Posted on 06/15/2025 2:44:44 PM PDT by metmom
Join us for a special update.
This is a discussion about the current situation in the Middle East and the war between Israel and Iran.
Video is 1:37:59 minutes long. The sermon starts at the 24:57 minute mark.
This is a Biblical look at what's happening in the world today.
Ping to Excellent message dealing with todays events in the Middle East and looking at Ezekiel 38.
Yes, they’re long messages but very interesting in how he pulls it all together.
These links go to the first two services and the messages are not identical. They contain the same basic information but give different details.
Sunday 1st Service - Could This Be Next (Ezekiel 38)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c6Rsnkj4Dog
Service total here is 1:34:24 and the message begins at the 22:55 minute mark.
Sunday 2nd Service - Could This Be Next (Ezekiel 38)
https://www.youtube.com/live/Iy7ZwIg6g98
Service total is 1:38:04 and the sermon/message starts at the 24:18 minute mark.
Time will certainly tell - keep looking up! as FES0844 says!
Bkmk
From a certain perspective. Most Christians do not ascribe to a Dispensationalist view of eschatology. Not arguing, metmom: just gently clarifying for outsiders who might get the impression that all Christians share these views about the End Times.
I realize there are those who disagree, and this is not a caucus thread, it’s open, so I expect some feedback from those who don’t.
However, the passage in Ezekiel 38 and the few others he mentions are hard to explain away when it lists the exact players we are seeing lining up with each other.
I grew up as a pre-tribulation dispensationalist, but I no longer hold to that view after studying the Scripture and listening to wise counsel. That said, I still believe there is a special place in God’s heart for the Jews, and I am committed to supporting Israel.
I don't know if you remember, but the prophecy preachers in the 1980's were interpreting Ezekiel 38 with completely different players. And in the 1970's, prophecy preachers (sometimes the same ones) were interpreting Ezekiel 38 with still yet other players. And you would no doubt seeing the same pattern going back to the early days of the Adventist movement when pre-millennial dispensationalism originated in the 1830's or so. When handling prophecy in this manner, it is always a moving target until one of these days (or years, or decades, or centuries) we will, in fact, have the Second Coming upon us "like a thief in the night" with "no man knowing the day or the hour." Our Lord, you remember, told us, "It is not for you to know the times and the seasons which the Father has fixed by his own authority" because "of that day or that hour no one knows, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father." That's why believers should ALWAYS be ready.
——>Most Christians do not ascribe to a Dispensationalist view of eschatology.
Those who do should thank the Catholic church/Jesuits, because they were the ones that dreamed it up to cover their true identity as the Little Horn/Antichrist power.
I tried unsuccessfully yesterday to post it as I'm having major problems with my computer.
Hoping I wasn't hacked...sigh.
I was at the first service yesterday and I can tell you it is one of the best and clearest messages of where we are at right now in the Biblical timetable.
I trust MANY here on FR will take the time to listen!!
You won't regret the time involved.
I don't know any Christian who thinks otherwise.
I don't know why so many people preach against non-existent beliefs that nobody here is advocating.
And JESUS gave us the signs of the end of the age overall, but specified that nobody knows the specifics.
This message never claimed or alluded to specifics. It's just looking at the overall pictures and the players are they are lining up, all predicted in Scripture thousands of years ago.
It's NOT coincidental.
BTW, did you even watch the message?
Or are you just criticizing without hearing what he had to say?
Actually, it was one Jesuit theologian in the 1700's who had an idea similar to it, but his theory was quickly condemned and no one beyond scholarly and ecclesiastical circles took much notice of it. The "Catholic Church" had nothing to do with it.
I didn't say there was.
"I don't know why so many people preach against non-existent beliefs that nobody here is advocating."
My reply was not "preaching against non-existent beliefs that nobody here is advocating". I was simply offering a clarification to non-Christians that there is more than one view about the End Times than the one most commonly heard, mostly in the United States. Is it wrong to to let people know that?
And JESUS gave us the signs of the end of the age overall, but specified that nobody knows the specifics.
He gave them to us so we would know about them, not be surprised or frightened when they come, and always be ready for them. True Christians will know them when they see them. It makes no sense that God would put into Scripture substantial accounts of the End Times that were basically useless to 2000+ years of Christianity and just meant for Christians in 2025. In fact, it seems it be very misleading and cruel on God's part to give them Scripture that would be none of their business. What would a 12th century Christian think about it?
"This message never claimed or alluded to specifics."
I never said it did, although it was quite common to do so until the 1980's, but Dispensationalists got burned and discredited so many times, they are now more cautious about it.
It's just looking at the overall pictures and the players are they are lining up, all predicted in Scripture thousands of years ago.
Which is apropos to my point above.
"It's NOT coincidental
Nothing in Scripture is coincidental. But there can be a differing of interpretation of it, which was my entire point.
As it is coming from a Dispensational premise, which I don't accept, it wasn't necessary to. I have researched this deeply for many years or I wouldn't presume to comment on it. On the other hand, I've run into no Dispensationalist who are even aware of other End Times theology, even from their fellow Protestants. There's some really good stuff there, for example, from this Protestant guy:
DiscipleDojo - Why is Revelation so weird and scary?? (Understanding the book of Revelation)
Disciple DOJO??????
Seriously?
And he uses lots of rationalization for why things should mean what he wants them to, and not much Scripture to tie things together and a real focus on the figurative interpretation of Scripture.
There’s no reason to not take it literally when Ezekiel says there will be a coalition of nations that includes Russia, Iran, and Turkey and that’s EXACTLY what we’re seeing play out in the news today.
Yes, I believe that's what I typed.
"Seriously?"
Are we in junior high school now?
"And he uses lots of rationalization for why things should mean what he wants them to, and not much Scripture to tie things together and a real focus on the figurative interpretation of Scripture.
You must not have watched him, because he uses a TON of Scripture in his videos, even putting up the Hebrew and Greek on the screen so the viewer can see for themselves.
"There’s no reason to not take it literally when Ezekiel says there will be a coalition of nations that includes Russia, Iran, and Turkey and that’s EXACTLY what we’re seeing play out in the news today.
Dispensationalists do the same thing you are accusing DiscipleDojo from doing. After starting with the (faulty) premise that the dispensational theology is the correct one. Then they plug in the names of modern countries and events in the news and try to tie them to places (or powers that are represented as places) in the Scripture, and it's different for every generation of dispensationalists that put their hand to it. That's a huge amount of rationalization depending on faulty preconceived notions that the average Christian would not pick up if they were to read it on their own. Which is why no Christians ascribed to this for 2000 years.
No, they don’t plug in a few names of modern countries.
They trace their history and identify them as the countries mentions in Scripture.
I did watch some of him and there’s still a lot of rationalizations even if he uses Hebrew and Greek.
You can’t prove that dispensationalist theology is faulty. And again, no reason to not take something literally when the literal explanation makes sense.
The only reason to take something figuratively is to explain away the results you don’t want it to mean.
The question is “How is this time different from 50 years ago?” As best I can tell, these same parties have been after each other for decades if not centuries.
Maybe it’s a sign that nothing really changes.
As I said, previous dispensationalists have confidently done the same, except they used different countries which were prominent in the news of their time. Every time someone starts a kerfuffle in that area, someone in the 1800's or 1900's or 2000's say, "Yup, we're close, very close. Any day now! The signs are all there!"
"You can’t prove that dispensationalist theology is faulty."
Dispensationalist theology has proven itself faulty by it's continually failed predictions and, more recently, changing as the world map and current events change. If this theological methodology were sound, it would be sound for all Christians since the inception of Christianity.
"And again, no reason to not take something literally when the literal explanation makes sense.The only reason to take something figuratively is to explain away the results you don’t want it to mean.
I could say the same thing about some Protestant interpretations. As one example Christ's and Paul's words in Scripture about the Eucharist being the Body of Christ. Protestants do not take them as their literal meaning but, since they don't accept it, have to "spiritualize" and take it in a figurative way.
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