Posted on 01/03/2002 11:19:13 AM PST by ArGee
Thanks.
Philip Yancy wrote a book called Where is G-d When It Hurts. He was driven to write the book because a friend had just told him about an experience. The friend had prayed all night for G-d to reveal himself or the friend would become an atheist. G-d didn't reveal himself and the friend declared a profound lack of faith in G-d based on G-d not coming through. Obviously this shook Yancy up. Why would G-d not honor such a request?
The book is good and long, but there is one important point that I will share. Immediately after G-d parted the Red Sea for the Israelites, they cast a golden calf to worship. In other words, the big "fireworks" display of awesome power didn't create any faith in the people. What more marvelous proof of G-d's existence could they ask for? Yet, even with the memory of walking through the Red Sea dry shod, while Pharoah and his army were destroyed, they couldn't wait to go back to worshipping the way they were used to in Egypt. Profound miracles don't create faith.
If slapper were to ask me, I would say that maybe G-d is showing Himself, but slapper is looking in the wrong place. For me, G-d has never showed Himself to me more clearly than when I was reading His Word. I have had a some experiences where I would claim that G-d spoke to me, but all of the most profound have come while reading the Bible. It's as if G-d said to me in the first place, "Why are you looking anywhere else? There is a complete revelation in those 66 books and you've had them available to you all your life. Start there."
Of course, someone will say, "I don't believe the Bible is G-d's Word." I will answer, "You asked me how G-d revealed Himself to me. I gave you my answer. I won't be so arrogant as to claim that my way is the only way. But it is one way. Read your Bible and search for G-d there." When I was searching for G-d, I would listen to what anyone said about how to find Him. I dumped my pre-conditions and simply searched until I was successful. It's kind of like looking for a job. You don't just answer one ad and then go on welfare for the rest of your life if they don't hire you. You look until you find. Most of the people who tell me they have searched for G-d have really only tried one approach - the one you suggested about, "G-d, if you're there, knock over that tin can." Jesus told a parable of a man who found a treasure in a field. He told a parable of a man who found a wonderful pearl. The implication is pretty clear. This is a treasure. Do you approach finding G-d like filling out a lottery ticket and hoping you will win? Or do you approach finding G-d like trying to achieve all of your career goals? Are you searching for G-d or just playing games?
Those are my thoughts.
Shalom.
All of us know we are but flesh, and the flesh and spirit worlds war constantly - the flesh trying to understand the spirit. To seek God (who is of the spirit realm) in relative terms of our physical senses won't bring us to a knowledge of Him, neither will a superficially intended search reveal His character. Jesus said those who would worship the Father would do so in the spirit and they that do worship Him have the right to be known as "Sons of God". All I know and can testify to is that God requires us to love Him above all else, and love others as ourself - then He will do just as He has promised and manifest Himself to His children....
Brothers in Christ,
Az
Sorry, but none of this rhetoric has anything to do with independently verifiable evidence of this alleged god of yours.
The very fact that this is such a flawed and imperfect system is what reassures me that it is all created by man, just like Tolkien's world. In other words, there'll be no one to tell anything to. When we die, we are dead. That's it.
Would you be impressed by a man who says
"You don't HAVE to love me, my dear, it's entirely up to you! Of course, if you don't, I'll kill you..."
That would blow my mind. But, fortunately for my poor mind, they are an order of magnitude longer than we. I doubt we will catch up.
Thanks for dropping by.
Shalom.
Well, I'm a guy so i'd probably be a bit shocked about the dear part. ;-)
What's the difference between some random man's plan and the plan of our Creator?
Cheers, Slapper. :-)
I have read every post on this thread and I would like to thank you for the time and obviously heartfelt effort you have put into it.
While I am not yet ready to "Come to the Table" to borrow your oft-repeated phrase, I now know what my beliefs are at the current time (I was always confused before), and I know that I will be able to advance them in the future if the opportunity comes to pass. Thanks for your help (and to others who have made useful comments on this thread).
Cheers, Slapper. :-)
No matter how you slice it, it's coercion.
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