Posted on 09/12/2002 7:19:20 AM PDT by xzins
CONFUSED ABOUT SPURGEON'S PROPHETIC VIEWS?
. Charles Haddon Spurgeon's VIEW OF THE |
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MILLENNIUM |
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Annotated Summary by |
MARK A. MCNEIL |
"I am not now going into millennial theories, or into any speculation as to dates. I do not know anything at all about such things, and I am not sure that I am called to spend my time in such researches. I am rather called to minister the gospel than to open prophecy. Those who are wise in such things doubtless prize their wisdom, but I have not the time to acquire it, nor any inclination to leave soul-winning pursuits for less arousing themes. I believe it is a great deal better to leave many of these promises, and many of these gracious out-looks of believers, to exercise their full force upon our minds, without depriving them of their simple glory by aiming to discover dates and figures. Let this be settled, however, that if there be meaning in words, Israel is yet to be restored. Israel is to have a SPIRITUAL RESTORATION or a CONVERSION."
[from The Restoration & Conversion of the Jews MTP Vol 10, Year 1864, pg. 429, Ezekiel 37:1-10 (age 30)]
INTRODUCTION
There has been some considerable difference of opinion regarding the position that C. H. Spurgeon, the great Baptist preacher from the 19th century, held in the area of Eschatology regarding the doctrine of the Millennium. Each of the three major divisions within this area of doctrine have proponents who claim Spurgeon as one of their own. Many times authors claim a different millennial view than what Spurgeon actually believed.
It is not our task to sort out the arguments for each view. Such an assignment would take a very large volume (many are available) and the issue would still not be solved for all. We would simply like to define the basic positions and then demonstrate from Spurgeon's own words which one view he held.
PREMILLENNIALISM
The first view regarding the Millennium is that of PREMILLENNIALISM. The prefix, "Pre," denotes "before." The prefix is telling us at what point in relationship to the millennium that Christ will come. This view holds that our Lord will Literally return before a 1,000-year reign of Christ begins. The millennium of Revelation 20 is taken to be literal. If not literal, it at least is speaking of an indefinite period of time following the coming of Christ during which there will be perfect peace on the earth.
Within the premillennialist camp, there have come to be two identifiable views: the "dispensationalist" position, and the "historic" position. For further information defending each of these views, one should consult Reese's The Approaching Advent of Christ [historic] and Dwight Pentecost's Things to Come [dispensational]. Though the differences between the two are important, it is not within the scope of our purpose here to delve into such matters.
AMILLENNIALISM
The second view is called AMILLENNIALISM, or sometimes called "realized eschatology". The prefix, "A-," means "no". This would suggest that those who hold this view do not believe in a millennium. This is somewhat misleading, however. This view is the the product of a consistent Spiritual interpretation of prophetic literature. To those, the millennium is not some future physical reign, but the present reign of Christ in the hearts of believers. The "millennium" is an indefinite period of time (the present age) after which Christ will physically return. Prophecy in the Church, by Oswald Allis, is a standard work for the amillennial position.
This is the position of the Roman Catholic Church, also many other Protestant denominations. It grew out of St. Augustine's spiritualizing of these issues in his writings, and the tendency of many early Christian writers to see the Church as the "new Israel" and therefore the recipient of the promises of the Old Testament for the Jewish nation. Those who hold this view do not speak of the millennium as a future happening. It is, to them, a Present Reality.
POSTMILLENNIALISM
The third, and last, major view is that of POSTMILLENNIALISM. The prefix "Post" speaks of "after." This teaching promotes the view that the physical return of Christ will Follow an actual millennium. The influence of Christianity will over-take the world for an extended period of time, then Christ will return.
This view appears to be a mixture of the principles that work to produce the first two views. It is not consistently spiritual or literal in its interpretation of the prophetic material relevant to this issue. Perhaps the foremost writing for this position today is The Millennium, by Loraine Boettner.
Spurgeon's VIEW
With basic definitions before us, then, let's look at some quotes from Spurgeon to see what his position was on the Millennium.
