This sounds like the Kingfish of Amos and Andy fame...
'Oh Yeah, He infuses some salutary cogitations allowin' the guy to cogitate and then salute!'
I think taht is also called a "green light"
Posted on 06/28/2002 5:31:19 PM PDT by fortheDeclaration
IV. THE GRACE OF GOD
In reference to Divine Grace, I believe, 1. It is a gratuitous affection by which God is kindly affected towards a miserable sinner, and according to which he, in the first place, gives his Son, "that whosoever believers in him might have eternal life," and, afterwards, he justifies him in Christ Jesus and for his sake, and adopts him into the right of sons, unto salvation. 2. It is an infusion (both into the human understanding and into the will and affections,) of all those gifts of the Holy Spirit which appertain to the regeneration and renewing of man -- such as faith, hope, charity, &c.; for, without these gracious gifts, man is not sufficient to think, will, or do any thing that is good. 3. It is that perpetual assistance and continued aid of the Holy Spirit, according to which He acts upon and excites to good the man who has been already renewed, by infusing into him salutary cogitations, and by inspiring him with good desires, that he may thus actually will whatever is good; and according to which God may then will and work together with man, that man may perform whatever he wills.
In this manner, I ascribe to grace the commencement, the continuance and the consummation of all good, and to such an extent do I carry its influence, that a man, though already regenerate, can neither conceive, will, nor do any good at all, nor resist any evil temptation, without this preventing and exciting, this following and co-operating grace. From this statement it will clearly appear, that I by no means do injustice to grace, by attributing, as it is reported of me, too much to man's free-will. For the whole controversy reduces itself to the solution of this question, "is the grace of God a certain irresistible force?" That is, the controversy does not relate to those actions or operations which may be ascribed to grace, (for I acknowledge and inculcate as many of these actions or operations as any man ever did,) but it relates solely to the mode of operation, whether it be irresistible or not. With respect to which, I believe, according to the scriptures, that many persons resist the Holy Spirit and reject the grace that is offered.
This sounds like the Kingfish of Amos and Andy fame...
'Oh Yeah, He infuses some salutary cogitations allowin' the guy to cogitate and then salute!'
If grace CAN be resisted, then it also can be cooperated with.
If grace CANNOT be resisted, then anything that follows CANNOT possibly be a work.
Amen!
And you said I was being puerile!
It is that perpetual assistance and continued aid of the Holy Spirit, according to which He acts upon and excites to good the man who has been already renewed, by infusing into him salutary cogitations, and by inspiring him with good desires, that he may thus actually will whatever is good; and according to which God may then will and work together with man, that man may perform whatever he wills.I see nothing in the statement that a Calvinist would object to! Salutary cogitations would refer to the renewing of the mind (Rom.12:2)
It is certainly a better phrase then Ignorance is learning
Pardon me, sir. Aren't you the same gentleman whose feelings were so terribly assaulted by my references to "Little Johnny's construct"? Perhaps I am mistaken, but I thought you were the one whose tender feelings toward the embittered determinist of Geneva were thus so deeply wounded? Tell me, sir, are you not the one?
[Available response: "I don't even understand what you're talking about." (Mark 14:68)]
The tortured logic we have inherited from those sharing the responsibility for the confusion within Christianity for two thousand years. If God offered salvation to only those who could interpret this mans ramblings scarcely would anyone be saved.
You want to read some ramblings read Calvin trying to explain how God is willing everything, but still not the author of sin! LOL!
No, we do not look to the theologians to see how we may be saved, we look to the Scriptures,
Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and thou shalt be saved (Acts.16:31)Is that simple enough for you?
Just one question I've been meaning to ask, does the phrase "believe on" rather than "believe in" have any noted significance? Thank you and God bless.
I don't incessantly quote Arminius (or Kingfish for that matter) as your coreligionists incessantly quote Calvin as though he were something more than a mere man who had some ideas -- some of which were valid and some wholly erroneous. As soon as your co-religionists quit quoting his silly doctrines, I will surely and quickly quit my references to Little Johnny Calvin and his Construct Five. Calvin has heaped more harm on Christianity than most any ten popes you could name (or at least that I could name, since I don't know ten). Anything I can do to undermine that harm, I will gladly so to do.
Remember, vmatt, we only know this man because of his prodigious efforts to refute the foolish dogmas of Little Johnny Calvin, which have introduced incalculable harm to Gospel of Jesus Christ. I dare say if tomorrow the determinists ceased pushing their vicious little construct, we would not hear from Arminius again. He is merely an effective antidote to a virulent poison afloat in Christianity.
I think taht is also called a "green light"
The issue clearly stated :
Does man will trump God's grace? If it does who is god?
If mans will trumps grace and he must activate his will in order for Gods grace to be effective then mans decision is a work of man...thus salvation is all of man!
Remember that Little Johnny Wesley was a foil for Rome and worked against the reformation..If was up to Little Johnny Wesley we would all be going to mass on sundays and bowing to the King of England on the way by
It was actually your little Johnney that fought the teachings of the refornmation....which is why you anti reformation guys have no part of the name Protestant..
Or read the ramblings of all the "Open Theology" Arminians who think God has no power..he makes nothing, he knows nothing he is a hapless victim of mans will and his temper . He is a fickle god and changes his mind when he has a temper tantrum..
dec you have a problem underststanding how God can turn mans heart over to it's desires which are always evil..
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Xzins version:
John 5:21 For just as the Father raises the dead and gives them life, even so the Son gives life to whom he is obligated to give it cause they said yes while in the neutral zone.
Neutral Zone? What translation can I find that passage in Capt Kirk?
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