Posted on 04/19/2003 7:55:27 AM PDT by Between the Lines
One cannot help noticing the interest in Calvinism lately expressed among some Baptists has prompted from others a cry of alarm. One group tends to represent the Baptist heritage as passively shaped by Calvinism, and the other wishes to deny the Calvinist (or Reformed) influence completely. The truth is somewhere in-between.
The concern for eliminating the Calvinist influence among Baptists is misguided.
Every body of believers needs to be in touch with the best of its theological tradition. For Baptists, that tradition is Reformed, or Calvinist, thought. Those who wish to look into this view need only discover for themselves the evident Calvinism of the Particular Baptist London Confession of 1644 and the even more pointedly Calvinist nature of the Second London Confession of 1677. These statements, along with the Savoy Confession and the Westmins ter Confession, evidently came from a co mmon stock of doctrinal expression. The words of the 1644 Confession and its successors are suggestive of Calvin's "Institutes" and not at all of, for instance, the early Anabaptist Schleitheim Confession. This is true not only in the ordinary sense of common vocabulary and system, but also in regard to the tone and the habitual focus. Again, one can point to the undisguised Reformed theology of John Gill, Charles Haddon Spurgeon, Andrew Fuller, Isaac Backus, Richard Furman, Basil Manly Sr., James Petigrew Boyce and quite a number of others who were powerfully instrumental in the doctrinal expression of Baptists through the middle part of the twentieth century.
All this has been vigorously preached by the defenders of Calvinist theology, only they have sometimes taken an additional, and unwarranted, step further. They often assume that this put Baptists (especially Southern Baptists) right in line with the most extreme expressions of Calvinism. They assume that Baptists must be advocates of the Canons of Dort, the famous five-point Calvinism that was formulated some half- century after John Calvin himself was dead. Or they align Baptists with the hard-edged Calvinism of early New England Puritan thought. In fact, the Reformed thought that most influenced Baptists, especially in the South, was one that had been softened and moderated by Scottish Common Sense philosophy and by the Baptists' own insistence upon the competence of believers to respond in faith to the gospel.
Interestingly enough, along with this Calvinism moderated by Scottish Presbyterians and Baptists of the American South came a real openness to the strongest and best of Christian thinkers from other traditions. The great Broadus, who set the standard for intelligent and heart-felt preaching among Baptists, remembered with gratitude that the advanced students of Boyce, the founder of the Southern Baptist Theological Seminary, read from Turrettini (a moderate Reformed thinker) and Thomas Aquinas. E.Y. Mullins, Southern Seminary's president for the first quarter of the 20th century, could adapt Schleiermacher's insights to a basically Reformed worldview.
Some worry about an "aggressive Calvinism" on college campuses. I worry more about a fundamental resistance to any vigorous kind of theological thinking. For the life of me, I cannot see that college campuses are about to be overrun by Calvinists--aggressive or otherwise. If there is genuine theological study going on, which in fact there is, then it is a matter for which we might be grateful. I am concerned about aggressive relativism in ethics and religion; I am concerned about aggressive nihilism in the moral life of college students; I am concerned about aggressive addictions and aggressive sexually transmitted diseases; I am concerned about aggressive indifference in the formation of the intellect among students.
But aggressive Calvinism? I haven't seen that yet. And I do find, however, among our best students an appreciation for the ordered, energetic, biblical teachings of John Calvin and some of his followers. To reject this rich tradition by pretending it has nothing to do with Baptist history would be wasteful and wrongheaded. To confuse the distinctive Baptist form of this tradition with its most radical historical expressions is to miss the Baptist genius that reshaped Calvinism in a way that proved fruitful for the aspiring denomination of Baptist Christians in America.
