Posted on 09/21/2020 8:27:49 AM PDT by ebb tide
Thanks. You've just indirectly, through Pius IX, convicted Bergoglio with abandoning his authority of the Roman Church.
The Francis has condoned adultery in Acta Apostolicae Sedis (Acts of the Apostolic See), the official collection of formal Vatican decisions and decrees. (Pope’s letter to Argentine bishops is magisterial teaching, Cardinal Parolin says
He has stated that evil souls don't suffer for eternity in Hell, they are just extinguished.
He has cosigned a document with a muslim imam stating God wills the plurality of religions.
The multiplication of the loaves and fishes was not miracle but an example of sharing.
That Jesus feigned anger with the moneychangers in the temple.
That the Blessed Mother despaired during her Son's Passion.
That atheists can go to Heaven.
That the communists have stolen the flag of the Christians.
I am Catholic and Vatican II and its offshoot masstrocity have no part in my faith or religious practice.
Yes, thank you for posting this Encyclical from Pius XI (as well as the link from NOW). If the general council, Vatican II, was promulgated and approved by a true Vicar of Christ, then it should "keep men professing Catholic truth". But it does not. Ergo....
Islam is a mixture of error and truth, the latter being where it’s beliefs about God are consistent with the Catholic Church. God may allow infidels to see some aspects of the truth and thereby be led ultimately to the true faith, as part of God’s plan of salvation. That is why we pray for those who do not believe in Christ separately from those who do not believe in God on Good Friday.
That statement is false. The muslims are aware of the Triune God of the christians and they outright reject that God.
I'm looking at a Catholic Mass missal published in 1954. It's Good Friday liturgy has four prayers for non-Catholics. They are in the following order:
For the Catechumens (the soon to be Catholics)
For the Heretics and Schismatics
For the Jews
For the Heathen
There is no prayer for the Muslims, so I consider the Catholic Church, at that time, considered them to heathen.
Here is the beginning of that prayer for the heathen:
Let us pray also for the pagans: that almighty God would remove iniquity from their hearts; that forsaking their idols, they may be converted to living and true God, and His only Son. Jesus Christ our God and Lord.
(emphasis mine).
Muslims are in error about the Trinity and the Incarnation, of course. They also believe the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob was the Creator of the universe, and is beneficent and merciful. That is congruent with Catholic belief. Please pray for more conversions to the true faith like that if Sohrab Ahmari.
I was talking about the ordinary form. You are correct that the older form covers both nonbelievers in God and Christ in the same petition. (Although I recall Chesterton saying Islam is a Christian heresy.) None of that disproves my point that one might have an inkling of the truth about God without the specific knowledge of the Trinity and the Incarnation. The Jews, and Aquinas on the philosophic proofs of God, for examples...
I just wanted to say that the date and time of your post is....weird.
But most muslims do have the specific knowledge of the Trinity and the Incarnation and they reject that God.
It's right there in their Koran:
Three Quranic verses may directly refer to this doctrine.4:171, 5:73, and 5:116.[1]
O People of the Scripture. do not commit excess in your religion or say about Allah except the truth. The Messiah, Jesus, the son of Mary, was but a messenger of Allah and His word which He directed to Mary and a soul [created at a command] from Him. So believe in Allah and His messengers. And do not say, "Three"; desist - it is better for you. Indeed, Allah is but one God. Exalted is He above having a son. To Him belongs whatever is in the heavens and whatever is on the earth. And sufficient is Allah as Disposer of affairs.
They have certainly disbelieved who say, " Allah is the Messiah, the son of Mary" while the Messiah has said, "O Children of Israel, worship Allah, my Lord and your Lord." Indeed, he who associates others with Allah - Allah has forbidden him Paradise, and his refuge is the Fire. And there are not for the wrongdoers any helpers. They have certainly disbelieved who say, " Allah is the third of three." And there is no god except one God. And if they do not desist from what they are saying, there will surely afflict the disbelievers among them a painful punishment. So will they not repent to Allah and seek His forgiveness? And Allah is Forgiving and Merciful. The Messiah, son of Mary, was not but a messenger; [other] messengers have passed on before him. And his mother was a supporter of truth. They both used to eat food. Look how We make clear to them the signs; then look how they are deluded.
And [beware the Day] when Allah will say, "O Jesus, Son of Mary, did you say to the people, 'Take me and my mother as deities besides Allah ?'" He will say, "Exalted are You! It was not for me to say that to which I have no right. If I had said it, You would have known it. You know what is within myself, and I do not know what is within Yourself. Indeed, it is You who is Knower of the unseen. I said not to them except what You commanded me - to worship Allah, my Lord and your Lord. And I was a witness over them as long as I was among them; but when You took me up, You were the Observer over them, and You are, over all things, Witness. If You should punish them - indeed they are Your servants; but if You forgive them - indeed it is You who is the Exalted in Might, the Wise.
Thanks, I should have said “specific belief”, not “specific knowledge”.
How so?
There is such a thing as “invincible ignorance”.
There’s no such thing as “invincible belief”.
The muslims are not excused of “invincible ignorance”. They know better.
Look at the date and the time! Weird.
No argument there. I said they were in error. I just said some of their beliefs about God are congruent with Catholic belief, and that might lead them to salvation if they embrace the true faith. I never said they were automatically saved as Moslems. My original point is that it is possible to interpret the Vatican II statements in an orthodox fashion, and that one does not necessarily have to interpret them in a heretical way.
Oh, I see. Not intentional...
I reject that argument. They are still trying to "interpret" VC II statements in an orthodox fashion for 55 years now and still can't do it.
And now we have rogue pope signing off, with an imam, a document declaring God wills the plurality of religions. All thanks to the Second Vatican Council.
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