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7 Step Reason to be Catholic II; Revitalizing Faith in the Wake of Scandal and Dissent
Coming Home Network ^ | Jerome D. Gilmartin

Posted on 06/22/2003 3:13:08 PM PDT by NYer

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To: Salvation
***Very important statement here. Jesus said, "I am the Way." What He founded was the Catholic Church.***

Better remind John Paul II !

21 posted on 06/23/2003 4:33:01 AM PDT by drstevej
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To: drstevej; Aquinasfan; Salvation
When the Pope Kissed the Koran

By Stephen Hand

Back in 1999, on the 14th of May, according to the Patriarch of the Chaldeans, at the end of an audience between the Pope and some delegates of the Islamic Shiite and Sunni factions, the Pope bowed as “a sign of respect” toward a copy of the Koran which was presented to him as a gift. When the book was officially “presented to him,” the Pope, perhaps a bit perplexed concerning the appropriate protocol for such an official gesture, kissed it; again, as a “sign of respect toward the 34 million followers of Islam”. The event was reported by the Fides news service. It turned out to be more controversial a sign than the Pope and Vatican ever expected, since both Neomodernist and Integrist reactionaries pounced on it. The former to suggest that all religions were essentially one, and the latter to suggest that the Pope had, well, er, left the Faith.

Both, of course, were utterly wrong, and both---who are temperamentally and psychologically joined at the hip in not a few ways---refused to look long at the Church’s actual teachings, the texts which clearly explain what the Church’s attitude toward other religions is-----and is not.

It is the reaction of the latter which concerns us here.

Every religion, sadly, has its Pharisees, the ones who are more royal than the king, the (only) “true” believers. It is an attitude, a psychological type, which comes in degrees of severity and is tied up with legalism, a preference for the letter as opposed to the spirit of the law. What the Taliban is to Islam, Integrism approximately is to Catholicism.

Pharisees, thinking themselves the only true observers of the law, love to debate, to bait and trap the unwary victim, as they tried to do with our Lord on many an occasion. This attitude finds its logical completion in the Essenes who broke off entirely from the Temple (unlike Jesus, His Mother and St. Joseph) and fled to the desert proclaiming themselves the true temple, the remnant of Israel. They are, it is obvious, seldom aware of the pride which feeds such behavior or the logs in their own eyes.

In Catholicism, if the Neo-modernists are the Saducees, i.e., the rationalists who tend to doubt articles of Faith, then the Integrists are very clearly our modern Pharisees, the ones who fancy themselves the true interpreters of the “fathers” and of the letter of the law.

The Pharisee wants an easy, hyper-logical world, a world of airtight Yes-No compartments, where people are either “in” or “out”. In Our Lord’s day they considered Jesus lax with sinners and heathen, dubious in doctrine, fickle regarding the inviolable law. They viewed him with suspicion and ultimately felt he had to be removed altogether. They preferred a religion where the question of the "spirit," or the heart of the law----the ultimate telos / goal to which the law tends----was not welcome, despite the warnings of the major and minor prophets. For the Pharisee it is easy: The woman sinned against her husband? Stone her. The Pope kissed the Koran? Throw him out, follow the law. Such is the spirit of the Pharisee, then and now.

The Pharisee is more comfortable with executing judgment than mercy which is considered a complicating factor. He prefers a simple world where one always knows what to do. That makes debating easier; and our modern Pharisee loves to debate. He wakes up in the morning and aims straightway for the computer to either engage the debate or aid his fellows in it. His religion often exists in chat rooms or on email lists where he seeks to draw the first blood. Mercy is like an ‘X’ in the equation of justice and makes the Pharisee uncomfortable. Just the same with love and the kind of religion as described in Isaiah 58 or Matt 5-7. Such concepts complicate their neat rule book (though most of these guys have never been trained in Catholic theology and hermeneutics).

The Pope Kissed the Koran

The Pope kissed the Koran. Our new version Pharisee immediately salivates. He is ready to pounce and add such an indictable emblem to his files. And what does it prove? That the Pope is a secret Muslim maybe? That the Pope doesn’t believe in Jesus Christ maybe? That the Pope is a relativist, perhaps? A syncretist for sure? That all religions are one in the Pope’s mind? The Pope also kisses the ground upon landing in various countries on pastoral visits. A secret pantheist?