"If I read the word aright, and it is honest to admit that there is much room for difference of opinion here, the day will come, when the Lord Jesus will descend from heaven with a shout, with the trump of the archangel and the voice of God. Some think that this descent of the Lord will be Post-millennial that is, 'after the thousand years' of his reign. I CANNOT THINK SO. I conceive that the advent will be PRE-millennial that He will come first; and then will come the millennium as the result of his personal reign upon earth. But whether or no, this much is the fact, that Christ will suddenly come, come to reign, and come to judge the earth in righteousness." [from Justification & Glory MTP Vol 11, Year 1865, pg. 249, Romans 8:30 (age 31)]
Spurgeon here specifically identifies the Postmillennial view with a clear DENIAL of any adherence to it! Those who attempt to claim Spurgeon for this viewpoint do not demonstrate their contention by referring to clear comparisons such as this one. They rather go to sermons not specifically dealing with both positions and pull out of them ideas that are "compatible" with Postmillennial thinking. This is a faulty way of proving a point, however* especially when they meet squarely with a Spurgeon statement like the one above, and those below.
*NOTE: Furthur, a few postmillennialists (especially GARY NORTH), are guilty of misrepresenting Spurgeon constantly in articles and books; NORTH has repeatedly alleged that "Spurgeon was Postmillennial" yet neither his supplied quotations "say" so, and/or he deliberately does not present a statement by Spurgeon that North will speculate "implies" a Postmillennial position. Our advice is to ignore anything North states regarding Spurgeon's views and Prophecy!
Again, consider Spurgeon's View here in light of 'Postmillennial' teaching...
"Paul does not paint the future with rose-colour: he is no smooth-tongued prophet of a golden age, into which this dull earth may be imagined to be glowing. There are sanguine brethren who are looking forward to everything growing better and better and better, until, at last, this present age ripens into a millennium. They will not be able to sustain their hopes, for Scripture gives them no solid basis to rest upon. We who believe that there will be no millennial reign without the King, and who expect no rule of righteousness except from the appearing of the righteous Lord, are nearer the mark. Apart from the second Advent of our Lord, the world is more likely to sink into a pandemonium than to rise into a millennium. A divine interposition seems to me the hope set before us in Scripture, and, indeed, to be the only hope adequate to the occasion. We look to the darkening down of things; the state of mankind, however improved politically, may yet grow worse and worse spiritually." [from The Form of Godliness Without the Power MTP Vol 35, Year 1889, pg. 301, 2 Timothy 3:5 (age 54)]
"We are to expect the literal advent of Jesus Christ, for he himself by his angel told us, 'This same Jesus which is taken up from you into heaven shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven,' which must mean literally and in person. We expect a reigning Christ on earth; that seems to us to be very plain, and to be put so literally that we dare not spiritualise it. We anticipate a first and a second resurrection; a first resurrection of the righteous, and a second resurrection of the ungodly, who shall be judged, condemned, and punished for ever by the sentence of the great King." [from Things to Come MTP Vol 15, Year 1869, pg. 329, 1 Corinthians 3:22 (age 35)]
Here, stress is laid upon the Literal Nature of the second coming. Also, after this literal return is stressed a reigning upon the earth.
"We have done once for all with the foolish ideas of certain of the early heretics, that Christ's appearance upon earth was but a phantom. We know that he was really, personally, and physically here on earth. But it is not quite so clear to some persons that he is to come really, personally, and literally, the second time. I know there are some who are labouring to get rid of the fact of a personal reign, but as I take it, the coming and the reign are so connected together, that we must have a spiritual coming if we are to have a spiritual reign. Now we believe and hold that Christ shall come a second time suddenly, to raise his saints at the first judgment, and they shall reign with him afterwards. The rest of the dead live not till after the thousand years are finished. Then shall they rise from their tombs at the sounding of the trumpet, and their judgment shall come and they shall receive the deeds which they have done in their bodies." [from The Two Advents of Christ MTP Vol 8, Year 1862, pg. 39, Hebrews 9:27-28 (age 28)][from The Sinner's End MTP Vol 8, Year 1862, pgs. 712-713, Psalms 73:17-18 (age 28)], Spurgeon is discussing the final condition of the sinner "Let us go on to consider their end. The day of days, that dreadful day has come. The millennial rest is over, the righteous have had their thousand years of glory upon earth."
In the quotes above, the order of events fits perfectly the PREmillennial point of view. The final end of the sinner is faced after the righteous have enjoyed a thousand years with Christ.
