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To: TradicalRC; ninenot; Canticle_of_Deborah; Cap'n Crunch; St.Chuck; saradippity; american colleen; ...
"Why does the Church... give these guys the shaft?"

It might be their attitude or their inability to keep a civil tongue in their heads or their incessant carping and complaining against the pope or their invention of non-existent "crises" to justify their defiance or disobedience or impudence. Maybe it's the willingness to put words in the pope's mouth as to foreign policy matters or to accept the AP's alleged paraphrase whose accuracy the Vatican denies. Maybe, just maybe, they are not getting the shaft or even one tenth of the punishment they deserve. Protestants, Jews, Muslims and Buddhists make no claim to be Catholic. The pope has no obligation to accommodate the enemy within.

Here is how to distinguish your ancestors from SSPX. Your ancestors were probably not in the habit of vilifying (not just disagreeing with/not just criticizing) the pope. Your ancestors probably did not take pride in disobeying the pope. In the event that they did any of these things, the fact that they were your ancestors does not insulate them from the consequences and they knew that.

Finally, God is love. Therefore, God is charity (another word for love). Yet God is just and he sends some whom He loves to hell because they have insisted on such justice by their behavior. It is not uncharitable to refuse to indulge the fiction that SSPXers claim when they claim to be Catholics while rejecting the authority of the Church itself. It is charitable to insist that they accept the unvarnished truth or the truth with the bark on.

35 posted on 04/13/2003 10:28:15 AM PDT by BlackElk (Viva Cristo Rey! The concept of a schismatic Catholic is a contradiction in terms.)
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To: BlackElk
Let's see if I understand this: we are not to judge the Church based on a few individuals that reject the Real Presence or engage in pederasty or practice birth control or ignore the Magisterium, but we can do it in redards to the SSPX. You have failed to distinguish the SSPX from the Roman Catholic Church in your criticism. I specifically asked how the SSPX differed LITURGICALLY from my ancestors as that appears to be the essential beef that they have with the Church (that THEIR ancestors came from). So if you could refrain from an ad hominem approach, I would appreciate if you could tell me how the Mass that my forbears considered the holiest thing this side of Heaven becomes forbidden in some diocese within a few decades. Surely, one can concede that it is reasonable to be looking askance at the heirarchy and reasonable as well to be entertaining serious doubts.
38 posted on 04/13/2003 11:23:17 AM PDT by TradicalRC (Fides quaerens intellectum.)
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To: BlackElk; ninenot
"Obedience is the sacrifice of one's own will, and it is a great sacrifice for man, when what is commanded is contrary to his inclination and to his advantage."-St. Bonaventure

St. Augustine calls obedience the greatest of virtues.

St. Teresa declares that no path leads so quickly to the summit of perfection as the path of obedience.

"Learn to comply willingly with the wishes of thy equals, and thus thou wilt learn to fulfil cheerfully the commands of thy superiors."-St. Francis de Sales.

"The greater thou art, the more humble thyself in all things, and thou shalt find grace before God: for great is the power of God alone, and He is honored by the humble."-Ecclesiaticus

"Take away self-will, and there will no longer be any hell."-St. Bernard

55 posted on 04/14/2003 6:41:10 AM PDT by Cap'n Crunch
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