Laissez faire theology, which forgets its debt to thinkers of the past, may do for a period of time. In fact, that has mostly been the state of things since World War II, after which careful theological teaching was submerged in denominational boosterism and a cult of personality, with results that we have sadly lived with these past two decades. The atheological approach to church life leaves us narrow-minded and unimaginative, merely reciting the prejudices we have gathered like lint over the past 50 years; while a well- wrought theological tradition keeps us alive to conversation partners from every Christian generation, providing a foundation of substance for our mission and our ministry. As P.T. Forsyth once wrote, "The non-theological Christ is popular; he wins votes; but he is not mighty; he does not win souls; he does not break men into small pieces and create them anew."
A.J. Conyers is professor of theology at Baylor University's George W. Truett Theological Seminary in Waco
Don't you mean nothing less? Belief, as used in the Scriptures, is much more than intellectual assent. True believers, as opposed to those who are merely professing, follow through and pattern their whole lives accordingly. To do otherwise (to hold thoughts in the head but not let them affect your daily walk) is inconsistent, even hypocrisy.
Luke 6:46 And why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say?
Some people seem to have to pin down when a person is "saved". This is judging another man's heart. Only God can do that. Plus, it is all out the window if the guy messes up, then you guys say, "He never was saved in the first place." So give it up already. Leave it in the hands of God. The final chapters of our lives have not yet been written. Those chapters will be part of the final judgment on Judgment Day. God foreknows all this, but does not share it with you guys.
It is for us to study the Scriptures and apply them in our lives, living the light we have as best we know how, and God will give us more and more light until the perfect day. Let us focus on learning obedience to God, and leave the judgment of our wise, merciful, just, and all-knowing God in His hands.
It must be rough, going through life never knowing whether you have qualfied for Heaven.........
One might say, "You have to break a few eggs to make an omelet," and that would be true. But aren't there other steps in the omelet recipe? Similarly, we need to take the whole counsel of God regarding the answer to the question "What must I do to be saved." "He who believes and is baptized shall be saved," said Jesus.
Note that there were those who did believe in Jesus, but were unwilling to repent and confess him. Were they saved?
James 2 offers a straw man - belief without obedience - and chews it to pieces. He says it's dead, useless and that even demons have that type of belief. And the only place in scripture where the phrase "faith only" is found is in James 2. What does it say about "faith only" (faith without obedience)?
What makes baptism effectual for salvation is that Jesus said one must be baptized to be saved (Mark 16:16). Peter added that it is the blood of Christ that does the cleansing (1Pet 3:21). Paul said that we are "baptized into Christ" (Gal 3:27) and that the old man dies and the new life in Christ begins at baptism (Rom 6:3-5; Col 2:12).
For those who do not believe, nothing else matters. Repentance, confession, baptism must be done as a result of belief. But for those who already believe and ask, "What must we do," what answer is given? "Repent and be baptized for the remission of sins."
At this point one might ask, "What about Paul's statement, 'For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; not as a result of works, so that no one may boast.' Isn't baptism a work?" Baptism is no more a work than belief, repentance, confession, prayer, etc. It is simple, trusting obedience to the command of God.
One does not earn salvation through baptism (which, by the way, is a passive activity - someone else actually "does" the baptizing - but that's probably too fine a point). Salvation is the free gift of God and God does not nullify the freeness of salvation by putting the condition of baptism, repentence or belief upon it.
Neither is baptism a sacremental ritual which, in and of itself, bestows grace. As Peter said, baptism is the answer of a good conscience toward God and its efficacy is found in the blood of Christ (1Pet 3:21) which is applied to the baptized believer.
I implore you to read again what scripture says about baptism and what it doesn't say.
It doesn't say to be baptized to join a denomination. It says to be baptized for the remission of sins.
It doesn't say that he who believes is saved and then is baptized. It says he who believes and is baptized shall be saved.
It doesn't say that it is just an outward sign that one is already in Christ. It says one is baptized into Christ.
Consider the whole counsel of God.
Jesus said, "He who believes and is baptized shall be saved,"
Paul said, "We are buried with Christ in baptism"
then Cornelius must have been saved at the point of baptism.