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"Our Hope is the Personal PRE-MILLENNIAL RETURN of the Lord Jesus Christ in Glory." |
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August 1891, age 58 |
Of the various articles and writings by those who deny the conclusion that we feel is obvious, none that I have found bases itself on the same type of quotes we have produced (many others could have been given see those that follow). To the contrary, their's are based on "interpreting" Spurgeon's statements apart from such quotes that we have given.
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We feel safe in concluding, then, |
that of the three views we began with, |
Spurgeon expressly states that he believes in a |
Literal Return of Jesus Christ |
BEFORE |
a Literal Millennium on the Earth. |
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Written by Mark A. McNeil (Houston TX USA), B.A., M.A., & PhD. Student |
Author of An Evaluation of the 'Oneness Pentecostal' Movement |
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From the Summer 1990 issue of this magazine, C. W. H. Griffiths states Spurgeon "was a valued standard bearer for historic Pre-millennialism," and then presents an excellent article defending his Pre-millennial position.
Documenting additional quotations which we have added and expanded below
Spurgeon (age 43) There is moreover to be a reign of Christ. I cannot read the Scriptures without perceiving that there is to be a pre-millennial reign, as I believe, upon the earth and that there shall be new heavens and a new earth wherein dwelleth righteousness...Spurgeon (age 49) Then all His people who are alive at the time of His coming shall be suddenly transformed, so as to be delivered from all the frailties and imperfections of their mortal bodies: The dead shall be raised incorruptible and we shall be changed. Then we shall be presented spirit, soul, and body without spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; in the clear and absolute perfection of our sanctified manhood, presented unto Christ Himself.
Spurgeon (age 50) When the Lord comes there will be no more death; we who are alive and remain (as some of us may be we cannot tell) will undergo a sudden transformation for flesh and blood, as they are, cannot inherit the kingdom of God and by that transformation our bodies shall be made meet to be partakers of the inheritance of the saints in light.
Spurgeon (age 52) His coming will cause great sorrow. What does the text say about his coming? All kindreds of the earth shall wail because of Him. Then this sorrow will be very general.
Spurgeon (age 30) [from The Restoration & Conversion of the Jews MTP Vol 10, Year 1864, pgs. 427-430, Ezekiel 37:1-10] Under the preaching of the Word the vilest sinners can be reclaimed, the most stubborn wills can be subdued, the most unholy lives can be sanctified. When the holy "breath" comes from the four winds, when the divine Spirit descends to own the Word, then multitudes of sinners, as on Pentecost's hallowed day, stand up upon their feet, an exceeding great army, to praise the Lord their God. But, mark you, this is not the first and proper interpretation of the text; it is indeed nothing more than a very striking parallel case to the one before us. It is not the case itself; it is only a similar one, for the way in which God restores a nation is, practically, the way in which he restores an individual. The way in which Israel shall be saved is the same by which any one individual sinner shall be saved. It is not, however, the one case which the prophet is aiming at; he is looking at the vast mass of cases, the multitudes of instances to be found among the Jewish people, of gracious quickening, and holy resurrection. His first and primary intention was to speak of them, and though it is right and lawful to take a passage in its widest possible meaning, since "no Scripture is of private interpretation," yet I hold it to be treason to God's Word to neglect its primary meaning, and constantly to say "Such-and-such is the primary meaning, but it is of no consequence, and I shall use the words for another object." The preacher of God's truth should not give up the Holy Ghost's meaning; he should take care that he does not even put it in the back ground. The first meaning of a text, the Spirit's meaning, is that which would be brought out first, and though the rest may fairly spring out of it, yet the first sense should have the chief place. Let it have the uppermost place in the synagogue, let it be looked upon as at least not inferior, either in interest or importance, to any other meaning which may come out of the text.
The meaning of our text, as opened up by the context, is most evidently, if words mean anything, first, that there shall be a political restoration of the Jews to their own land and to their own nationality; and then, secondly, there is in the text, and in the context, a most plain declaration, that there shall be a spiritual restoration, a conversion in fact, of the tribes of Israel.
The promise is that they shall renounce their idols, and, behold, they have already done so. "Neither shall they defile themselves any more with their idols." Whatever faults the Jew may have besides, he certainly has no idolatry. "The Lord thy God is one God," is a truth far better conceived by the Jew than by any other man on earth except the Christian. Weaned for ever from the worship of all images, of whatever sort, the Jewish nation has now become infatuated with traditions or duped by philosophy. She is to have, however, instead of these delusions, a spiritual religion: she is to love her God. "They shall be my people, and I will be their God." The unseen but omnipotent Jehovah is to be worshipped in spirit and in truth by his ancient people; they are to come before him in his own appointed way, accepting the Mediator whom their sires rejected; coming into covenant relation with God, for so our text tells us "I will make a covenant of peace with them," and Jesus is our peace, therefore we gather that Jehovah shall enter into the covenant of grace with them, that covenant of which Christ is the federal head, the substance, and the surety. They are to walk in God's ordinances and statutes, and so exhibit the practical effects of being united to Christ who hath given them peace. All these promises certainly imply that the people of Israel are to be converted to God, and that this conversion is to be permanent, for the tabernacle of God is to be with them, the Most High is, in an especial manner, to have his sanctuary in the midst of them for evermore; so that whatever nations may apostatize and turn from the Lord in these latter days, the nation of Israel never can, for she shall be effectually and permanently converted, the hearts of the fathers shall be turned with the hearts of the children unto the Lord their God, and they shall be the people of God, world without end.
We look forward, then, for these two things. I am not going to theorize upon which of them will come first, whether they shall be restored first, and converted afterwards, or converted first, and then restored. They are to be restored, and they are to be converted too. Let the Lord send these blessings in his own order, and we shall be well content whichever way they shall come. We take this for our joy and our comfort, that this thing shall be, and that both in the spiritual and in the temporal throne, the King Messiah shall sit, and reign among his people gloriously.
Spurgeon (age 30) [from The Lamb the Light MTP Vol 10, Year 1864, pg. 439, Revelation 21:23] (Spurgeon says of the millennial earth), They shall not say one to another, "Know the Lord: for all shall know him, from the least to the greatest." There may be even in that period certain solemn assemblies and Sabbath-days, but they will not be of the same kind as we have now; for the whole earth will be a temple, every day will be a Sabbath, the avocations of men will all be priestly, they shall be a nation of priests distinctly so, and they shall day without night serve God in his temple, so that everything to which they set their hand shall be a part of the song which shall go up to the Most High. Oh! blessed day. Would God it had dawned, when these temples should be left, because the whole world should be a temple for God. But whatever may be the splendours of that day and truly here is a temptation to let our imagination revel however bright may be the walls set with chalcedony and amethyst, however splendid the gates which are of one pearl, whatever may be the magnificence set forth by the "streets of gold," this we know, that the sum and substance, the light and glory of the whole will be the person of our Lord Jesus Christ, "for the glory of God did lighten it, and the Lamb is the light thereof." Now, I want the Christian to meditate over this. In the highest, holiest, and happiest era that shall ever dawn upon this poor earth, Christ is to be her light. When she puts on her wedding garments, and adorns herself as a bride is adorned with jewels, Christ is to be her glory and her beauty. There shall be no ear-rings in her ears made with other gold than that which cometh from his mine of love; there shall be no crown set upon her brow fashioned by any other hand than his hands of wisdom and of grace. She sits to reign, but it shall be upon his throne; she feeds, but it shall be upon his bread; she triumphs, but it shall be because of the might which ever belongs to him who is the Rock of Ages. Come then, Christian, contemplate for a moment thy beloved Lord. Jesus, in a millennial age, shall be the light and the glory of the city of the new Jerusalem. Observe then, that Jesus makes the light of the millennium, because his presence will be that which distinguishes that age from the present. That age is to be akin to paradise. Paradise God first made upon earth, and paradise God will last make. Satan destroyed it; and God will never have defeated his enemy until he has re-established paradise, until once again a new Eden shall bless the eyes of God's creatures. Now, the very glory and privilege of Eden I take to be not the river which flowed through it with its four branches, nor that it came from the land of Havilah which hath dust of gold I do not think the glory of Eden lay in its grassy walks, or in the boughs bending with luscious fruit but its glory lay in this, that the "Lord God walked in the garden in the cool of the day." Here was Adam's highest privilege, that he had companionship with the Most High. In those days angels sweetly sang that the tabernacle of God was with man, and that he did dwell amongst them. Brethren, the paradise which is to be regained for us will have this for its essential and distinguishing mark, that the Lord shall dwell amongst us. This is the name by which the city is to be called Jehovah Shammah, the Lord is there. It is true we have the presence of Christ in the Church now "Lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world." We have the promise of his constant indwelling: "Where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them." But still that is vicariously by his Spirit, but soon he is to be personally with us. That very man who once died upon Calvary is to live here. He that same Jesus who was taken up from us, shall come in like manner as he was taken up from the gazers of Galilee. Rejoice, rejoice, beloved, that he comes, actually and really comes; and this shall be the joy of that age, that he is among his saints, and dwelleth in them, with them, and talketh and walketh in their midst.
