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The two verses preceding Romans 8:30 have lead me to believe Paul was referring to those who had been called for the special purpose of teaching others about the Father, just as the Son did while on Earth. (As I said before, I believe God keeps His promises and forordaining teachers may be a tool toward that goal.)

Romans 8:28-29 "And we know that in all things God works for the good of those who love him, who have been called according to his purpose. For those God foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the likeness of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brothers."

I can re-read these verses through your eyes (I think) and see an equally valid interpretation that would provide justification for the salvation only of an elect group. But then I would have to ignore the other verses we've quoted that indicate everyone has an equal opportunity to salvation, a very real choice has been given and must be made, and that some will choose poorly and consequently be removed from the Book. I'm not ready to ignore all that, but you have peaked my curiousity in Romans. Perhaps my understanding there is *not* complete. I will honor your point and dig further into that chapter. Thank you! My curiousity is insatiable and you have fed it!

You're the most polite poster to these threads. We can all learn from you. 8~)

everyone has an equal opportunity to salvation.

But of course, they don't. Reality shows us that that poor old Bushman we keep trotting out will live and die without hearing the name of "Jesus."

JOHN 6:44 - No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Life isn't fair, from our perspective.

From God's perspective, it is all as He wishes it to be.

There was a great old MGM movie called "My Brother Talks to Horses." In it, Spring Byington, the grandmother, consoles Butch Jenkins, the young boy, by assurring him, "Everything is happening just the way it's supposed to happen."

I love that line. All glory to God.