The Pope, of course, teaches the very opposite everywhere. The facts are well known, if one would take the time to learn. Yet the Pharisee has a penchant for turning ones eyes from anything that will reveal his opinion to be an absurdity. Even authoritative texts matter little if they can be simply brushed under the rug of bigotry.

Yet facts are stubborn. The gesture of the Pope by no means indicates syncretism, relativism, or anything of the sort. Cynical Integrists simply seek to make hay of it, as they do of everything else. It is the way of the Pharisee. That way they sell their papers to the gullible. They would rather not believe that the kiss was merely a gesture, as one would bow before a king, or a President, or even kiss the Pope’s ring. They would rather put the worst and most absurd construction on it, like with everything else. Had they been there they would have sent the Three Wise Men---heathens---packing; the Roman Centurion whom our Lord helped too (pagan). And the good Samaritan would have been viewed very simply as a dismal heretic. I know rigroist Feeneyites who must first baptise (in their minds) the good thief on the Cross before they will concur with our Lord's pronouncement concerning him. Legalism...

I adduce the following texts, from innumerable others, not for debate, but to show those confused by them that the Pope’s teaching is nothing like the accusations and framing of the Integrists.

For the Holy Father, dialogue does not substitute for evangelism/mission, but is a part of that mission of evangelism, divorced from neither love nor truth.

The emphasis is mine throughout below.

NOSTRA AETATE

2. From ancient times down to the present, there is found among various peoples a certain perception of that hidden power which hovers over the course of things and over the events of human history; at times some indeed have come to the recognition of a Supreme Being, or even of a Father. This perception and recognition penetrates their lives with a profound religious sense. Religions, however, that are bound up with an advanced culture have struggled to answer the same questions by means of more refined concepts and a more developed language. Thus in Hinduism, men contemplate the divine mystery and express it through an inexhaustible abundance of myths and through searching philosophical inquiry. They seek freedom from the anguish of our human condition either through ascetical practices or profound meditation or a flight to God with love and trust. Again, Buddhism, in its various forms, realizes the radical insufficiency of this changeable world; it teaches a way by which men, in a devout and confident spirit, may be able either to acquire the state of perfect liberation, or attain, by their own efforts or through higher help, supreme illumination. Likewise, other religions found everywhere try to counter the restlessness of the human heart, each in its own manner, by proposing "ways," comprising teachings, rules of life, and sacred rites. The Catholic Church rejects nothing that is true and holy in these religions. She regards with sincere reverence those ways of conduct and of life, those precepts and teachings which, though differing in many aspects from the ones she holds and sets forth, nonetheless often reflect a ray of that Truth which enlightens all men. Indeed, she proclaims, and ever must proclaim Christ "the way, the truth, and the life" (John 14:6), in whom men may find the fullness of religious life, in whom God has reconciled all things to Himself.(4)

From Redmptoris Missio:

55. Inter-religious dialogue is a part of the Church's evangelizing mission. Understood as a method and means of mutual knowledge and enrichment, dialogue is not in opposition to the mission ad gentes; indeed, it has special links with that mission and is one of its expressions . This mission, in fact, is addressed to those who do not know Christ and his Gospel, and who belong for the most part to other religions. In Christ, God calls all peoples to himself and he wishes to share with them the fullness of his revelation and love. He does not fail to make himself present in many ways, not only to individuals but also to entire peoples through their spiritual riches, of which their religions are the main and essential expression, even when they contain "gaps, insufficiencies and errors."(98) All of this has been given ample emphasis by the Council and the subsequent Magisterium, without detracting in any way from the fact that salvation comes from Christ and that dialogue does not dispense from evangelization.(99)

In the light of the economy of salvation, the Church sees no conflict between proclaiming Christ and engaging in interreligious dialogue. Instead, she feels the need to link the two in the context of her mission ad gentes . These two elements must maintain both their intimate connection and their distinctiveness ; therefore they should not be confused, manipulated or regarded as identical, as though they were interchangeable

CDF’s Dominus Iesus: See CDF document here

4. The Church's constant missionary proclamation is endangered today by relativistic theories which seek to justify religious pluralism, not only de facto but also de iure (or in principle). As a consequence, it is held that certain truths have been superseded; for example, the definitive and complete character of the revelation of Jesus Christ, the nature of Christian faith as compared with that of belief in other religions, the inspired nature of the books of Sacred Scripture, the personal unity between the Eternal Word and Jesus of Nazareth, the unity of the economy of the Incarnate Word and the Holy Spirit, the unicity and salvific universality of the mystery of Jesus Christ, the universal salvific mediation of the Church, the inseparability — while recognizing the distinction — of the kingdom of God, the kingdom of Christ, and the Church, and the subsistence of the one Church of Christ in the Catholic Church.

