attend our local Mass at St. Martin of Tours where the Cardinal-elect will be presented to us - hopefully I will get to speak to him.

He reports they are uniformly encouraging about Una Voce's goal to establish the traditional Latin Mass everywhere as an option for Catholics.

Happy! Happy! Joy! Joy!

I longed for a local Tridentine after the last two weeks of Masses we have attended. Last week we had the "emcee" priest... commented all through the Mass and this week (went tonight at 5 PM) we had the "my own personal stories" priest who happened to not mention the gospel reading on Jesus forbidding divorce... but we did have Peter, Paul & Mary's "There is love" for the Communion song. Accompanied by guitar, of course.

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