Ah, but the Holy Spirit came on them before baptism. Note that while recounting this event to the church, Peter says, "And as I began to speak, the Holy Spirit fell upon them just as He did upon us at the beginning." (Acts 11:15)
What happened to Cornelius was the same thing that happened to the apostles in Acts 2 (the beginning) - the miraculous ability to speak in foreign languages by the power of the Holy Spirit.
The miraculous ability to speak in an unfamiliar language is no more proof of Cornelius' salvation than it is proof of Balaam's donkey's salvation. He did it, too, you know.
This event was a God-given sign that gentiles could enter into the body of Christ. And how does Paul say one enters the body of Christ? "We were all baptized into one body!" (1Cor 12:13)
I agree
Now you are no longer talking about another man's heart, but one's own. Each of us needs to draw near to God and learn, by the witness of the Holy Spirit, where we stand before God, and then continue moving in the right direction, learning to be more like Jesus.
Let no one claim that his Christian career ends as soon as it begins, and that he can now just idle away his time, twiddling his thumbs, waiting for his Lord to return, or dabble in sin, or return to a life of crime, or be unfaithful to his wife, or steal from church funds, or whatever. See Luke 19:20-26.
Book of Mormon, 2 Nephi 31:19-21
19 And now, my beloved brethren, after ye have gotten into this strait and narrow path, I would ask if all is done? Behold, I say unto you, Nay; for ye have not come thus far save it were by the word of Christ with unshaken faith in him, relying wholly upon the merits of him who is mighty to save.
20 Wherefore, ye must press forward with a steadfastness in Christ, having a perfect brightness of hope, and a love of God and of all men. Wherefore, if ye shall press forward, feasting upon the word of Christ, and endure to the end, behold, thus saith the Father: Ye shall have eternal life.
21 And now, behold, my beloved brethren, this is the way; and there is none other way nor name given under heaven whereby man can be saved in the kingdom of God. And now, behold, this is the doctrine of Christ, and the only and true doctrine of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost, which is one God, without end. Amen.
I thought you were trying to say somehow that we did not believe Hebrews 13:2. (You know the false dichotomy game people play: the LDS Church teaches this but the Bible teaches that.)
Now it seems clear that by "these" you meant John the Beloved and the Three Nephites, and that they could not be the angels in Hebrews 13:2 because they are men.
The text you highlighted, besides the fact that it is not a Scripture verse but a chapter heading, does not refer to the Three Nephites after their translation as either men or angels. Neither does this verse:
Hebrews 11:5 By faith Enoch was translated that he should not see death; and was not found, because God had translated him: for before his translation he had this testimony, that he pleased God.
However, that is besides the point. My point was: if some have entertained angels unawares, thinking they were strangers (i.e., men), they could certainly entertain translated beings such as Enoch, John, and the Three Nephites thinking they were strangers, so they are not necessarily invisible (your #127: If this were true, why are they invisible to our eyes?).
Your implication was that angels and men are mutually exclusive, separate creations as you guys like to say. To my understanding, they are the same creation. As I understand the Scriptures, we were the angels of heaven before we were born here. That is what we have fallen from.
There are instances of angelic ministration where we know from the Scriptures that the angel used to be a man living on the earth. Moroni is one example. John the Baptist returned as an angel to restore the Aaronic Priesthood, as did Peter, James, and John to restore the Melchizedek Priesthood, the Holy Apostleship, and the Keys of the Kingdom.
We also have this from the Book of Revelation:
Revelation 22:8-9
8 And I John saw these things, and heard them. And when I had heard and seen, I fell down to worship before the feet of the angel which shewed me these things.
9 Then saith he unto me, See thou do it not: for I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren the prophets, and of them which keep the sayings of this book: worship God.
Who says I am not on the same page with God the Father and God the Son?
My #139: I have said that the problem with these uninspired creeds is that people lift them up above Scripture and say, "Accept these creeds or be cut off."
In my opinion, that is exactly what makes the uninspired creeds an abomination in the sight of God, because they are used by those who blasphemously exalt themselves to sit in the judgment seat of God, and then pass judgment on other men's hearts, attempting to cut faithful Christians and Bible believers off from Christianity and salvation because they won't subscribe to uninspired creeds.
They may only succeed in excluding themselves.
Now tell me why that is so hard to understand, because I am continually having to repeat it. (It does no good to reply to you guys.)
Your #148: [1 John 5:]21. Dear children, keep yourselves from idols.
Yes, absolutely, be sure to stay away from idols. You don't want to throw eternal life away to believe in a wooden statue that can neither see, nor hear, nor save.
Earlier in the same chapter:
1 John 5:1-5Here again we see that faith and belief are principles of life, of love, and of power (see Hebrews 11), much more than intellectual assent or thoughts in the mind. There is more to it than that. There is love of God and neighbor, commandment-keeping, spiritual rebirth, victory, overcoming the world, enduring to the end in faith, and so forth.
1 Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him.
2 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments.
3 For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.
4 For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith.
5 Who is he that overcometh the world, but he that believeth that Jesus is the Son of God?
Here is more from the chapter I quoted from in my #154:
Book of Mormon, 2 Nephi 31:4-16
4 Wherefore, I would that ye should remember that I have spoken unto you concerning that prophet which the Lord showed unto me, that should baptize the Lamb of God, which should take away the sins of the world.
5 And now, if the Lamb of God, he being holy, should have need to be baptized by water, to fulfil all righteousness, O then, how much more need have we, being unholy, to be baptized, yea, even by water!
6 And now, I would ask of you, my beloved brethren, wherein the Lamb of God did fulfil all righteousness in being baptized by water?
7 Know ye not that he was holy? But notwithstanding he being holy, he showeth unto the children of men that, according to the flesh he humbleth himself before the Father, and witnesseth unto the Father that he would be obedient unto him in keeping his commandments.
8 Wherefore, after he was baptized with water the Holy Ghost descended upon him in the form of a dove.
9 And again, it showeth unto the children of men the straitness of the path, and the narrowness of the gate, by which they should enter, he having set the example before them.
10 And he said unto the children of men: Follow thou me. Wherefore, my beloved brethren, can we follow Jesus save we shall be willing to keep the commandments of the Father?
11 And the Father said: Repent ye, repent ye, and be baptized in the name of my Beloved Son.
12 And also, the voice of the Son came unto me, saying: He that is baptized in my name, to him will the Father give the Holy Ghost, like unto me; wherefore, follow me, and do the things which ye have seen me do.
13 Wherefore, my beloved brethren, I know that if ye shall follow the Son, with full purpose of heart, acting no hypocrisy and no deception before God, but with real intent, repenting of your sins, witnessing unto the Father that ye are willing to take upon you the name of Christ, by baptism—yea, by following your Lord and your Savior down into the water, according to his word, behold, then shall ye receive the Holy Ghost; yea, then cometh the baptism of fire and of the Holy Ghost; and then can ye speak with the tongue of angels, and shout praises unto the Holy One of Israel.
14 But, behold, my beloved brethren, thus came the voice of the Son unto me, saying: After ye have repented of your sins, and witnessed unto the Father that ye are willing to keep my commandments, by the baptism of water, and have received the baptism of fire and of the Holy Ghost, and can speak with a new tongue, yea, even with the tongue of angels, and after this should deny me, it would have been better for you that ye had not known me.
15 And I heard a voice from the Father, saying: Yea, the words of my Beloved are true and faithful. He that endureth to the end, the same shall be saved.
16 And now, my beloved brethren, I know by this that unless a man shall endure to the end, in following the example of the Son of the living God, he cannot be saved.
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