The Twenty Mysteries of the Rosary?

Seattle Catholic ^ | November 8, 2002 | John Vennari

[ultima ratio]

Peter also betrayed Christ three times. Implicit in Our Lord's words was the expectation that Peter would transmit the truths which had been given him, not that he would make up novelties and invent a new religion. This Pope has done just that and has been a disaster for the Church.

[ultima ratio]

You, like others, have focused on this minor business of the rosary. I keep responding to each of you, but none of you seem to get the message. The added mysteries are nothing but further symptoms of the modernist disease. It is not even that significant, compared to other changes. But it is still another push to scrap traditional Catholicism. So far in the revolution the Mass has been protestantized, our churches have had their tabernacles shunted aside, their communion rails ripped out, in some places even the kneelers have been removed. There is not a single sacrament that has not undergone major overhaul. Our sacred music has been scrapped. Our religious orders have collapsed, as have our missions around the world. Our seminaries have become playgrounds for sexually active gays. Our Catholic theologies have been scrapped, our Catholic devotions have been scrapped, our Catholic literature has been scrapped, our Catholic doctrines have been suppressed. Communion is taken in the hands and kneeling for communion has been eliminated. Cardinals and bishops are in open apostasy across the globe. Meanwhile the Pope venerates the Koran and pours libations to animist spirits in a Togo forest and elevates heretics to the cardinalate. He thus performs acts that can only be interpreted as idolatrous and irresponsible. THAT is what's going on. My reference to the rosary is merely to just another novelty. Pretty routine really, though it is prelude to still more drastic changes. In a few years nothing of the original rosary will be left. What is really happening is that the conciliar Church is imposing a new religion. To achieve their ends, the faithful are being acclimated to these gradual changes until finally nothing of the ancient faith--which had been virtually unchanged for two thousand years--remains or can even be remembered.

[Siobhan]

You are correct. The Catholic witness on FR has been completely sabotaged whether it was Stephen Hand and Company or the so-called 'ultratrads' -- who may well be SSPXers or even agents of the USCCB -- there is no way of knowing. But the end result has been a neutralizing and a disrupting of something that was wonderful when I first arrived, and I lament its passing. And I wish there were some way to put it right.

[Siobhan]

We should enjoy and delight in this wondrous faith in Jesus Christ, in our worship of Him, and in our devotions --as should all real Catholics.

[Siobhan]

ultima ratio,

In your posts you use the words of the Catholic faith, but every single one of your posts on this thread is written in darkness and drips with evil.

I believe you have been sent here by satan to disrupt and divide the Catholics who have worked hard to forge a common witness. I know that means nothing to you, but I serve you notice. I know who you are and who you serve. Perhaps you are not even aware how much you are in the devil's thrall. But your posts are a testimony to how deceived you are and how systematically you and your ilk are trying to deceive faithful and traditional Catholics. If there is any well meaning soul who is sucked in by you and your posts, I urge them to run as far as they can from you.

[patent]

>>>.And I wish there were some way to put it right.

Be not afraid. These things come and go, we've had these infestations before around here.

patent

[Siobhan]

Thank you, patent. I know you who have been here longer have seen things come and go. I pray this infestation will be brought to a swift end through the intervention and intercession of St. Michael the Archangel.

[patent]

>>>>I know you who have been here longer

Interesting thing to me is that my reg number is only about half way into the reg numbers. So many people who registered before me are still here, though many have left as well.

[Lady In Blue]

I agree with everything you said,Siobhan.I don't trust myself to answer these ultra traditionalist! It's an outrage to think they know more and are holier than the Pope John Paul 11. I LOVE the new Mysteries of Light.I say them everyday.When I first started saying them,I used the scripture right along with saying them.Are these people saying that the public life of Our Lord is not Catholic enough to be included in the Rosary?!

[Maximilian]

We should enjoy and delight in this wondrous faith in Jesus Christ, in our worship of Him, and in our devotions --as should all real Catholics.

Let's say we lived in a city -- let's call it "New Jerusalem." It's a beautiful city which has been built up over 2000 years. We love our city and are devoted to it to the point that we would sacrifice our lives for it.

But at this particular point of history, the city is besieged on all sides. It has suffered other sieges over the course of its long history, but this is perhaps the most dangerous situation yet. Enemies attack it relentlessly from without. Even worse, it is known that there are numerous traitors who are undermining it from within. The city has suffered devastating casualties with the loss of tens of thousands of officers and millions of citizens.

Do we serve our city by ignoring the problems? Is it true loyalty to pretend that nothing is wrong? Will we save our city from destruction by happy talk divorced from reality?

Let's say that the citizens of the city believe that God has promised that the city will never be entirely destroyed. Do we fail for that reason to combat the enemies, both external and internal. Do we have any less obligation to fight to the death? Or is God's promise perhaps contingent on OUR faithfulness?

The citizens of "New Jerusalem" may delight in their city, but they are called to be "militant," and they fail in their duty if they shirk the necessary tasks when times are at their bleakest.

[saradippity]

archbishop Weakland's resigned end of May 2002.

Ultima Ratio signed on as a Freeper end of July 2002.

Hmmm?Perhaps life was getting too dull after two months of being relatively ignored and without the power position to continue wreaking havoc in the Church?

