Posted on 03/27/2003 12:23:05 PM PST by NYer
TROY - A priest took preaching too far for some parishioners at Sacred Heart Church over the weekend when he used his homily to voice displeasure over the war in Iraq.
Rev. Gary Mercure told the congregation at four Masses Saturday and Sunday that the war in Iraq was evil, immoral and contradictory to Christian doctrine. According to those who attended any of the services, Mercure called for parishioners to not support President Bush, and said the U.S. should work closer with the rest of the world. As many as 60 congregants responded by leaving the church at one of the masses, several yelling comments in the priest's direction and heckling him on the way out. Clem LaPietra, a Troy resident attending a mass for his father, was stunned when Mercure began the homily. "Father Gary, I think he went a little bit over the edge," LaPietra said. "He said how morally wrong the U.S. was. He told us to remember the Germans, and the English, and the Roman Empire. A lot of the older gentlemen got up and left. Someone stood up and told him he was out of line. There was some heckling." Rose Romano, a Wynantskill resident, attended the 8 a.m. mass on Sunday, the third time the homily was given. She claimed that Mercure called Americans bullies, and said the people shouldn't support the president. "I was stunned. After a few minutes I was numb," she said. "I'm going to church for my own welfare and a place to pray. That's no place for a political platform." Mercure said about three people walked out of that service, and said between 50 and 60 walked out of the following mass at 11 a.m. on Sunday. Mercure said he was talking about the Ten Commandments, particularly, "Thou shalt not kill," and knew that some of his parishioners might not be of the same opinion. At that point, Mercure said, he offered everyone a chance to leave. He said he also prefaced the homily by saying that, "we love those serving and want them out of harm's way." While the war is a political matter, Mercure said it is a moral issue as well. He insists he was not using the pulpit as a platform for his own views, but as a servant of God. He said it was also his privilege as a patriot to speak out against the war, and his duty as a priest to do so. Mercure said he received many calls Monday, most of them positive, thanking him for the sermon. Troy resident John Browne was one of those who thanked him. "I'm a veteran of the Philippines and was a prisoner of war for three-and-a-half years in Japan," Browne said. "The reason we fought over there is so people could do what they did in church yesterday. Albany Roman Catholic Diocese spokesman Rev. Kenneth Doyle said he had heard of Mercure's homily, but did not want to address it specifically. He did repeat the church's stance on the war. "Now that the war has begun," Doyle added, "I believe the important thing is to pray that it ends quickly, and with as few causalities as possible and that innocent lives be spared." |
You completely ignore the rest of the verse:
"and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness, that the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works."
This states quite clearly that by scripture, man is thoroughly and completely equipped for all good works.
The Bible denies that it is sufficient as the complete rule of faith.
Amazing - if you think the inspired word of God is not sufficient for your faith and salvation and you feel that you need to add to it, then I am sorry and afraid for you.
Paul says that much Christian teaching is to be found in the tradition which is handed down by word of mouth (2 Tim. 2:2). He instructs us to "stand firm and hold to the traditions which you were taught by us, either by word of mouth or by letter" (2 Thess. 2:15).
Where do you think Paul got those "traditions"? Do you think he just made them up and that they are extra-biblical? The Bereans are commended in Acts for checking everything that Paul said to verify that it conformed to scripture:
Acts 17:10-11
And the brethren immediately sent away Paul and Silas by night unto Berea: who coming [thither] went into the synagogue of the Jews. These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.
If Paul had told the Bereans that they could pay or pray their relatives out of some place called purgatory they would have searched the scriptures and told him he was wrong - first that there's no purgatory and secondly that the only payment for sin is the blood of the perfect sacrifice Jesus Christ.
This oral teaching was accepted by Christians, just as they accepted the written teaching that came to them later. Jesus told his disciples: "He who hears you hears me, and he who rejects you rejects me" (Luke 10:16). The Church, in the persons of the apostles, was given the authority to teach by Christ; the Church would be his representative. He commissioned them, saying, "Go therefore and make disciples of all nations" (Matt. 28:19).
