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It figures. The Pope tilts ideologically leftward in most matters--except for his conservative stands on the sinfulness of abortion and homosexuality. Otherwise he is a liberal right down the line: he believes in the sovereignty of the UN, pushes for a one-world religion that homogenizes disparate religous beliefs, and is indifferent to the destruction of authentic Catholic beliefs and practices. It is not at all surprising that issues like this--as well as his animus against capital punishment--arouse his fierce attention in ways that the scandals and apostasies inside his own Church clearly do not.
1 posted on 03/07/2003 5:25:57 AM PST by ultima ratio
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To: ultima ratio
BTW, next time, please put a disclaimer noting your status as a schismatic Traditionalist (i.e., you aren't a member of the Catholic Church) so that people know where you're coming from.
2 posted on 03/07/2003 5:32:26 AM PST by Conservative til I die
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To: ultima ratio
***There is even talk that the pope could win the Nobel Peace Prize***

Jimmy Carter made it clear what it takes to win the "Peace" Prize, criticize the United States.
3 posted on 03/07/2003 5:32:34 AM PST by drstevej
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To: ultima ratio
In that spirit, it is appalling to watch President Bush, who has responsibility for safeguarding 280 million of us from terrorists and terror states, being lectured on his duties in that regard by a church that would not even protect children from its own rogue priests and the bishops who enabled them.

Got to agree with Dreher here. In fact, the Church is still covering up for abusive priests. And these power-hungry bishops are an embarrassment.

Yep, the Church's moral authority has been compromised, perhaps beyond repair, for a very long time.

5 posted on 03/07/2003 5:55:44 AM PST by sinkspur
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To: ultima ratio
Now, Catholics are not obliged to agree with the pope on this issue. The rightness or wrongness of this or any particular war is a matter of opinion. Even just-war teaching recognizes that, in the words of the catechism, "the evaluation of these conditions for moral legitimacy belongs to the prudential judgment of those who have responsibility for the common good." The 50% of America's Catholics who stand by their president, and not their pope, in this matter do not thereby diminish their standing as Catholics.

But the Catholic Church isn't just any institution. It was founded by a man who commanded his followers to remove the plank from their own eye before removing the speck from their neighbor's. In that spirit, it is appalling to watch President Bush, who has responsibility for safeguarding 280 million of us from terrorists and terror states, being lectured on his duties in that regard by a church that would not even protect children from its own rogue priests and the bishops who enabled them.

Finally, this is something we agree on ultima! Rod Dreher is one of my favorite contemporary writers. He has it right on the money on this issue. While I disagree with your assessment that the Pope is pushing for a one-world religion, and I admire his uncompromising stand against communism and abortion, and his spread of the Divine Mercy devotion, the Pope must realize that Christ's Church is suffering from a credibility issue now.

7 posted on 03/07/2003 6:08:13 AM PST by Pyro7480 (+ Vive Jesus! (Live Jesus!) +)
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To: ultima ratio
Good article. However, it does seem that many, perhaps even most, of your fellow traditionalists--Pat Buchanan, Joseph Sobran, Thomas Drolesky, Thomas Woods, the SSPX's Fr. Peter Scott, just to name a few examples--agree with the Pope on the war.

I've been struck by the irony that when it comes to the war, the neoconservative neo-Catholics are suddenly discovering the limits of papal infallibility, while so many of those "schismatic," "Pope-bashing" traditionalists are agreeing with John Paul II! I don't think the Pope's opposition to the war can be labeled as "tilting leftward" as there are many right-wingers who oppose this war, and have good reasons for doing so.
8 posted on 03/07/2003 6:20:18 AM PST by royalcello
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To: ultima ratio
The Vatican is getting spanked here. This is not the Pope speaking but his inner circle of aged in oak barrels Vatican bureaucrats. Many of them junior to the Pope by only 5 years or so. But much more functional because they weren't shot in the stomach by a Muslim terrorist 20 years ago.

I don't have much love for the present day Vatican but I hold (here comes disclaimer) Catholics in the US in high regard.

11 posted on 03/07/2003 7:55:14 AM PST by dennisw ( http://www.littlegreenfootballs.com/weblog/weblog.php)
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To: ultima ratio
OpinionJounal's Webpage of Readers' Responses to Dreher
20 posted on 03/07/2003 9:00:43 PM PST by Dajjal
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To: ultima ratio
From the Readers' Responses:
Brock Fowler - Washington
I hate to say this, but it really is a bit hard for the Vatican to be telling President Bush that he should be able to stop militant Islamism with just words, when the pope hasn't been able to stop flagrant misconduct and open defiance of his authority among those who have taken a sacred vow of obedience to him.

Bullseye!

21 posted on 03/07/2003 9:11:29 PM PST by Dajjal
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To: ultima ratio
It figures. The Pope tilts ideologically leftward in most matters--

As if the Pope should enlist as a political Americanist like National Review and turn the Gospel into something other than a Gospel of Peace.

Yeah for Rumfield! Hurray Hiroshima! Down with the Pope!

Now here's a "new Gospel" for mankind.

While we're at it, let's revive the Levitical penalties (Stoning) for women caught in adultery and for witches. It will make some radtrad mouths water?

23 posted on 03/13/2003 3:20:57 PM PST by PaxChristi
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