6. Therefore, the theory of the limited, incomplete, or imperfect character of the revelation of Jesus Christ, which would be complementary to that found in other religions, is contrary to the Church's faith. Such a position would claim to be based on the notion that the truth about God cannot be grasped and manifested in its globality and completeness by any historical religion, neither by Christianity nor by Jesus Christ.

7. ...Thus, theological faith (the acceptance of the truth revealed by the One and Triune God) is often identified with belief in other religions, which is religious experience still in search of the absolute truth and still lacking assent to God who reveals himself. This is one of the reasons why the differences between Christianity and the other religions tend to be reduced at times to the point of disappearance.

Most critical to our concern:

8. The hypothesis of the inspired value of the sacred writings of other religions is also put forward. Certainly, it must be recognized that there are some elements in these texts which may be de facto instruments by which countless people throughout the centuries have been and still are able today to nourish and maintain their life-relationship with God. Thus, as noted above, the Second Vatican Council, in considering the customs, precepts, and teachings of the other religions, teaches that “although differing in many ways from her own teaching, these nevertheless often reflect a ray of that truth which enlightens all men”.23

The Church's tradition, however, reserves the designation of inspired texts to the canonical books of the Old and New Testaments, since these are inspired by the Holy Spirit.24 Taking up this tradition, the Dogmatic Constitution on Divine Revelation of the Second Vatican Council states: “For Holy Mother Church, relying on the faith of the apostolic age, accepts as sacred and canonical the books of the Old and New Testaments, whole and entire, with all their parts, on the grounds that, written under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit (cf. Jn 20:31; 2 Tim 3:16; 2 Pet 1:19-21; 3:15-16), they have God as their author, and have been handed on as such to the Church herself”.25 These books “firmly, faithfully, and without error, teach that truth which God, for the sake of our salvation, wished to see confided to the Sacred Scriptures”.26

Nevertheless, God, who desires to call all peoples to himself in Christ and to communicate to them the fullness of his revelation and love, “does not fail to make himself present in many ways, not only to individuals, but also to entire peoples through their spiritual riches, of which their religions are the main and essential expression even when they contain ‘gaps, insufficiencies and errors'”.27 Therefore, the sacred books of other religions, which in actual fact direct and nourish the existence of their followers, receive from the mystery of Christ the elements of goodness and grace which they contain.

It is very clear, then, that neither the Pope nor Vatican II promotes doctrinal relativism, much less syncretism. This is why the neo-modernists consider the Pope a veritable inquisition. They can read. Yet the joyless Integrist can be counted on to always put the worst possible construction on any event or text (even if they usually prefer to simply ignore than compare texts). Thus they alleviate some of their anxiety for airtight security, even if it means fleeing from the vulnerability and suffering of the cross in our time. The Integrist is never so gleeful as when in [the diversion of] debate. Those of us who have known them intimately consider this one of their most striking and constant characteristics. To debate them is to feed their pride. Better to sincerely pray for them often. It is tragic beyond words when truth itself is inconsequential to the act of debating.

The Church, then, rejects nothing which is good, true or holy in other religions, but condemns all syncretistic theology as it did with Frs. Anthony de Mello's and Tissa Balasuriya's writings; see also the CDF's warnings to the bishops of India regarding syncretism and erroneous christologies; also its warnings about eastern meditation, etc.



22 posted on 06/23/2003 6:45:19 AM PDT by NYer (Laudate Dominum)
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To: NYer
***The Church, then, rejects nothing which is good, true or holy in other religions***

What is holy, good and true in the Koran? Islam is a road to Hell.

Do you applaud JPII for this action? Or would you prefer he had simply thanked them for the gift without the bow and the kiss?

