WM .. How can matter be uncreated?
If one believes in evolution one has assumptions that there was some matter that pre existed the life form we now know
Is there any biblical passages that indicate a pre existant form for men? What is the original source for the LDS belief in that ?
Could there have been a "super God" (only words I can think of) that prexisted God and that created the intelligences..He could be the Father God of the Father???
I also have an interest in the LDS defination of "angels" one time I think Sharon and I started to talk about it and I got side tracked..Is that related in your mind to the intelligences?
Thanks for a good "off the path "discussion
Lots. Consider how these passages have new meaning when you look at them in this way, when you understand that they refer to our life with God, as His children, in heaven, before we were born here.
Num. 16: 22
22 And they fell upon their faces, and said, O God, the God of the spirits of all flesh, shall one man sin, and wilt thou be wroth with all the congregation?
Just to be sure you don't miss it:
Num. 27: 16
16 Let the LORD, the God of the spirits of all flesh, set a man over the congregation,
This refers to the joy we felt when we learned (at a gathering we call the Council in Heaven) that the time had come for God to create this earth and place us here, and for us to receive a physical body, to experience opposition in all things, to learn and grow in ways unique to this mortal condition.
The LORD was asking Job a series of "where were you when" questions, and if Job knew the right answers, he would have said that he was there, present and accounted for, and among those shouting for joy!
Job 38:7
7 When the morning stars sang together, and all the sons of God shouted for joy?
This refers to the death of the physical body:
Eccl. 12: 7
7 Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it.
Here is foreordination. Jeremiah was there also, and he was chosen in that great Council in Heaven to be a prophet here in mortality. He was known, sanctified, and (fore)ordained before he was born.
Jer. 1: 5
5 Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations.
Zech. 12: 1
1 THE burden of the word of the LORD for Israel, saith the LORD, which stretcheth forth the heavens, and layeth the foundation of the earth, and formeth the spirit of man within him.
The disciples thought that our infirmities in this life might be the result of some transgression in pre-earth life, but Jesus said it was not so, it was in preparation for one of His miracles. Infirmities are thorns in our side to struggle with and learn from. By experiencing illness, infirmity, and handicap, we appreciate health and healing all the more.
John 9: 2
2 And his disciples asked him, saying, Master, who did sin, this man, or his parents, that he was born blind?
Acts 17: 28
28 For in him we live, and move, and have our being; as certain also of your own poets have said, For we are also his offspring.
Jesus is the Firstborn of the spirit children of God.
Rom. 8: 29
29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
God chose us before the world was to be members of Christ's Church in mortality, if we would heed the call, not just in His mind (because He knew how He would later create us out of nothing), but because we lived with Him and He knew us inside and out and He told us we were chosen.
Eph. 1: 4
4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:
Heb. 12: 9
9 Furthermore we have had fathers of our flesh which corrected us, and we gave them reverence: shall we not much rather be in subjection unto the Father of spirits, and live?
This refers to the rebellion led by Lucifer after the Council in Heaven which is called the War in Heaven in the Book of Revelation.
Jude 1: 6
6 And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day.
Rev. 12: 7
7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,
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