[ultima ratio]

Oh, get off it. Nothing I have said can justify your venomous reaction.

I have said the Mass has been protestantized. That is the truth. It now is virtually indistinguishable from a Lutheran or Methodist worship service. Long passages are interchangeable with the Protestant Lord's Supper, even word-for-word.

I have said Catholic doctrines are suppressed. This is the truth. Both the Real Presence and Christ's Divinity, as well as the concept of sacrifice for the expiation for sins, are questioned by churchmen at the highest levels while Catholic youngsters have been uncatechized concerning them for a full generation. A Gallup poll published in US News and World Report ten years ago showed that two out of three Catholics no longer believe in the Real Presence. Yet Rome has not been alarmed and does nothing about it.

I have said that the seminaries are corrupt and Rome has known all about it for decades. This is the truth. The Wanderer and The Remnant and Catholic Family News and Catholic World Report and The Latin Mass--just to mention a handful of well-circulated sources--have been publishing information about seminary corruption for years. Letters of petition from the laity have been sent to the Vatican by the thousands, complaining about clerical abuses as well, much of it stemming from corrupt seminaries--to no avail. The seminaries still are subsumed in the gay subculture. (Read Goodbye, Good Men!)

I have said this Pope has venerated the Koran, has prayed with animists and witchdoctors and voodoo priests as though their religions were equal to our own, has worshipped with Jews and mullahs in synogogues and mosques. This is the truth. It is all very well documented, however much you dislike to hear about the Pope's idolatrous actions.

I have said this Pope is reluctant to discipline high-placed apostates and has allowed corrupt prelates to remain in office despite their harmful effects on the faithful, many of whom have been instrumental in victimizing innocent Catholic children for decades. This is the truth. The scandals we suffer daily have been primarily Rome's responsibility to redress. Reforms should have been instituted years ago, but this Pope cannot bring himself to fire anybody, no matter how corrupt. It is usually only after the media gets wind of something juicy, like Archbishop Weakland's long-standing love affair with a priest, or Bishop Cawcutt's well-publicized gay porno activities, that Rome decides to act with a little vigor and demand a few resignations from unworthy spiritual shepherds. Too little too late.

For speaking out about these shocking facts, you curse me and call me evil and satanic. This is sheer slander and a sign of your intellectual poverty as well as your frustration. You cannot deal factually with what I say, so you hurl abuse and insults. But the problem is not me. The problem is with Rome and its modernist hierarchy. Instead of focusing your anger on me, get after them as I do.

[ultima ratio]

You have a mistaken notion about the rosary, about which much has been written by popes and theologians. The essence of the rosary is contemplative prayer, a much higher form of prayer than verbal recitation.|

[ultima ratio]

"You love the Church of pre-Vatican II." This is a telling comment by you. You are acknowledging the conciliar Church is something different. It is a new religion. I have been saying this all along. I DO love the pre-conciliar Church, miraculously preserved by a remnant of traditionalists, because it is Catholic and Apostolic. This new religion pushed by Rome is neither.

[ultima ratio]

As usual, you are in denial and miss the big picture. The rosary is a small part of the whole. What remains of the old Church? Hardly anything. If they could, they would tear down Chartres and put a Tajmahoney in its place. They are already redefining essential doctrines. And you will continue to applaud them because you identify the Pope with the very Catholicism he is attacking and dismantling for the sake of a wholly new doctrine: an exaggerated ecumenism never before preached or practiced in the Catholic Church.

[ultima ratio]

My solution is a restoration of Catholic tradition, its culture and its rituals, beginning with the old Mass. What we have now is a form of Protestantism.

[ultima ratio]

I love how you miss the point. It's not about three or four decades of the rosary. It's about change for the sake of change and a slow destruction of Catholic culture and devotions. There have been more changes to Catholicism in the past forty years than in the entire two thousand-year history of the Church. That in itself should warn you something is very wrong. Revolution by its very nature is hostile to Catholicism, especially when it touches on Catholic doctrines. We should revere the deposit of faith as is handed-down, not look to alter it to make it more accommodating or politically correct. Our faith is what has been transmitted through the ages, not what the Pope himself has decided to invent. Novelty has no part in it, and while this change to the rosary is a tiny part of a much bigger picture, it is nevertheless symptomatic of the same evil that is attacking tradition on all other fronts.

[Catholicguy]

If the Blessed Mother had thought that there was a "huge gaping hole" in her Rosary, you'd think she would have mentioned it to St Dominic or the children of Fatima or somebody

<> Is it outside the realm of possibility she inspired this Pope to make these changes? <>

[ultima ratio]

No, nobody destroyed anything. What we have introduced is a perspective people like you cannot effectively oppose. You can't oppose our arguments because they are sound and factually based. The fact is, traditionalists are not in the business of destroying anything. We want a restoration of the faith and a restoration of Catholic doctrines and a restoration of tabernacles at the center of sanctuaries and a restoration of a priesthood that is celibate and holy and a restoration of our children's innocence by means of a sound catechesis and a restoration of our ancient customs and rites and pious practices and a restoration finally of our truly Catholic identity. What we have got now is this modernist protestantized abomination--this is the REAL STENCH, the stench of four tragic decades of scandals and apostasies which have been the only authentic legacy of the liberal take-over of the Vatican.