JESUS MEANT WHAT HE SAID

Catholic Answers Magazine ^ | October 2022 | KARLO BROUSSARD

[Elsie]

There ya go again:

JESUS MEANT WHAT HE SAID

Except when He didn't: call no man father.

[Elsie]

Well I have been taught it is supernatural and spiritual.

I was 'taught' nothing; but I have read where the CONTEXT of the statements Jesus made were during a PASSOVER meal.

The EUCHARIST is NOTHING like that!

[Mark17]

The claim that the bread and wine become the literal flesh and blood of Jesus fails on many, many levels.

Many levels? Maybe it fails on ALL levels.

[Elsie]

The only thing I’m seeing is screaming and Protestant tradition.

Them darn trees get in my way when I look for the forest as well.

There are other things I'M seeing: Catholic arrogance and boasting of superiority.

[Elsie]

St. Paul speaks of people getting sick and dying for failure to discern the true presence.

Golly, Tex; I've missed that part.

The closest I come come to reading something a bit similar is:

1 Corinthians 11:29 DRA

For he that eateth and drinketh unworthily, eateth and drinketh judgment to himself, not discerning the body of the Lord.

[Elsie]

Mormons leave out the wine and substitute H²O instead.

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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sacrament_(LDS_Church)

[Elsie]

...and there are at least four heads of John the Baptist stored away in Catholic churches.

https://www.nationalgeographic.com/premium/article/john-the-baptist-four-heads-relics

[Elsie]

Perhaps they were not fully catechized early in life or have been misled by the world.

Or have a functional, logical brain in their head.

[Elsie]

We should be willing to seek God’s Truth, not our truth!

God's truth and Rome's 'truth' tend to be a wee bit different in places.

[wardaddy]

I also think god meant what he said

As in don’t deny me

I grew up keenly aware the ramifications of defying god

It helps keep ya from straying too far off the res

[Elsie]

Everyone has the choice to believe Jesus or to follow man’s words of interpretation.

 16.  "Woe to you, blind guides! You say, `If anyone swears by the temple, it means nothing; but if anyone swears by the gold of the temple, he is bound by his oath.'
  17.  You blind fools! Which is greater: the gold, or the temple that makes the gold sacred?
  19.  You blind men! Which is greater: the gift, or the altar that makes the gift sacred?
  24.  You blind guides! You strain out a gnat but swallow a camel.
  26.  Blind Pharisee! First clean the inside of the cup and dish, and then the outside also will be clean.
  33.  "You snakes! You brood of vipers! How will you escape being condemned to hell?

 

 

Hiss!

[Elsie]

I follow the teachings of the Catholic Faith...

And cling to the Catechism for the CORRECT teaching - right?

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PART ONE
THE PROFESSION OF FAITH

 

SECTION TWO
THE PROFESSION OF THE CHRISTIAN FAITH

 

CHAPTER TWO
I BELIEVE IN JESUS CHRIST, THE ONLY SON OF GOD

 

The Good News: God has sent his Son

422 'But when the time had fully come, God sent forth his Son, born of a woman, born under the law, to redeem those who were under the law, so that we might receive adoption as sons.'¹ This is 'the gospel of Jesus Christ, the Son of God':'² God has visited his people. He has fulfilled the promise he made to Abraham and his descendants. He acted far beyond all expectation - he has sent his own 'beloved Son'.³

423 We believe and confess that Jesus of Nazareth, born a Jew of a daughter of Israel at Bethlehem at the time of King Herod the Great and the emperor Caesar Augustus, a carpenter by trade, who died crucified in Jerusalem under the procurator Pontius Pilate during the reign of the emperor Tiberius, is the eternal Son of God made man. He 'came from God',⁴ 'descended from heaven',⁵ and 'came in the flesh'.⁶ For 'the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, full of grace and truth; we have beheld his glory, glory as of the only Son from the Father. . . And from his fullness have we all received, grace upon grace.'⁷

