[Loyalist]

This article is noteworthy for the information that's missing, either because it wasn't part of the original study, or it didn't fit the general thrust of the article.

The study disingenuously uses 1978 as its starting point, to suggest that John Paul II's pontificate has been one in which vocations have flourished, and that the Church is coming along just fine.

Starting from the nadir of the post-Vatican II mess is a great way to make a dead-cat bounce look like real growth.

Yet over the course of John Paul II's reign, the total number of priests has fallen about 4%. The more telling figure would be the ratio of priests to laity.

A growth of 75% in the number of seminarians worldwide looks like an impressive figure; but consider what year that growth is being measured from.

Look also at the 9% growth in seminarians in Europe. It looks healthy until you consider that much of that growth probably comes from two sources; the re-opening of seminaries in countries formerly behind the Iron Curtain, and the increasing numbers of Third World seminarians sent to Europe. Factor those out, and the collapse of the Church in Her Western European heartland continues unabated.

Finally, the 20% fall in the number of women religious. No amount of fiddling the figures can hide the collapse of women's religious orders and their novitiates.

The implications for the Church that the extinction of women's religious orders raises are too many to count, but they are horrible.

[TotusTuus]

Christos Voskrese!

Finally, the 20% fall in the number of women religious. No amount of fiddling the figures can hide the collapse of women's religious orders and their novitiates.

Considering how bad many of these Orders have become, not necessarily bad news. Of course there is a collapse. If they are no longer serving God and His Church as His brides, they are no longer needed. But...

The implications for the Church that the extinction of women's religious orders raises are too many to count, but they are horrible.

New Orders of young, zealous, mature, orthodox women (and men) are coming out! They represent the future. That's where a real survey would be helpful in pointing out the growth of the Gospel. Where are the young Religious going? Into new Orders with vibrant Faith! Numbers are small now, but they'll grow because the Truth of our Faith can't be set aside forever - and they offer Truth! God will take care of His Church. He will still call young men and women to serve Him with singular devotion from deep within their hearts. This isn't the first time in the history of the Church that this cycle has happened.

[ninenot]

First, I would guess that they picked JPII's years b/c of his upcoming anniversary.

But having said that, so what? Are you able to demonstrate, using figures from, say, 1969, that the numbers are awful?

How can you insist that a substantial increase in Sem. enrollments outside of the West is either bad or lying with figures?

I suspect your glass is not half-full. It's drained.

[Maximilian]

Starting from the nadir of the post-Vatican II mess is a great way to make a dead-cat bounce look like real growth.

Bingo!

The implications for the Church that the extinction of women's religious orders raises are too many to count, but they are horrible.

"Extinction" is not too strong a word to use.