"If I read the word aright, and it is honest to admit that there is much room for difference of opinion here, the day will come, when the Lord Jesus will descend from heaven with a shout, with the trump of the archangel and the voice of God. Some think that this descent of the Lord will be Post-millennial that is, 'after the thousand years' of his reign. I CANNOT THINK SO. I conceive that the advent will be PRE-millennial that He will come first; and then will come the millennium as the result of his personal reign upon earth. But whether or no, this much is the fact, that Christ will suddenly come, come to reign, and come to judge the earth in righteousness." [from Justification & Glory MTP Vol 11, Year 1865, pg. 249, Romans 8:30 (age 31)]
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Is everyone soon to receive a bar code on his forehead and/or right hand in order to buy and sell goods? Is the government going to force people to have a computer chip inserted in their right hand for identification purposes? While these things are possible, they have absolutely nothing to do with the mark of the beast spoken of in Revelation.
In the Old Testament God spoke of total allegiance to Him and His law as a putting of the law on the forehead and on the hands: You shall bind them as a sign on your hand, and they shall be as frontlets between your eyes (Dt. 6:8).
In Revelation, those who are faithful to Christ, the ones who follow the Lamb wherever He goes (Rev. 14:4), are said to have His [the Lambs] Fathers name written on their foreheads (Rev. 14:1).
John also refers to it as a seal: Do not harm the earth, the sea, or the trees till we have sealed the servants of our God on their foreheads (Rev. 7:3).
The Lord tells the church at Sardis: He who overcomes, I will make him a pillar in the temple of My God, and he shall go out no more. And I will write on him the name of My God and the name of the city of My God, the New Jerusalem... (Rev. 3:12).
Even after the second coming John says, His name shall be on their foreheads (Rev. 22:4).
In the old covenant Aaron bore on his forehead the name of the Lord inscribed on the crown on the front of the priestly mitre. [Meredith G. Kline, Images of the Spirit, (Grand Rapids: Baker, 1980), p. 54.]
It is obvious that having the name of Christ (or God the Father, Rev. 14:1) on the forehead is not meant to be taken literally but is representative of allegiance to God, ownership by God, and even the presence of God the Holy Spirit.
Therefore, the mark of the beast should be viewed as the Satanic parody of the seal of God on the foreheads and hands of the righteous....
Israel has rejected Christ, and is marked with the seal of Romes total lordship; she has given her allegiance to Caesar, and is obedient to his rule and law. Israel chose to be saved by the pagan state, and persecuted those who sought salvation in Christ. [Chilton, p. 342]
The mark of the beast is a counterfeit of Gods seal on His people. Those who give their allegiance to Caesar and the Roman state have social respectability and the benefits that go with it (economic, political, religious, etc.).
The Roman state demanded total allegiance to Caesar; everyone was required to make an offering of incense unto Caesar as God. All who dwell on the earth will worship him [the beast], whose names have not been written in the Book of Life... (Rev. 13:8).
But Christians refused to worship the beast and thus were persecuted unto death and became economic and social outcasts. The mark of the beast reflects a wicked heart that worships and serves Caesar.
The imagery no doubt comes from the practice of branding slaves with the mark of their master. [Philip Edgecumbe Hughes, The Book of the Revelation, pp. 153-54.]
Christians are slaves of Christ; all others are slaves of Satan.
Revelation 13 focuses on the Roman empire and the beastNero Caesar.
Things look very bleak for the church in chapter 13, but in chapter 14 the prophet focuses his attention upon Christ and His people.
Those who persecute the church, who worship the beast, will receive their due:
If anyone worships the beast and his image, and receives his mark on his forehead or on his hand, he himself shall also drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out full strength into the cup of His indignation.
He shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels and in the presence of the Lamb. And the smoke of their torment ascends forever and ever (Rev. 14:9-11).
But Christians are blessed: Blessed are the dead who die in the Lord from now on. Yes, says the Spirit, that they may rest from their labors, and their works follow them (v. 13).
Although these words should comfort Christians of all ages, they were written specifically to comfort believers suffering the persecution of Nerothe Beast.
This truth is confirmed when the many time indicators within Revelation are considered.
John wrote, The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave Him to show His servants things which must shortly take place.... Blessed is he who reads...for the time is near.... The Lord God...sent His angel to show His servants the things which must shortly take place (Rev. 1:1-3; 22:6).
Five times Jesus Christ declared, I am coming quickly (2:16; 3:11; 22:7, 12, 20); He was referring to His coming to judge apostate Israel and their Roman accomplices in the persecution of the church (this judgment occurred in A.D. 67-70).
But He promised to spare a faithful first-century church from the coming conflagration: Because you have kept My command to persevere, I also will keep you from the hour of trial which shall come upon the whole world (3:10).
The purpose of the references to the millennium, the second coming, the final judgment and the eternal state is to give persecuted first-century Christians a glimpse of the churchs glorious future.
The significance of the book of Revelation to its first-century audience must no longer be ignored. ~~~ Brian Schwertley
ARE ALL AMILS SAVED AND ALL PREMILS LOST?
YES OR NO??
Try to edit your responses of unnecessary material before attempting to impress us with your insight. The evidence that you don't know what your talking about will still be available to readers, but they will be able to access it more rapidly.
Thank You.
BigMack
ARE ALL AMILS SAVED AND ALL PRE MILS LOST?
yes or no???
A greatly misunderstood figure from the Bible is the beast of Revelation. The beast, unlike the antichrist, is at least a real political leader. The problem with most modern interpretations seeking to identity the beast is that the many textual indicators given by John to identify the beast are ignored in favor of the futurist, revived Roman emperor idea.
In the book of Revelation the beast is identified as both an empire and as a leader of an empire.
The empire is without question the Roman empire of Johns own day.
In Revelation 13 John is standing on the sand of the sea and observing a beast rising up out of the sea. The beast has seven heads and ten horns, and on his horns ten crowns, and on his heads a blasphemous name. Now the beast which I saw was like a leopard, his feet were like the feet of a bear, and his mouth like the mouth of a lion. The dragon gave him his power, his throne, and great authority (Rev. 13:1-2).
John describes the very same animals alluded to by the prophet Daniel to describe three of the four great world empires: Babylon, Medo-Persia, and Greece (Dan. 7:1-6). The fourth empire, which has all the beast-like features of the other empires (only much worse), is none other than the Roman empire (Dan. 7:7).
In Revelation 17:12 John declares that the ten horns are ten kings; they are the leaders or governors of the ten imperial provinces.
In Revelation 17:9-10, John identifies the seven heads as both seven hills (a place) and seven kings (individuals). In the ancient world Rome was known as the city of seven mountains.
John, standing on the edge of the Mediterranean sea, looks in the direction of Rome and sees a beast coming out of the sea. Rome was a world empire that had authority over all peoples and nations (Rev. 13:7); that was the culmination of the four empires in Daniel, an empire that was satanic to the core (v. 2); and that existed on seven mountains (v. 9).
Following are some other features about the beast.
1. The beast was not only an empire but was also a man (Rev. 13:18).
John says that the beast had a blasphemous name on its heads (v. 1).
The Roman Caesars were worshiped as gods. Roman emperors were referred to as: Sebastos (one to be worshiped), divus (god) and even Deus and Theos (God). [David Chilton, The Days of Vengeance, An Exposition of the Book of Revelation (Fort Worth, TX: Dominion, 1987) p. 328]
Neros coins said Savior of the world, and Domitian was referred to as our Lord and our God.
John gives a number of specific indicators that identify the beast, all of which point not to someone over 2,000 years in the future, but to an emperor still living in Johns own day: Nero.
Revelation 17:10 says, There are also seven kings. Five have fallen, one is, and the other has not yet come. And when he comes, he must continue a short time.
John specifically says that the sixth king is presently ruling. Who is the sixth king? None other than Nero, the first great persecutor of Christians.
Following is a list of the Roman Caesars: 1. Julius (49-44 B.C.), 2. Augustus (31 B.C.-A.D. 14), 3. Tiberius (A.D. 14-37), 4. Gaius (Caligula, A.D. 37-41), 5. Claudius (A.D. 41-54), 6. Nero (A.D. 54-68), 7. Galba (A.D. 68).
John said that the sixth king was ruling when he wrote; this king would be followed by a seventh who would rule for only a short time (Rev. 17:10).
This was fulfilled to the letter: Nero was followed by Galba who ruled for only three months before he was assassinated.
2. John gives another identifier of the beast: a number.
Here is wisdom. Let him who has understanding calculate the number of the beast, for it is the number of a man: His number is 666 (Rev. 13:18).
Why does not John just say who the beast is? Why does he speak cryptically?
John was writing from Patmos where he was exiled by the Romans. The church was being persecuted systematically by the Roman state under Nero.
John identifies the Roman emperor but he does it in such a way so that he protects the church from reprisal if the letter is intercepted by the Roman authorities.
Almost every church in the Roman empire contained both Jews and Gentiles. The Jews living in Johns day used their alphabet for both sound symbols (phonetics) and numerical values. Each letter of the Hebrew alphabet had a numerical value.
A Hebrew spelling of Neros name found in documents contemporary with the writing of Revelation is Nrwn Qsr, which equals exactly 666.
[The number 666 in some ancient manuscripts of Scripture is actually changed to 616. The difference surely is no accident of sight made by an early copyist. The numbers 666 and 616 are not similar in appearance in the original Greekwhether spelled out in words or written out as numerals
Textual scholars agree: it must be intentional. Although we cannot be absolutely certain, a strong and most reasonable case may be made for the following conjecture.
John, a Jew, used a Hebrew spelling of Neros name in order to arrive at the figure 666. But when Revelation began circulating among those less acquainted with Hebrew, a well-meaning copyist who knew the meaning of 666 might have intended to make its deciphering easier by altering it to 616. It surely is no mere coincidence that 616 is the numerical value of Nero Caesar, when spelled in Hebrew by transliterating it from its more common Latin spelling (Gentry, pp. 376-77)] ~~~ Brian Schwertley
Brothers and sisters for many days now Pastor Woody has given us his version of the gospel He has made it clear that he and OP and Mat have the TRUE gospel. As He put it they preach the fullness of the gospel. As opposed to the incomplete false gospel we believe .
Now I attempted to point out to him that if he has the TRUE gospel the rest of the posters here, including Pastor friends of his are lost. As they and we all believe a false gospel. One can not be saved by a false gospel, there is only ONE gospel to salvation.
Now I have tried to get a firm YES or NO from Woody if believing that the AMIL is the one and only gospel if we (that would include his false gospel teaching pastor and church elders.) are lost
It is clear that he, in fact, does believe we are lost or he could have honestly answered that question (which was first asked in a non confront post).
Forget the scripture that says the Gospel is repent and believe only Woods gospel; is the TRUE
Eph 1:13 In whom ye also [trusted], after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,
Nero truly possessed a wicked, bestial nature. He was even referred to as a beast by his contemporaries. [The pagan writer Apollinius of Tyana, a contemporary of Nero, specifically mentions that Nero was called a beast (Gentry, pp. 376-77).
Nero may have acquired the nickname the beast from some of his perverse activities. Nero was a sadistic pervert who was hated and feared, even by the pagan Romans.]
Nero, who murdered numerous members of his own family (including his pregnant wife, whom he kicked to death); who was homosexual, the final stage in degeneracy (Rom. 1:24-32); whose favorite aphrodisiac consisted of watching people suffer the most horrifying and disgusting tortures; who dressed up as a wild beast in order to attack and rape male and female prisoners; who used the bodies of Christians burning at the stake as the original Roman candles to light up his filthy garden parties; who launched the first imperial persecution of Christians at the instigation of the Jews, in order to destroy the Church; this animalistic pervert was the ruler of the most powerful empire on earth. [Chilton, p. 329]
John said that the beast would make war upon Gods saints.
The Beast is said to make war with the saints and to overcome them (Rev. 13:7).
In fact, he is said to conduct such blasphemous warfare for a specific period of time: 42 months (Rev. 13:5).
The Neronic persecution, which was initiated by Nero in A.D. 64, was the first ever Roman assault on Christianity, as noted by Church fathers Eusebius, Tertullian, Paulus Orosius, and Sulpicius Severus, as well as by Roman historians Tacitus and Suetonius. [Gentry, pp. 377-78]
Neros assassination by the sword on June 8, A.D. 68, ended the bloody persecution of believers.
Note that Neros persecution of Christians lasted 42 months, exactly as prophesied by the Apostle John in Revelation 13:5. ~~~ Brian Schwertley
So I hope you will bear with me as I look back into history for a candidate for the Beast. I think a credible and compelling case can be made for an ancient political figure as the Beast of Revelation. I believe the Beast was none other than Lucius Domitius Ahenobarbus. Perhaps you know him better by his adoptive name: Nero Claudius Caesar. Let us consider the case for such an identity.
Good sound doctrinal company ya keep
So I hope you will bear with me as I look back into history for a candidate for the Beast. I think a credible and compelling case can be made for an ancient political figure as the Beast of Revelation. I believe the Beast was none other than Lucius Domitius Ahenobarbus. Perhaps you know him better by his adoptive name: Nero Claudius Caesar. Let us consider the case for such an identity.
LOL so much for calling Nate a heretic..you are kissin cousins
Although the antichrist is perhaps the most popular figure in the current prophecy scene, he is also the most misunderstood.
The problem is that premillennial authors focus their attention on Daniels little horn, Pauls man of sin, and the beast in Revelation, yet ignore the passages of Scripture which actually discuss antichrist.
There are only four passages of Scripture which expressly mention antichrist, all in the epistles of John (1 Jn. 2:18, 22; 4:3; 2 Jn. 7).
John corrects the false notion of antichrist that had arisen among Christians in his own day; he declares that antichrist is not something far off in the future but a present reality.
Second, he says that antichrist is not a single individual but a large group of people.
Third, he defines antichrist not as a person (a coming world leader) but as a current movement: Little children, it is the last hour; and as you have heard that the Antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have come, by which we know that it is the last hour (1 Jn. 2:18).
Many Christians in Johns day had heard that antichrist (singular) was coming. John responded by saying that even now many antichrists (plural) had arisen. The verb have arisen or have come (gegonasin) indicates that these antichrists arose in the past and were still present.
The presence of these antichrists proves that it is (present tense) the last hour (2:18).
Thus it is evident that John (who wrote the book of Revelation) rejected the idea of a future, singular antichrist; instead, he warned Christians of a heretical movement (or movements).
There are many antichrists. For many deceivers have gone out into the world who do not confess Jesus Christ as coming in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist (2 Jn. 7). Who is a liar but he who denies that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist who denies the Father and the Son (1 Jn. 2:22). These antichrists who have arisen, says John, belonged to us, but they were not of us.
In other words, they took up the Christian position, they claimed they were Christian, they professed to be teachers of the Christian Church, and yet they have been separated from the Christians in order that it would be clear to all that they were not of them.
In other words, they claimed to delight in the true religion and yet they destroyed it. [Martyn Lloyd-Jones, Walking with God: Studies in I John (Wheaton, IL: Crossway, 1993), p. 100.]
John focused the attention of his readers upon one, or perhaps two, heretical movements.
The first, probably Gnostic in origin, denied the real humanity of Jesus Christ (2 Jn. 7).
The second, probably Jewish in origin, denied that Jesus was the Messiah (1 Jn. 2:22).
John clearly applies the conception of the one antichrist (ho antichristos) to the generic tendency to promote lies about the identity of Christ. [Kenneth L. Gentry, Jr., He Shall Have Dominion (Tyler, TX: Institute for Christian Economics, 1992), p. 373]
Every spirit that does not confess that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is not of God. And this is the spirit of the antichrist, which you have heard was coming, and is now already in the world (1 Jn. 4:3).
Antichrist is not an individual, malevolent ruler looming in our future. Rather, Antichrist was a contemporary heretical tendency regarding the person of Christ that was current among many in Johns day. [Gentry, p. 374] ~~~ Brian Schwertley
Not true
The rest of what? Context says.....vs 19..."kings of earth and their ARMIES." Having been a member of the US Army for 20 years, let me assure you that everyone in the US was not a member. You might recall for yourself that you are not presently a member. Or, if you are, you might know a few folks who are not.
If you killed the entire approximately 3 million man military of the the US, you would have roughly 277 million US citizens left. Hmmmmmmmmmmmm.....guess He will have someone to rule with a rod of iron.
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