424 Moved by the grace of the Holy Spirit and drawn by the Father, we believe in Jesus and confess: 'You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.'⁸ On the rock of this faith confessed by St. Peter, Christ built his Church.⁹

"To preach. . . the unsearchable riches of Christ"¹⁰

425 The transmission of the Christian faith consists primarily in proclaiming Jesus Christ in order to lead others to faith in him. From the beginning, the first disciples burned with the desire to proclaim Christ: "We cannot but speak of what we have seen and heard."'¹¹ It And they invite people of every era to enter into the joy of their communion with Christ:

That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked upon and touched with our hands, concerning the word of life - the life was made manifest, and we saw it, and testify to it, and proclaim to you the eternal life which was with the Father and was made manifest to us- that which we have seen and heard we proclaim also to you, so that you may have fellowship with us; and our fellowship is with the Father and with his Son Jesus Christ. And we are writing this that our joy may be complete.¹²

At the heart of catechesis: Christ

426 "At the heart of catechesis we find, in essence, a Person, the Person of Jesus of Nazareth, the only Son from the Father. . .who suffered and died for us and who now, after rising, is living with us forever."¹³ To catechize is "to reveal in the Person of Christ the whole of God's eternal design reaching fulfillment in that Person. It is to seek to understand the meaning of Christ's actions and words and of the signs worked by him."'¹⁴ Catechesis aims at putting "people . . . in communion . . . with Jesus Christ: only he can lead us to the love of the Father in the Spirit and make us share in the life of the Holy Trinity."¹⁵

427 In catechesis "Christ, the Incarnate Word and Son of God,. . . is taught - everything else is taught with reference to him - and it is Christ alone who teaches - anyone else teaches to the extent that he is Christ's spokesman, enabling Christ to teach with his lips. . . Every catechist should be able to apply to himself the mysterious words of Jesus: 'My teaching is not mine, but his who sent me.'"¹⁶

428 Whoever is called "to teach Christ" must first seek "the surpassing worth of knowing Christ Jesus"; he must suffer "the loss of all things. . ." in order to "gain Christ and be found in him", and "to know him and the power of his resurrection, and [to] share his sufferings, becoming like him in his death, that if possible [he] may attain the resurrection from the dead".¹⁷

429 From this loving knowledge of Christ springs the desire to proclaim him, to "evangelize", and to lead others to the "yes" of faith in Jesus Christ. But at the same time the need to know this faith better makes itself felt. To this end, following the order of the Creed, Jesus' principal titles - "Christ", "Son of God", and "Lord" (article 2) - will be presented. The Creed next confesses the chief mysteries of his life - those of his Incarnation (article 3), Paschal mystery (articles 4 and 5) and glorification (articles 6 and 7).

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[Elsie]

https://www.usccb.org/committees/catechism

[Elsie]

 

But the Roman Catechism can't agree with itself!!

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How the Catechism of the Catholic Church” now describes the “Petrine succession”:

881 The Lord made Simon alone, whom he named Peter, the “rock” of his Church. He gave him the keys of his Church and instituted him shepherd of the whole flock. “The office of binding and loosing which was given to Peter was also assigned to the college of apostles united to its head.” This pastoral office of Peter and the other apostles belongs to the Church’s very foundation and is continued by the bishops under the primacy of the Pope.

882 The Pope, Bishop of Rome and Peter’s successor, “is the perpetual and visible source and foundation of the unity both of the bishops and of the whole company of the faithful.” “For the Roman Pontiff, by reason of his office as Vicar of Christ, and as pastor of the entire Church has full, supreme, and universal power over the whole Church, a power which he can always exercise unhindered.”

883 “The college or body of bishops has no authority unless united with the Roman Pontiff, Peter’s successor, as its head.” As such, this college has “supreme and full authority over the universal Church; but this power cannot be exercised without the agreement of the Roman Pontiff.”

Sure different than what Augustine and many OTHER Early Church Fathers taught; isn't it

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That is ALSO different from what the CCC said earlier!

 

PART ONE
THE PROFESSION OF FAITH

SECTION TWO
THE PROFESSION OF THE CHRISTIAN FAITH

CHAPTER TWO
I BELIEVE IN JESUS CHRIST, THE ONLY SON OF GOD

The Good News: God has sent his Son

422 'But when the time had fully come, God sent forth his Son, born of a woman, born under the law, to redeem those who were under the law, so that we might receive adoption as sons.'¹ This is 'the gospel of Jesus Christ, the Son of God':'² God has visited his people. He has fulfilled the promise he made to Abraham and his descendants. He acted far beyond all expectation - he has sent his own 'beloved Son'.³

423 We believe and confess that Jesus of Nazareth, born a Jew of a daughter of Israel at Bethlehem at the time of King Herod the Great and the emperor Caesar Augustus, a carpenter by trade, who died crucified in Jerusalem under the procurator Pontius Pilate during the reign of the emperor Tiberius, is the eternal Son of God made man. He 'came from God',⁴ 'descended from heaven',⁵ and 'came in the flesh'.⁶ For 'the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, full of grace and truth; we have beheld his glory, glory as of the only Son from the Father. . . And from his fullness have we all received, grace upon grace.'⁷

424 Moved by the grace of the Holy Spirit and drawn by the Father, we believe in Jesus and confess: 'You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.'⁸ On the rock of this faith confessed by St. Peter, Christ built his Church.⁹

 

 

 

[Elsie]

And in every interaction we see between Jesus and people in the NT not once do we see Him offer His actual blood to consume as a requirement for salvation.

But didn't Doubting Thomas lick his fingers after plunging them into Jesus' side??

[Elsie]

..there is a problem with invisible particles falling or floating away...

I wonder what ever happened to that chunk of flesh mentioned in

Luke 2:21?

[Elsie]

Hair, fingernail clippings, baby teeth, swaddling clothes...

[Elsie]

“’What’s the difference between a liberal and a conservative?
A liberal will interpret the constitution, a conservative will quote it!’
~Rush Limbaugh

In a similar vein...

What’s the difference between a Catholic and a Protestant?
A Catholic will interpret the Bible, a Protestant will quote it!

[daniel1212]

JESUS MEANT WHAT HE SAID Except when He didn't: call no man father.

Actually that is not a good argument, since the Lord was using a form of hyperbole in condemning the love of titles of preeminence, as is the case with Catholic priests, but was not forbidding the factual use of the title "father," which, taken in an unqualified sense would exclude even natural fathers. But as it does not, thus Paul referred to himself as a spiritual father, who had "begotten" the Corinthian believers, (1 Corinthians 4:15) whereby Timothy was his "son" (1 Timothy 1:2,8; 2 Timothy 1:2) likewise Titus 1:4, and Onesimus (Philemon 1:10) and one who actually travailed in birth. (Galatians 4:19)

But what it rightly condemned is that of priests being called "Father" under the premise that they are spiritual fathers via the act itself (ex opere operato) of baptizing people, which provides souls with a false conception of themselves as being spiritual children of God, never having had a "day of salvation" of penitent, heart-purifying, regenerating effectual faith, (Acts 10:43-47; 15:7-9) which is imputed for righteousness, (Romans 4:5) and is shown in baptism and following the Lord, (Acts 2:38-47; Jn. 10:27,28)

And who will go to be forever with Him at death or His return (Phil 1:23; 2Cor. 5:8 [“we”]; Heb, 12:22,23; 1Cor. 15:51ff'; 1Thess. 4:17) In contrast to those who were never born of the Spirit or who terminally fall away. (Gal. 5:1-4; Heb. 3:12; 10:25-39)

[ealgeone]

You nailed it. When we see the actual Supper there is a clear meaning communicated. DO THIS IN REMEMBRANCE OF ME.