Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article

To: patent; narses
patent, I am reluctant to get in the middle of this discussion, however I think you are being slightly unfair to narses.

It makes it highly likely that, on a news forum, it was discussed within the period of the last several years. This is not news...

One, this was posted in the Religion forum, er, ghetto. Two, there are many philosophical, cultural and scientific discussions on FR (from before the News/Religion split) that aren't exactly newsworthy (nor directly related to rooting out corruption or the Constitution) and Jim Robinson has deemed them OK to remain.

...a 1996 article complaining about Communion in the hand...

From the thread, Eucharistic Ministers, SMEDLEYBUTLER posted the following list of citations (emphasis mine):

St. Sixtus I (circa 115)
"The Sacred Vessels are not to be handled by others than those consecrated to the Lord."

Pope St. Eutychian (275-283)
Forbade the faithful from taking the Sacred Host in their hand.

St. Basil the Great, Doctor of the Church (330-379)
"The right to receive Holy Communion in the hand is permitted only in times of persecution." St. Basil the Great considered Communion in the hand so irregular that he did not hesitate to consider it a grave fault.

The Council of Saragossa (380)
Excommunicated anyone who dared continue receiving Holy Communion by hand. This was confirmed by the Synod of Toledo.

Pope St. Leo the Great (440-461)
Energetically defended and required faithful obedience to the practice of administering Holy Communion on the tongue of the faithful.

The Synod of Rouen (650)
Condemned Communion in the hand to halt widespread abuses that occurred from this practice, and as a safeguard against sacrilege.

The Sixth Ecumenical Council, at Constantinople (680-681)
Forbade the faithful to take the Sacred Host in their hand, threatening transgressors with excommunication.

St. Thomas Aquinas (1225-1274),
"Out of reverence towards this sacrament [the Holy Eucharist], nothing touches it, but what is consecrated; hence the corporal and the chalice are consecrated, and likewise the priest's hands, for touching this sacrament." (Summa Theologica, Part III, Q. 82, Art. 3, Rep. Obj. 8)

The Council of Trent (1545-1565)
"The fact that only the priest gives Holy Communion with his consecrated hands is an Apostolic Tradition."

Pope Paul VI (1963-1978)
"This method [on the tongue] must be retained." (Memoriale Domini)

Pope John Paul II
To touch the sacred species and to distribute them with their own hands is a privilege of the ordained. (Dominicae Cenae, 11)

"It is not permitted that the faithful should themselves pick up the consecrated bread and the sacred chalice, still less that they should hand them from one to another." (Inaestimabile Donum, April 17, 1980, sec. 9)

Are you saying that St. Thomas Aquinas and the dogmatic Council of Trent are schismatic? I don't think that is exactly what you meant. The Modernists are and have been using the obedience of faithful Catholics against them in order to achieve their diabolical goal. The good news is the Modernists won't prevail, but it is quite a struggle to fight against their insidious ideas. Modernism is the synthesis of all heresies.
29 posted on 07/09/2002 7:29:37 AM PDT by ELS
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 16 | View Replies ]


To: ELS
One, this was posted in the Religion forum, er, ghetto.
This, of course, was not my criticism.
Two, there are many philosophical, cultural and scientific discussions on FR (from before the News/Religion split) that aren't exactly newsworthy (nor directly related to rooting out corruption or the Constitution) and Jim Robinson has deemed them OK to remain.
Nor was this.
Are you saying that St. Thomas Aquinas and the dogmatic Council of Trent are schismatic? I don't think that is exactly what you meant.
Then why, ELS, do you suggest something so absurd? Can you explain to me what I have said that leads you to question whether I am calling an Ecumenical Council schismatic? Please quote me.

I think you have entirely missed my point, which is that Narses had appeared to me to be engaged in a pattern, not that he was schismatic for posting any one article or for saying we should receive on the tongue.

Dominus Vobiscum

patent  +AMDG

31 posted on 07/09/2002 7:43:06 AM PDT by patent
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 29 | View Replies ]

To: ELS; patent
Thank you. I didn't understand patents post to be dissenting from tradition or dogma. I read it as an assault on my honesty and motives. Perhaps I misread him, perhaps you did, but I appreciate your words. Thank you.

BTW, my motives here are to learn and discuss the Faith, not to attack other people here. I regret if my posts are being read as attacks, they are surely not intended as such.
43 posted on 07/09/2002 9:00:52 AM PDT by narses
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 29 | View Replies ]

To: ELS
St. Basil the Great, Doctor of the Church (330-379) "The right to receive Holy Communion in the hand is permitted only in times of persecution."

Many would say we are under persecution. I recall Fr. Hardon writing much about the Church and the Domestic Church being under attack.
52 posted on 07/09/2002 10:47:22 AM PDT by Domestic Church
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 29 | View Replies ]

Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article


FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson