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To: Wpin; Wuli
"Refer to the Old Testament...and to the complete Bible not the shortened version you Protestants use. Your theology is incomplete because after 1,500 years one lunatic decided to correct God and remove some of His Bibl" Nonsense and ignorance. For in reality, scholarly disagreements over the canonicity (proper) of certain books continued down through the centuries and right into Trent, until it provided the first "infallible," indisputable canon  after the death of Luther.

Thus Luther was no maverick but had substantial RC support for his non-binding personal canon. Furthermore, the deuteros (incldg. 2 Mac. 12) does not teach Purgatory or most any of the distinctive Catholic teachings are not manifest in the only wholly inspired substantive authoritative record of what the NT church believed (which is Scripture, in particular Acts through Revelation, which best shows how the NT church understood the gospels). .

155 posted on 04/27/2021 9:10:42 PM PDT by daniel1212 (Turn to the Lord Jesus as a damned+destitute sinner, trust Him to save + be baptized + follow Him!)
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To: daniel1212

I think you don’t realize Purgatory is not a place. It is a process and you will not find the word Purgatory in the Bible, like the word Trinity it is a word used to describe.

In my opinion there are no true scholarly disagreements about Purgatory, there is reality as born out in the Old and New Testaments, not to mention Jewish faith. There is also no intellectual justification for removing substantial parts of the Bible. For one, there remains dozens of direct references to those books (the theology) removed. It is also incredibly ignorant to believe the Bible is divinely derived but that after 1,500 years so eone could remove substantial parts that didn’t conveniently fit his/their “theology”. Part of which includes the heretical Sola Scriptura” which basically is a belief that God is not necessary for salvation, one may simply read the Bible and be assured that whatever they dream of as interpretation is solid theology. This anti Christian belief has resulted in there being over 20,000 versions of Protestant theology. Does that really sound like God’s plan? The Catholic Church was begun by Jesus and there is a lineage known and recorded ftom the beginning to this day. Some of the greatest minds in world history have given their lives in developing a fuller, richer theology. No Church, no human entity has helped more people in terms of salvation, Healthcare, feeding, education, etc than the Catholic Church. One out of five individuals are Catholic...we have the traditions passed down literally from the time Jesus walked this earth. We have the Eucharistic miracles, the miraculous apparitions, etc. I am a convert, I was raised Protestant and love my Protestant background, but being led to Catholicism has been one of the most beautiful things God has given me. It is like finally coming home.


180 posted on 04/28/2021 5:16:50 AM PDT by Wpin ("I Have Sworn Upon the Altar of God eternal hostility against every form of tyranny...")
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To: daniel1212

I noted that in the link provided with your text:

“are not manifest in the only wholly inspired substantive authoritative record of what the NT church believed”

On the web page that link goes to, ere is a section:

http://peacebyjesus.net/deformation_of_new_testament_church.html#Development

which is a discussion of distinctive Roman Catholic development of its church hierarchy, and in there is mention how that development, contrary to scripture, kept placing “leader” (continuously) over and above “servant” and how servant (to the flock) is the scriptural mode assigned to the apostles and those who followed them.

And, in that regard, I know from some acquaintance with it, that in the RCA (Reformed Chruch in America) the themes of “servant leader” and “servant leadership” are frequently invoked in matters describing the role of the church organization and those in organizational roles.

That much they have retained from THEIR “traditions” going back to the Reformation movement from which they developed.

I have been with them (I worked for them for awhile), and observed and participated in large gatherings meant to bring folks together on some important matters. There are of course persons known to be in organization leadership roles, but after some opening comments, and some pertinent scriptural reading, and a pastors comments about it, and a period of prayer, the open discussion that followed had no “leaders” other than maintaining order of the discussion. EVERYONE’s statements were accepted with the same respect, and after a day of this the goal was NOT to vote, but to reach a consensus, that all, putting aside their own preferences and accepting that not everything can have priority, could agree to.

It was interesting to witness, as even I, in my first large RCA meeting, was brand new to all but a couple of individuals in attendance (but I had been made known to all of them before hand) yet no one questioned my commenting on anything. In large and small groups, leaders did have organizational roles, but in discussion no one was leader in the sense of above others, all were equal servants striving to do what was best.

My sojourn with them was not as long as they and I first planned, but on a personal level my experience with them was a good one.


196 posted on 04/28/2021 7:20:29 AM PDT by Wuli
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