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To: fortheDeclaration; ponyespresso; Calvinist_Dark_Lord
You have simply demonstrated that what Acts 2:23 CLEARLY declares does not fit your philisophical ideals.

Your argument had little to do with actual Scripture and more to do with a philisophical understanding. You are dealing, not with what Scripture declares, but with hypotheticals.

I'll stick with what the scripture clearly declares!

Jean

202 posted on 02/12/2003 7:25:39 PM PST by Jean Chauvin (“For they stumble at the word, being disobedient; whereunto also they were appointed.” -1 Peter 2:8.)
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To: Jean Chauvin; xzins
You have simply demonstrated that what Acts 2:23 CLEARLY declares does not fit your philisophical ideals. Your argument had little to do with actual Scripture and more to do with a philisophical understanding. You are dealing, not with what Scripture declares, but with hypotheticals. I'll stick with what the scripture clearly declares!

LOL!

Acts 2:23 states Foreknowledge as in knowing something before something else.

Now, just because the Greek word in 1Pet.1:20 is translated as Foreordain (correctly) does not mean that the Greek word (Proginosko) means foreordain anywhere else!

Context gives meanings to words.

That same Proginosko is also used in two other verses

Which knew me from the beginning if they would testify, that after the most straitest sect of our religion I lived a Pharisee (Acts.26:5)

and 2Pet.3:17

Ye therefore beloved seeing ye know these things before beware lest ye also, being led away with error of the wicked, fall from your own stedfastness.

Now, both of the verses have the same Greek word found in 1Pet.1:20, are they to be translated as saying forordained?

219 posted on 02/14/2003 5:45:42 AM PST by fortheDeclaration
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To: Jean Chauvin; xzins; Revelation 911; Corin Stormhands
This is John Wesley's view on 1Pet.1:2

2 According to the foreknowledge of God - Speaking after the manner of men. Strictly speaking, there is no foreknowledge, no more than afterknowledge, with God: but all things are known to him as present from eternity to eternity. This is therefore no other than an instance of the divine condescension to our low capacities.

Elect - By the free love and almighty power of God taken out of, separated from, the world. Election, in the scripture sense, is God's doing anything that our merit or power have no part in. The true predestination, or fore - appointment of God is,

He that believeth shall be saved from the guilt and power of sin.

He that endureth to the end shall be saved eternally.

They who receive the precious gift of faith, thereby become the sons of God; and, being sons, they shall receive the Spirit of holiness to walk as Christ also walked.

Throughout every part of this appointment of God, promise and duty go hand in hand. All is free gift; and yet such is the gift, that the final issue depends on our future obedience to the heavenly call.

But other predestination than this, either to life or death eternal, the scripture knows not of.

Moreover, it is. Cruel respect of persons; an unjust regard of one, and an unjust disregard of another.

It is mere creature partiality, and not infinite justice.

It is not plain scripture doctrine, if true; but rather, inconsistent with the express written word, that speaks of God's universal offers of grace; his invitations, promises, threatenings, being all general.

We are bid to choose life, and reprehended for not doing it.

It is inconsistent with a state of probation in those that must be saved or must be lost.

It is of fatal consequence; all men being ready, on very slight grounds, to fancy themselves of the elect number. But the doctrine of predestination is entirely changed from what it formerly was.

Now it implies neither faith, peace, nor purity. It is something that will do without them all. Faith is no longer, according to the modern predestinarian scheme, a divine "evidence of things not seen," wrought in the soul by the immediate power of the Holy Ghost; not an evidence at all; but a mere notion.

Neither is faith made any longer a means of holiness; but something that will do without it.

Christ is no more a Saviour from sin; but a defence, a countenancer of it.

He is no more a fountain of spiritual life in the soul of believers, but leaves his elect inwardly dry, and outwardly unfruitful; and is made little more than a refuge from the image of the heavenly; even from righteousness, peace, and joy in the Holy Ghost.

220 posted on 02/14/2003 6:00:40 AM PST by fortheDeclaration
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