Luther's 95 Thesis Happy Reformation Day

http://www.gty.org/~phil/history/95theses.htm ^ | Martin Luther

[drstevej]

Those who rejected Jesus were the established spirtual leaders in Israel. Politically they said, We have no king but Caesar. Jesus was seen as both a spiritual and political usurper by those in spiritual and political power. Sound like a revolutionary? Does to me.

The fact the He was the rightful king and the One who wasspiritually orthodox makes it none the less a revolution.

[RnMomof7]

exactly..thus the sign "King of the Jews" hung over His Holy head

[RobbyS]

You have a modern view of revolutionaries. But both the English and American whigs were reluctant to assume the title, regarding the Stuarts and George III as the subverters of the Constitution and ursurpers. Liberation, not revolution.

[RobbyS]

Put there by the Romans, not the Jews.

[RnMomof7]

The Romans did as the Jewish ,leaders wanted.."CRUCIFY Him"

He challenges our tradition, He challenges our spiritual authority "CRUCIFY Him"

[JenB]

We sang "A Might Fortress" at church this Sunday in honor of the Reformation. Do Catholics have to forgo that awesome hymn?

Keep up the good fight.

[RnMomof7]

Mat 10:34 Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword.

Luk 12:49   I am come to send fire on the earth; and what will I, if it be already kindled?

Mat 10:35 For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law.

[RobbyS]

Jesus was the royal heir come to claim his inheritance By rejecting him, the trustees of that inheritance--the Jews and the Romans-- committed regicide.

[RobbyS]

To choose Jesus indeed requires a revolution of the heart, one cannot serve God and mammon.

[RnMomof7]

Spiritually that is correct..but Satan is the God of this world and to the political and spiritual structure of that day Jesus was a revolutionary..as were the apostles all martyrs  

[RobbyS]

The priests and Roman authorities may have seen Jesus in the same light as other messiahs, but The Gospels take care to present Him in quite a different light, saying that he was NOT what the authorities supposed him to be, which is, to use your term, a revolutionary.

[RnMomof7]

Point is I do not believe that God sees Luther as a revoluntary either:>)

[RobbyS]

I see Luther as a reluctant rebel, but a rebel nonethless because he fled to the protection of his prince rather than witness to his faith through martyrdom. For this reason, I honor a man like Hus more.

[drstevej]

You would have liked to see him get the Hus treatment, huh? While in seclusion at the Wartburg he translated the Bible into German (a brilliant translation which shaped the German language thereafter). His translation enabled his countrymen to read the Bible for themselves. Dangerous stuff.

RS, Luther risked his life even going to Worms on safe conduct. The questioning of Luther was focvused on linking him with Hus and no doubt had the same fate in view. Thank God, Charles and the RC hierarchy did not do to him what was done to John Hus.

HUS' TESTIMONY>>>

The ceremony of degradation now took place. As soon. as his robes had been taken from him, the Bishops began a hot discussion about the proper way of cutting his hair. Some clamoured for a razor, others were all for scissors. "See," said Hus to the King, "these Bishops cannot agree in their blasphemy." At last the scissors won the victory. His tonsure was cut in four directions, and a fool's cap, a yard high, with a picture of devils tearing his soul, was placed upon that hero's head. "So," said the Bishops, "we deliver your soul to the devil." "Most joyfully," said Hus, "will I wear this crown of shame for thy sake, O Jesus! who for me didst wear a crown of thorns." "Go, take him," said the King. And Hus was led to his death. As he passed along he saw the bonfire in which his books were being burned. He smiled. Along the streets of the city he strode, with fetters clanking on his feet, a thousand soldiers for his escort, and crowds of admirers surging on every hand. Full soon the fatal spot was reached. It was a quiet meadow among the gardens, outside the city gates. At the stake he knelt once more in prayer, and the fool's cap fell from his head. Again he smiled. It ought to be burned along with him, said a watcher, that he and the devils might be together. He was bound to the stake with seven moist thongs and an old rusty chain, and faggots of wood and straw were piled round him to the chin. For the last time the Marshal approached to give him a fair chance of abjuring. "What errors," he retorted, "shall I renounce? I know myself guilty of none. I call God to witness that all that I have written and preached has been with the view of rescuing souls from sin and perdition, and therefore most joyfully will I confirm with my blood the truth I have written and preached."

As the flames arose and the wood crackled, he chanted the Catholic burial prayer, "Jesu, Son of David, have mercy upon me." From the west a gentle breeze was blowing, and a gust dashed the smoke and sparks in his face. At the words "Who was born of the Virgin Mary he ceased; his lips moved faintly in silent prayer; and a few moments later the martyr breathed no more. At last the cruel fire died down, and the soldiers wrenched his remains from the post, hacked his skull in pieces, and ground his bones to powder. As they prodded about among the glowing embers to see how much of Hus was left, they found, to their surprise, that his heart was still unburned. One fixed it on the point of his spear, thrust it back into the fire, and watched it frizzle away; and finally, by the Marshal's orders, they gathered all the ashes together, and tossed them into the Rhine.

[RobbyS]

Hus was the better man.

[RnMomof7]

Ichabod  

[drstevej]

Does having one's skull hacked into pieces, grinding one's bones to powder and impaling one's heart on a spear in order to roast in the fire impress you?

***Hus was the better man. ***

A lot more fun, huh?

[RobbyS]

In retrospect, Hus was foolhardy is going to a foreign city, but Luther was in his own country. Hus died for his faith, Luther did not. His greatest moment was agreeing to go to Worms, but long before he reached there he realized that his popularity among Germans gave him a real immunity that Hus never enjoyed. Do you think he was suprised when he was "kidnapped "and taken into protective custody by the Elector?
As for Hus's fate, do you really believe in the old aphorism: Better the living dog than the dead lion?

[drstevej]

***Do you think he was suprised when he was "kidnapped "and taken into protective custody by the Elector? ***

Probably not. I am glad he was, for the sake of his translational work and his other contributions. I had an opportunity to visit the Wartburg and attend services in his church at Wittenburg several months prior to the wall coming down. I am not a Lutheran, but I appreciate Luther in many ways.

***Better the living dog than the dead lion? ***
This isn't a cajun aphorism, not sure what it means.

[RobbyS]

Lincoln used it after he arrived in Washington in disguise after being warned about a planned attack in Baltimore. It did not instill confidence in the new president.

Luther's career after Worms was more that of the partisan leader than the prophet since his volleys were fired from behind high walls.