Does God force you to believe or can you resist? Irresistible Grace -- Not a Bible Teaching.

http://www.zianet.com/maxey/Tulip6.htm ^ | Al Maxey

[P-Marlowe]

Is God glorified in a lie?

Is that the best answer you can come up with? What is the lie? Is it the lie of eden stuff again? Well if it is, then Arminianism is of the Devil and those who adhere to it are not christians are they? So how do you explain the fact that God allows people to come to salvation at the preaching of "a lie?"

So, I will ask it until I get an answer.

Since you believe that Arminians can preach people to salvation and that most Calvinists were saved as Arminians and that "it does not matter one bit if you were saved as an Arminian or a Calvinist.." Please. Please. Please. IN YOUR OWN WORDS, Please tell me:

Which purpose of God is being accomplished by all of this bickering?

[xzins]

I'm puzzled. What bothers you about that post? I thought it was rather friendly toward you. Testimony again to how difficult communication is.

[RnMomof7]

I guess my having said any number of times that I believe in total depravity isn't allowed to be entered into evidence, is it?

Consistancy counts here xzins..close only counts in horseshoes

Earlier you said this

I believe one isn't guilty of sin until one commits sin....which is inevitable due to the sin nature. You believe the "depravity" automatically makes them guilty of sin even before they ever commit sin. (Correct me if I'm wrong about that.)

That is no a defination of total depravity..and in fact does sound closer to Hank than to me or Steve or Wesley

So your post starts off in a misleading way.....you do not believe in total depravity ...so why did you say that ?

[xzins]

The Rodney King School of Theologys school cheer.... " Rha Rha ping poo pa..if it feels good do it"

This has baffled me for about a week now since you started the Rodney King thing. I don't get it.

Wasn't he the guy that got beat up on videotape for resisting arrest? What does that have to do with theology. (PS: Honest question. I really don't get it.)

[RnMomof7]

I'm puzzled. What bothers you about that post? I thought it was rather friendly toward you.

You are only allowed to hit me ..cause I am not nice:>)

Steve is the nice calvinist.....

[xzins]

I believe one isn't guilty of sin until one commits sin....which is inevitable due to the sin nature.

That line is a fair summation of what Wesley believed. What part of it is contrary to total depravity as taught by Wesley?

[SorenK]

So, my listener, turn your attention now to the occasion, while consciousness of sin sharpens the need until it becomes the one thing necessary; while the earnestness of this holy place strengthens the will in holy determination, while the all-knowing One's presence makes self-deception impossible, consider your own life!... By vigorously pondering the occasion you will stand before a higher judge, where no man dares judge another since he himself is one of the accused.

[RnMomof7]

His favorite saying was "Can't we all get along"..I do not remember if that came before or after the Big law suit

[zadok]

Rodney King theology : "Can't we all just get along???"

[zadok]

Sorry Mom, I didn't see your post...

[xzins]

Good words, Soren. Who wrote them?

[RnMomof7]

I believe one isn't guilty of sin until one commits sin....which is inevitable due to the sin nature.

It just dawned on me..you at least are consistant..man has no sin till he chooses to sin and there is no atonment untill man choses an atonement..it is all about man

[RnMomof7]

morning..can't we all get along? :>)

[xzins]

Oh. I didn't know that.

His behavior (arrests, fighting, drugs/alcohol) doesn't make him a very good spokesperson for those words, does it?

[RnMomof7]

Welcome to Free Republic...and to religious debate American style (BTW xzins and I are friends..we just make each other nuts)

[SorenK]

Good words, Soren. Who wrote them?

If you allow your mind to flee from the busyness of posting it will come to you.

[RnMomof7]

It became a 'camp' saying at the time..and the fact it is not consistant with his character makes it more interesting

He came to my mind on that Luthern debate....it dawned on me that he is a metaphor for the new age religion..the doctrines of demons..

[xzins]

I believe one isn't guilty of sin until one commits sin....which is inevitable due to the sin nature.

It just dawned on me..you at least are consistant..man has no sin till he chooses to sin

Is it a reading comprehension problem; is it dyslexia; is it misrepresentation? Read it again, Rn. Your summary of my words would get an "F" in a reading comprehension course.

[drstevej]

***Who knows. Many of your brethren who are hardshell consider me an unbeliever. For all I know, you do to. In that case, I guess Hank and I will just be cast out together outside the camp.***

1- Many of your brethren consider me an unbeliever. WHAT DOES THEIR ASSESSMENT HAVE TO DO WITH ME?

2- For all I know, you do too. HAVE I SAID SO? IF YOU WONDER THIS ASK ME DIRECTLY.

3- I guess Hank and I will just be cast out together outside the camp. THIS NOW ASSUMES THAT I DO CONSIDER BOTH YOU AND HANK AS NON-BELIEVERS.

---

Xzins, my post was to Hank -- not you. You join in and conclude that I view you and Hank as non-Christians -- an irrational conclusion and faulty mindreading. Repeatedly I have mentioned that you try to read my mind and then tell me what I think and why what you think I think is wrong. I find this tedious and yes puerile.

[SorenK]

Thank you Mom of 7.

In eternity there are chambers enough so that ezch may be placed alone in one. For wherever conscience is present, and it is and shall be present in each person, there exists in eternity a lonely prison, or the blessed chamber of salvation. On that account this consciousness of being an individual is the primary consciouness in a man, which is his eternal consciousness. But that man is slow to pass judgement who bears in mind, that he is an individual, and that the final and highest responsibility for the judgement rests solely upon him.