Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article

To: fortheDeclaration
You soooooo misstate the scripitual perseverence of the saints it is hard to know where to start....Dec I worry about you
28 posted on 11/22/2002 8:40:39 PM PST by RnMomof7
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 21 | View Replies ]


To: RnMomof7; xzins
I note that you did not say how I misstated the perserverance of the Saints.

Just more empty Calvinist rhetoric.

http://www.apuritansmind.com/TULIP/TULIP.htm Perseverance of the Saints Will the saints endure to the end? Can we know if we are going to endure?

Perseverance of the Saints does not mean "once saved always saved". This corruption of the doctrine has been popular in recent years, but has never been a true representation of the doctrine. "Once saved always saved" is more keenly given the name "Perseverance of the sinner" instead of "the saint". For it teaches that man can be saved by Christ and then sin habitually, do whatever he wants, and then still "persevere to the end". Perseverance of the saints does not teach this. Perseverance of the saints teaches that once God has renewed the heart of a sinner through the application of the redemption wrought by Christ upon the cross, he will continue to be saved and show forth the fruits of that salvation. The sinner perseveres because of Christ, but he continually shows himself as one who has been changed by Christ. God has saved the individual and will sanctify him until the end when he is ultimately glorified, and in heaven. It does not mean man has a license to sin. Those who think they have a license to sin are not changed and saved by grace. They are still in sin. Those who are saved by grace and changed, desire(emphasis added) to show forth the fruits of that salvation. God motions the heart to good work, and continues that good work to the end.

Yet, a Christian can fall into wicked sin

Article 4: The Danger of True Believers' Falling into Serious Sins Although that power of God strengthening and preserving true believers in grace is more than a match for the flesh, yet those converted are not always so activated and motivated by God that in certain specific actions they cannot by their own fault depart from the leading of grace, be led astray by the desires of the flesh, and give in to them. For this reason they must constantly watch and pray that they may not be led into temptations. When they fail to do this, not onlycan they be carried away by the flesh, the world, and Satan into sins, even serious and outrageous ones, but also by God's just permission they sometimesare so carried away -- witness the sad cases, described in Scripture, of David, Peter, and other saints falling into sins.

Article 5: The Effects of Such Serious Sins By such monstrous sins, however, they greatly offend God, deserve the sentence of death, grieve the Holy Spirit, suspend the exercise of faith, severely wound the conscience, and sometimes lose the awareness of grace for a time -- until, after they have returned to the way by genuine repentance, God's fatherly face again shines upon them.

So, a Calvinist must be really wait until the end of his life to be sure that he is a member of the elect, he after all, may fall into sin and never repent, showing that he was not a member of the 'elect' after all.

Article 9: The Assurance of This Preservation Concerning this preservation of those chosen to salvation and concerning the perseverance of true believers in faith, believers themselves can and do become assured in accordance with the measure of their faith, by which they firmly believe that they are and always will remain true and living members of the church, and that they have the forgiveness of sins and eternal life.

So, if you as a Calvinist, have not this 'assurance' and are dealing with daily sins you are going to start doubting your salvation and start working harder to prove to yourself that you are really saved. (see #11 in the Canons of Dort)

29 posted on 11/23/2002 5:22:09 AM PST by fortheDeclaration
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 28 | View Replies ]

Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article


FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson