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To: Seven_0
Consider, when Eve brought the fruit to Adam, who was a figure of him that was to come. We know that Adam had to make a choice, for we are told that Adam was not deceived. He could either die with Eve, or live without her. Adam freely choose those Choices which God, by His intelligent design of Creation, has causally Predestined us to Choose. Chirst made that same decision. It seems that he could not avoid the Cross. I will not even speculate as to whether there were satisfactory options, rather I conclude that there was no choice. There is something about God's plan that required the Cross. This brings me to your orignal question:

Seven you are staring with a false premesis and building on that

Eve did not bring the fruit to Adam. Adam had violated the responsibility that God had given to him

Gen 1:26   And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth

Adam stood next to Eve and watched the interaction between Eve and the serpent..

Gen 3:6   And when the woman saw that the tree [was] good for food, and that it [was] pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make [one] wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat.

Adam had dominion over that serpent and he could have told it to leave and it would have had to. Instead he allowed his wife to see if the warning of God was true..He made no attempt to stop her..(he had dominion over her as her husband)

If we fast forward to the temptation of Christ we see Him refuse the temptation that befell the 1st Adam (lust of the eyes,lust of the flesh and the pride of life)

Just as Adam had a choice so did Jesus , to speculate that he was without choice violates the word of God

Mat 26:53 Thinkest thou that I cannot now pray to my Father, and he shall presently give me more than twelve legions of angels?

Jesus had a choice and He expressed it

  Jhn 5:30   I can of mine own self do nothing: as I hear, I judge: and my judgment is just; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of the Father which hath sent me.

For his pleasure were all things created~ That does not mean he takes pleasure in destruction and judgement. Considering the cost, I say that things were improved, by his creation.

No God does not take pleasure , but His Holiness and Justice demands it. He Does take pleasure in the glory that comes to Him from those judgements..

Isa 45:6 That they may know from the rising of the sun, and from the west, that [there is] none beside me. I [am] the LORD, and [there is] none else.

1,450 posted on 01/24/2003 7:27:10 AM PST by RnMomof7
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To: RnMomof7
Adam stood next to Eve and watched the interaction between Eve and the serpent

Well, in the KJV, when the serpent addresses Eve, he uses the form 'ye' which indicates that he was saying that you (both of you) will not die if you eat the fruit.

But I don't see an unambiguous statement that Adam was present in the exchange between Eve and the serpent.

Maybe I got this idea from VBS. I vaguely recall some notion that Adam was off somewhere innocently naming the animals while Eve was being ensnared by the serpent and that she then brought the fruit to him and tempted him to eat.

But then since I'm a man, that is a pretty convenient reading. Having looked at Genesis again after your remarks, I'd still say that the argument that Adam was present with Eve and the serpent seems pretty unlikely due to the context of other verses describing it in Genesis 3. It doesn't make much sense to me if Adam is present.
1,452 posted on 01/24/2003 8:06:11 AM PST by George W. Bush
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To: RnMomof7; George W. Bush
"Seven you are staring with a false premesis and building on that"

My premise here is that the Cross could not be avoided. It was part of the original plan in which the choice was already made. Christ had many chances to bypass the Cross: (Matt 26:54) "But how then shall the scriptures be fulfilled, that thus it must be?"

When satan fell, he lost something of his ability to choose, otherwise he could repent and change everything. Adam also could no longer choose to have fellowship God. A slave to sin can not choose to be free. The work here was incumbent on God.

"Adam stood next to Eve and watched the interaction between Eve and the serpent."

I had not thought of this before. I could be persuaded, but I think your argument needs help. The Genesis account of the fall is really a parable and Christ , as is so often the case, is the main character.("...they are they that testify of me"). Quite often in scripture, we know enough about the real thing, (Christ), to fill in some of the blanks in the symbol(Adam). In this case, God was gone from the scene, he came looking for them later. I doubt whether Adam or Eve would have eaten the fruit had God been there, just as I doubt that Eve would have been deceived had Adam been there. This is not a powerful arguement, but the little details have a way adding up. There is so much going on here but, I must get back to work. I enjoy your posts.

1,473 posted on 01/24/2003 12:35:02 PM PST by Seven_0
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