23 posted on 06/23/2003 6:53:54 AM PDT by drstevej
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To: Salvation
I was trying to explain the problem with citing the CCC to make a point to non-Catholics.
24 posted on 06/23/2003 7:11:26 AM PDT by ACAC
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To: Salvation
I have read the CCC on a few occasions. The woman I married was Catholic, so I read the CC to answer some of my questions. The church we go to is the Lutheran church-Missouri Synod. We do say a profession of faith during every service. I was raised Baptist and we did not do anything like that.
25 posted on 06/23/2003 7:13:39 AM PDT by ACAC
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To: NYer
Thanks for the info regarding the infamous "Koran kiss." My intuition that the Pope kissed the Koran in the same way that he kisses the ground when he visits a country has proven to be pretty much correct. Adding to this explanation the fact that he was confused regarding protocol, the act becomes even easier to understand.
26 posted on 06/23/2003 7:33:04 AM PDT by Aquinasfan
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To: Aquinasfan
Kissing the Koran is like kissing the ground in visiting a country?

Kissing the ground honors a country. The parallel with the Koran is a big stretch. I ask you what I asked NYer...

***What is holy, good and true in the Koran? Islam is a road to Hell.***
27 posted on 06/23/2003 7:38:45 AM PDT by drstevej
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To: drstevej
What is holy, good and true in the Koran? Islam is a road to Hell.

While I do not support radical fundamentalist Muslims, I refuse to judge a race of people who follow their Muslim faith. In all fairness, have you read the Q'uran? Are there NO truths in it whatsoever?

Ecumenism, like politics, begins with acknowledging that which is shared. Vatican Council II, noted this when it wrote ... “although differing in many ways from her own teaching, these nevertheless often reflect a ray of that truth which enlightens all men”.23

28 posted on 06/23/2003 7:51:20 AM PDT by NYer (Laudate Dominum)
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To: NYer
***I refuse to judge a race of people who follow their Muslim faith.***

Is Islam a road to hell or not? Is the gospel contained in the Koran or a false path?

"But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed." -- Galatians 1:8

Accursed not kissed!

***In all fairness, have you read the Q'uran? ***

Yes.
29 posted on 06/23/2003 7:55:33 AM PDT by drstevej
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To: Salvation
**Certainly, through the Bible, Jesus would have let us know if he intended the divided Christianity of today, with its more than 33,000 denominations and its many contradictory teachings on matters on which one's very salvation may well depend.**

Very important statement here. Jesus said, "I am the Way." What He founded was the Catholic Church.

Not 30+ thousand churches!!!!!


Better 30+ thousand churches based on the very words of God, than one united church sinking deeper and deeper into error.

As it is, ... at least one has a choice between truth and error.

30 posted on 06/23/2003 8:18:57 AM PDT by Quester
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To: drstevej
Well, like every country whose ground he kisses, there's probably something good in it. Anyway, like the article says, it was a mistake, a confusion over protocol.

I'm certain that he did not intend to give the impression that he considers the Koran to be on the same level as the Bible.

31 posted on 06/23/2003 8:43:17 AM PDT by Aquinasfan
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To: NYer
I see no particular exclusivity to the claim that any of these reasons would justification for being Catholic. Christian in general, possibly, but Catholic? Why? That said, however....

2. Other than I AM of the Old Testament, no other founder of a religion is comparable to Jesus.

Quite incorrect. Looking aside, for a moment, that it is easily debatable that Jesus founded no religion, the parallels between he and the Buddha are manifold and obvious.

No authoritative spokesperson for any non Christian religion claims that its founder or reformer is comparable to Jesus in the way he manifested the authority of the Creator including his power over death itself.

Claptrap. This is posing the question in a dishonest light from the get-go. No 'authoritative' 'spokesperson'? And what is this based on? How does one know that such a person doesn't make the claim?

3. History affirms the Jesus of the Bible

Surely. But it affirms none of the miracles attributed to him, co-opted from earlier traditions.

32 posted on 06/23/2003 8:45:20 AM PDT by Pahuanui (when A Foolish Man Hears The tao, He Laughs Out Loud.)
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To: NYer
Stephan Hand proves nothing. The Pope indeed says a lot of nice things. He recently issued an encyclical on the Eucharist that once more affirms the dogma of the Church and condemns the liturgical abuses which now abound. The trouble is, the Pontiff doesn't practice what he preaches. It isn't hard to find some of the worst abuses in the Pope's own Masses.