As pointed out above, this oral teaching must always be in accordance with scripture.
And how was this to be done? By preaching, by oral instruction: "So faith comes from what is heard, and what is heard comes by the preaching of Christ" (Rom. 10:17). The Church would always be the living teacher. It is a mistake to limit "Christ’s word" to the written word only or to suggest that all his teachings were reduced to writing. The Bible nowhere supports either notion.
As stated above, this oral teaching must always be in accordance with scripture. Also, you have misquoted Romans 10:17. The correct translation is: So then faith [cometh] by hearing, and hearing by the word of God. The "word of God" is plainly a reference to scripture. What translation are you using? Also, if you believe that the church is a "living teacher" in the sense that liberals believe the Constitution is a "living, breathing document", I completely reject that notion, otherwise we are simply allowing for all sorts of erroneous, unscriptural doctrine of men to be presented as God's word.
Further, it is clear that the oral teaching of Christ would last until the end of time. "’But the word of the Lord abides for ever.’ That word is the good news which was preached to you" (1 Pet. 1:25). Note that the word has been "preached"—that is, communicated orally. This would endure. It would not be supplanted by a written record like the Bible (supplemented, yes, but not supplanted), and would continue to have its own authority.
So you feel that the Bible is merely supplemental to oral tradition? Wow, that is totally contrary to what the Bible itself teaches. Let me guess, you must be a Mormon or Jehovah Witness. Once again, your translation differes significantly from the King James, which reads: "But the word of the Lord endureth for ever. And this is the word which by the gospel is preached unto you."
This is made clear when the apostle Paul tells Timothy: "[W]hat you have heard from me before many witnesses entrust to faithful men who will be able to teach others also" (2 Tim. 2:2). Here we see the first few links in the chain of apostolic tradition that has been passed down intact from the apostles to our own day. Paul instructed Timothy to pass on the oral teachings (traditions) that he had received from the apostle. He was to give these to men who would be able to teach others, thus perpetuating the chain. Paul gave this instruction not long before his death (2 Tim. 4:6–8), as a reminder to Timothy of how he should conduct his ministry.
If there was something so important that it needed to passed down the "apostolic chain" to today, don't you think Paul would have written it down? Why would he leave it to chance? This supposed perpetuated chain of oral tradition is simply a way for extra-biblical, non-scriptural teachings to be passed off as doctrine, something that a Berean would point out immediately.
I pray that if you are a part of a church that teaches such things, that you will seriously consider examining everything with scripture, as the Bereans were commended for doing.
This states clearly that nothing besides scripture is necessary! How can you ignore that?
Milwaukee is still not far behind. We have gotten the same type of sermons the past few weeks, though a bit more toned down than this one sounded....but same gist.
You're talking about faith and salvation now. Sounds like what you're saying is that those believers did hear the word of God - that is, they were preached to from the Bible.
Romans 10:17 Faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.
The word tells us how one is saved:
Romans 10:9
If you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you shall be saved.
That is all that is necessary for salvation - but that does not thorougly equip you for life. The full, complete, revealed word of God (the Bible) will do that. A Christian's life is much better if they are in the word daily, studying it, learning it and applying it. It's all that you need - nothing more!
What the heck is a preacher preaching about if not what the Bible says? If that's not what he's preaching about, then he's not a Christian preacher, he's a motivational speaker, or a psychiatrist, or who knows what...
That's the problem with many churches today. The priests/pastors/preachers don't teach the Bible. Therefore their flock doesn't recognize the truth, and doesn't recognize deceipt and unscriptural teaching when someone tries to pass it off as doctrine.
Only if that oral preaching is in accrodance with the Bible, and not if it's extra-Biblical. That would be detrimental.
If you are "perfect", why do you need anything else? Perfection implies you can't get any better - you don't need to, you're already perfect! If I'm perfect, why do I need something else to make me "perfecter"? I don't! I'm already perfect through scripture!
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