In the same way it isn't hard to see that it's a lyric leap from asserting in his writings that all religions have a kernal of truth, to making a gesture that has shocked the Christian world and been universally interpreted as a sign of affirmation of the Muslim religion. Priests kiss the Bible in the Liturgy because it is the inspired Word of God. How can we not associate the kissing of the Koran with this same theological notion?

Of course a gesture is open to myriad interpretations as Hand says. But the Muslims have surely taken the papal kiss as a further indication of the rightness of their own faith in opposition to our own--and that is offensive to any Christian. It cannot be a pope's intention to confirm others in their own errors--and yet this is exactly what this pope has done.

In any case, what is offensive is the attempt to suggest that criticism of this colossal blunder on the Pope's part is beyond the pale. It is not. The gesture is emblematic of much else--Assisi I and II, the pouring out of libations with animists in the Tojo Sacred Forest, the dancing of Aztecs during a canonization Mass in Mexico, the praying in a synagogue with Jews their prayer for a different messiah. These are some of the disturbing features which characterize this papacy.
33 posted on 06/23/2003 9:06:10 AM PDT by ultima ratio
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To: Pahuanui
Looking aside, for a moment, that it is easily debatable that Jesus founded no religion, the parallels between he and the Buddha are manifold and obvious.

Really? Did the Buddha claim he was God, was the Buddha's life and death prophesied? Was the Buddha born into royalty ( compared to Jesus' meager upbringing)? The dissimilarities are more obvious. What are the parrallels that should be obvious to me?

34 posted on 06/23/2003 9:23:16 AM PDT by St.Chuck
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To: NYer
I'm always impressed by Stephen Hand's comprehensive understanding of matters and his ability to articulate them. Not only does he explain the circumstances around the "kiss", but he delves accurately into the minds of those claim to be so shocked and awed. Good post. Thanks.
35 posted on 06/23/2003 9:30:58 AM PDT by St.Chuck
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To: St.Chuck
Good post. Thanks

Thank you for stopping by and commenting on Hand's article. As is often the case in the forum, the usual dissidents just had to spew their venom. Your comments are appreciated.

36 posted on 06/23/2003 9:57:51 AM PDT by NYer (Laudate Dominum)
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To: Aquinasfan
Is Islam a road to hell or not? Is the gospel contained in the Koran or a false path?

"But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed." -- Galatians 1:8

Accursed not kissed!
37 posted on 06/23/2003 10:19:52 AM PDT by drstevej
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To: St.Chuck
Really? Did the Buddha claim he was God, was the Buddha's life and death prophesied? Was the Buddha born into royalty ( compared to Jesus' meager upbringing)? The dissimilarities are more obvious. What are the parrallels that should be obvious to me?

They are quite striking, actually.

Buddha's birth was prophesied.
He was of royal descent.
He was given gifts at birth.
His birth was signaled by a star.
He was born of a virgin (Maya, considered the 'Queen of Heaven').
Crushed a serpent's head.
Came to fulfill the law.
Performed miracles.
Healed the sick.
Fed a large mass of people from only a small basket of cakes.
Healed the sick.
Was transfigured on a mount (Mindhamma Hill).
Was tempted in isolation by the devil (Mara) and resisted.
Ascended into heaven/nirvana
Many, but certainly not all, traditions have him returning again in the future.

All in all, especially in light of Buddhism predating Christianity by about 500 years and that there were Buddhist missionaries sent by Emporer Asoka in the mediteranean area before the birth of christ, I'd say the similarities are quite interesting.

38 posted on 06/23/2003 10:23:23 AM PDT by Pahuanui (when A Foolish Man Hears The tao, He Laughs Out Loud.)
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To: drstevej
Accursed not kissed!

A good reason to seek out the Church that Christ founded, the "pillar and foundation of truth."

39 posted on 06/23/2003 10:27:15 AM PDT by Aquinasfan
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To: Aquinasfan
Avoidance, grade reduced one letter.

***A good reason to seek out the Church that Christ founded, the "pillar and foundation of truth."***

Maybe if JPII had whipped out a Holy Bible at that ceremopny and planted a wet one on it it might be clearer to a watching world where truth resides.
40 posted on 06/23/2003 10:30:41 AM PDT by drstevej
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